Just the facts...OSX Vs XP

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Mouse26

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I’m a recent Mac convert, having been in the market for a laptop and seeing no laptop PC being able to compete with the perfect mixture of battery life, processing power and sleek design of the 12” powerbook.

And I can tell you now that I don’t think I’ve ever been happier with a purchase, especially since I experienced such excellent customer service (Apple UK be applauded) and after sales support.

Having read this forum for a while though, I’m wondering just where the near fanatical Apple loyalty comes from? Admittedly no other technology firm has products which are as sexy as Apple’s. Whomever the designer of their products and even packaging is, he/she can surely take a good deal of the credit for Apple’s recent turn in fortune. The iPod is a thing of beauty…

Aside from looks though, with the event of XP, can anyone really give me a serious, non-emotive, fact-based argument for why Macs are better than PC’s?

To my mind, XP is as stable, not hugely memory intensive (a PC appears to run much more comfortably with lower memory than an Mac) and it’s range of software is vast compared to the Mac. Games run more impressively with lower systems requirements, there are more of them and they are much, much cheaper. Most peripherals are designed for PC’s, some don’t support Mac’s at all or have limited comparative functions (e.g. iSynch can’t do half the things with my P900 that I want it to.)

OSX is pretty yes, but XP features changeable themes which can make it look pretty much identical.

The only real bonus for owning a Mac would be those working with media such as video or graphics?

Don’t get me wrong, I love my Powerbook and when I’m on the go it’s a lifesaver both for work and entertainment, plus it just looks fantastic. But why would you choose a Mac as a desktop? I just can’t understand how the pros and cons could possibly swing in Apple’s favour?
 
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Security. From hackers, viruses (see that thread) and spyware/adware.

I also feel that OS X is still a bit more reliable. Not having a registry (or DLL's) still counts for something.

And the design goes beyond looks sometimes. Yes, there are pretty colors, but UI is not an afterthought on the Mac. It's more consistent, has better feedback, and is less awkward.
 
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wickedbusa

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I also agree with security. No hackers and viruses. Sure, PC's have more software, but people make it sound like there is no software out there for Mac's. Ever look at the programs for PC's? For example, look for a photo suite. How many are out there? With Apple, you have iPhoto built right in. They way I see it, there are more programs out there for PC's, but a lot of them are redundant. Aside from Office, I have not had to purchase any other software for my Mac, everything I need is already in it.
 
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Nightblade

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wickedbusa said:
I also agree with security. No hackers and viruses. Sure, PC's have more software, but people make it sound like there is no software out there for Mac's. Ever look at the programs for PC's? For example, look for a photo suite. How many are out there? With Apple, you have iPhoto built right in. They way I see it, there are more programs out there for PC's, but a lot of them are redundant. Aside from Office, I have not had to purchase any other software for my Mac, everything I need is already in it.

Don't forget that PCs have Office built-in, in addition to FrontPage, Access, and a few other applications. If Mac users want to make web pages, they have to buy Macromedia Studio (or, if they REALLY want to, they can use Microsoft Word, although Dreamweaver's much better), and if they want to make databases, they have to buy FileMaker Pro (or they can use Appleworks, but it's inferior).

Then again, Macs come with Garageband, iDVD, and a few other nifty applications where PC users do have to buy the equivalent. Still, making webpages and databases are more common for the average user than making band music or making DVDs.
 
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Nightblade said:
Don't forget that PCs have Office built-in, in addition to FrontPage, Access, and a few other applications. If Mac users want to make web pages, they have to buy Macromedia Studio (or, if they REALLY want to, they can use Microsoft Word, although Dreamweaver's much better), and if they want to make databases, they have to buy FileMaker Pro (or they can use Appleworks, but it's inferior).

Only some PCs have Office included as a bundle, and even then it might not be the "full" version of Office. "Basic Edition" doesn't have PowerPoint or Access. "Small Business Edition" doesn't inclue Access. (Some really cheap PCs only have Microsoft Works + Word) And I've never had a PC with FrontPage bundled.

(BTW, Mozilla Composer is a fairly good quick-and-dirty WYSIWYG web page editor...and it's free for Mac and Windows.)
 
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Nightblade said:
Don't forget that PCs have Office built-in, in addition to FrontPage, Access, and a few other applications. If Mac users want to make web pages, they have to buy Macromedia Studio (or, if they REALLY want to, they can use Microsoft Word, although Dreamweaver's much better), and if they want to make databases, they have to buy FileMaker Pro (or they can use Appleworks, but it's inferior).

Then again, Macs come with Garageband, iDVD, and a few other nifty applications where PC users do have to buy the equivalent. Still, making webpages and databases are more common for the average user than making band music or making DVDs.

I can make webpages that look and function just as good, if not better, in textedit (and BBEdit for that matter) than I can in Dreamweaver. TextEdit is built in, as is notepad on the PC (and TextEdit is