Relative preformance

[Amen-Moses]

You definetly wouldn't get rid of Apple Care, as all the PC hardware comes with a 3 year to lifetime warranty with support.

Thanks for the belly laugh, you're very lucky to get a 3 month warranty on PC hardware let alone 3 years and if you build it yourself you get none at all as they will just claim you destroyed it during the build!

Amen-Moses

 

[Avid6eek]

Thanks for the belly laugh, you're very lucky to get a 3 month warranty on PC hardware let alone 3 years and if you build it yourself you get none at all as they will just claim you destroyed it during the build!

Of all the people here, you clearly know the least about what your talking about. Not everyone shops in pawn shops and garage sales as you appear to do.

In my comparisons I put the pricing of retail hardware, which does infact carry either a 3 or 5 year warranty. In the case of the memory and video card there is a lifetime warranty.

XP-64 running on AMD-64 systems is really very smooth and snappy to use, XP-32 on the same machine is really slow in comparison.

There's another quote that is so far off base I didn't even respond to it. Unless you are running a process that specifically benifits from the extra 64 bit registers, there is absolutely no difference between 32 and 64bit software on a PC with a 64bit capable processor.

 

[dtravis7]

On the AMD 64 with XP 64, I do notice a lot more overall Snap to it loading things, coping files and such. It's true though that 32 Bit applications will not be any faster at all.

But overall it seems more smooth.

 

[Amen-Moses]

Of all the people here, you clearly know the least about what your talking about.

Yeah, I only build computers for a living *** would I know? :dummy:

Amen-Moses

 

[Amen-Moses]

On the AMD 64 with XP 64, I do notice a lot more overall Snap to it loading things, coping files and such. It's true though that 32 Bit applications will not be any faster at all.

But overall it seems more smooth.

I concur, strange really that I get taken to task for actually saying something good about microsoft software. Much of the behaviour of an application is provided by the OS, this is the same whether you are talking about Windross, OS X or Linux so on all three a 64 bit OS will make a dramatic impact on the apps running on it regardless of whether they are 16 32 or 64 bit apps!

Amen-Moses

 

[Meyvn]

You can pwn, or be pwnd

Or pwnt.

Yeah, I only build computers for a living *** would I know?

I'm not accusing you of incompetence personally, but that's a bit of a ridiculous statement. Someone who has a known bias towards Macs but builds PCs for a living would be far more likely than anyone to overlook the positives of PCs. Not to mention: since when does doing a job mean you necessarily know anything about it in America?

For my part, I've given up trying to compare the hardware between the two systems for now. I just don't care enough. I'm running a 1.33 GHz G4 processor, and I am happy with its performance. I will be upgrading tomorrow to a 1.67 GHz, and will be thrilled with that. A 2.5 GHz Quad G5, or a 2.4 GHz Quad Opteron is so much more powerful than I will ever need that I could care less which one is better, in all honesty. The only real comparison I will ever concern myself with for now is how I like the OS and its software, which comes down at its very base to a matter of preference. Though many of us Apple users here could never imagine using Windows, either "again," or "in the first place," people like Avidgeek are proof that there are intelligent people who have tried both and prefer Windows. Apple makes computers for the users that want them, and Intel and AMD make processors for users that don't. There was never a need for any war. Merry Christmas.

 

[Avid6eek]

Yeah, I only build computers for a living *** would I know? :dummy:

As do I, as well as using them at home on a constant basis. As a PC enthusiest who's into overclocking and squeezing every last bit of power out of my system, I would think that I'd be much more familiar with how to get every drop of performance out of a system than someone who comes home to sit infront of a Mac.

 

[technologist]

Okay, I get $140 for 2GB of memory on the G5, plus $3649 for the system. That's $4019, with tax and shipping. Your $3903 Opteron needs a basic keyboard and optical mouse; say $35, another 512MB of memory to match the G5's stock memory, that's $45, plus a Windows license, $140 as you said...they're looking pretty even to me.

As for service...if you're going to add AppleCare, you'll need to add a support contract for your rig. Good luck getting anyone to support that.

 

[Amen-Moses]

As do I, as well as using them at home on a constant basis. As a PC enthusiest who's into overclocking and squeezing every last bit of power out of my system, I would think that I'd be much more familiar with how to get every drop of performance out of a system than someone who comes home to sit infront of a Mac.

To my right is an AMD-64 system running XP-64, built it myself. To my left is a Dual G5 PM, in front of me is a G4 iMac. In the other room is an eMac, upstairs another AMD-64 system (which I built myself) and a Mac Mini.

All of these machines are on and in-use. The last desktop PC I built was last week.

Behind me is a stack of EPIA in-car systems I've built waiting for customers.

I am hardly someone who "comes home to sit in front of a Mac"!

Amen-Moses

 

[Amen-Moses]

I'm not accusing you of incompetence personally, but that's a bit of a ridiculous statement. Someone who has a known bias towards Macs but builds PCs for a living would be far more likely than anyone to overlook the positives of PCs. Not to mention: since when does doing a job mean you necessarily know anything about it in America?

1) I've been building computers for over 30 years.

2) The first time I ever even used a Mac was three years ago.

3) How can actually complimenting XP-64 and it's performance on AMD-64 hardware possibly be construed as "overlooking the positives of PCs"?

4) What does America have to do with anything? It isn't the only country in the world you know! Anyhow if you noticed I purposefully quoted prices in US dollars because I went to the US sites for the quotes.

Oh and merry Xmas.



Amen-Moses

 

[Meyvn]

1) I've been building computers for over 30 years.

2) The first time I ever even used a Mac was three years ago.

3) How can actually complimenting XP-64 and it's performance on AMD-64 hardware possibly be construed as "overlooking the positives of PCs"?

4) What does America have to do with anything? It isn't the only country in the world you know! Anyhow if you noticed I purposefully quoted prices in US dollars because I went to the US sites for the quotes.

Oh and merry Xmas.


Amen-Moses

See, those are GOOD arguments as to why you might be an expert. I was just cracking a joke about how there's a lot of people at there who're bad at their job in this country. And yeah, Merry Christmas.

 

[Avid6eek]

Okay, I get $140 for 2GB of memory on the G5

For future upgrading I used 2x1GB modules as to leave the remaining 6 banks open for futre needs.

Your $3903 Opteron needs a basic keyboard and optical mouse; say $35

That doesn't make up for the $900 difference.

another 512MB of memory to match the G5's stock memory

Both systems were quoted with 2GB of memory....I don't know where your going with this.

As for service...if you're going to add AppleCare, you'll need to add a support contract for your rig. Good luck getting anyone to support that.

As has already been mentioned, each of the parts have their own service and warranties. Not as convenient as going to one company, but the longer warranty periods helps make up for that.

 

[technologist]

Happy holidays to you, Avid6eek. :mac:

 

[technologist]

My festivities concluded, I'll give my absolute last words.

1. From Amazon right now, I can get a quad G5 for $3300 minus a $200 rebate. Thirty one hundred dollars, delivered to my door. There is no way to get a comparable AMD system for that price, period. You can add options to make the G5 less appealing, but for $3100 the G5 delivers more bang for the buck.

2. AppleCare is a service and support contract, not a warranty. A support contract means
- You get diagnostic utilities, updated when needed
- You can, at any time during those three years, pick up a phone and talk to an AppleCare technician about any problems you have, and
- If something does go bad, that technician you talked to will arrange service and turn your case information over to the service people who will do the work. That's a long way from calling a parts manufacturer, persuading them to replace the part, and having to install it yourself.

 

[D3v1L80Y]

I will never understand how or why this happens....
The OP asked a question about performance differences between different G5 systems....

I see G5's of both model advertised on eBay in 1.6, 1.8, 1.9, 2.0 & 2.1 GHz at the lower end and was interested in their relative speeds as there is a big price difference.

....yet somehow, people have managed to turn it into yet another 4 page stalemate of a pissing match, pitting Windows PC systems agains Macs.
Hooray for all who participated in this pointless and totally useless discussion.

Happy Holidays to all!
:black:

 

[Amen-Moses]

I will never understand how or why this happens....
The OP asked a question about performance differences between different G5 systems....

And the poster indicated that they were already able to work out relative PC performances (I wish they'd write a book on the subject as I'm buggered if I can do that!) so it makes sense to give some idea of performance related to a PC baseline.

As always in these discussions it is the question itself which is at fault, you might just as well ask which flavour ice cream is the best.

In the end it comes down to what does the job better, if I'm editing Video or audio, burning DVDs, Photo-shopping or emulating nuclear explosions in real time (allright I made that last one up) I'll use the PowerMac G5, if I'm browsing the web, checking my email or doing my business accounts I'll use the iMac, if I'm playing Doom 3 I'll use the AMD-64. The best tool for the job in other words.

(Oh and I do actually have Doom3 for the Mac and it does play at full resolution and video settings on my BeastyMac but I still prefer to play it on the AMD-64 system, so much for me being Mac biased!)

So to actually answer the OP:

1) The Mini absolutely crucifies any comparable PC (i.e same form factor).
2) The iMac is awesome but you get what you pay for, the bigger the numbers the better performance iow.
3) The PMs ditto.
4) The laptops are suffering in comparison to similar spec PC solutions, why Apple allowed this to occur is anyones guess.

Amen-Moses

 

[D3v1L80Y]

And the poster indicated that they were already able to work out relative PC performances (I wish they'd write a book on the subject as I'm buggered if I can do that!) so it makes sense to give some idea of performance related to a PC baseline.

Actually, no they didn't. The OP merely stated what his PC setup was and that he felt it was faster than the Mini that was purchased for his father.

My current pc has an Athlon 2500+ cpu & 1Gb of memory if that helps. I bought my dad a Mac mini 1.25, which he loves. It does feel a lot slower than my pc though.

There was no mention or inferrence from the OP that the PC's performance came into play at all. That was brought into the discussion by others.
He merely stated what he intended on using his computer for:

My uses are web surfing, DTP, word processing, digital image processing and video processing.

There really was no need to bring Windows or PC's into this particular discussion. If he had actually asked the banal question of "how does a Mac match up to a Windows system, performancewise", then it would have been appropriate to bring in comments like the ones that ensued. But, he didn't....hence the reason this thread became another standoff for pages and pages.

 

[Amen-Moses]

Actually, no they didn't. The OP merely stated what his PC setup was and that he felt it was faster than the Mini that was purchased for his father.

Sorry, my bad, I was referring to the second post but I can see we had already derailed before then.

:dummy:

Amen-Moses

 

[Malcy]

Thanks D3v1L80Y,

I had watched with bemusement as the thread took on a life of it's own and raced off in a completely different direction.

I'm not sure that I am a lot further forward, I want any new purchase to last me for a decent amount of time. The sum of $2100 (UK price for a 20" G5 iMac with no upgrades) is a lot to pay for anything and then be disappointed with the performance.

I guess that I will have to grab a G5 at the Manchester Apple store for an hour (difficult as it is very busy) to see how it performs.

 

[Amen-Moses]

I guess that I will have to grab a G5 at the Manchester Apple store for an hour (difficult as it is very busy) to see how it performs.

John Lewis and PC world both sell Apple kit and usually they have several iMacs available to play with.

Amen-Moses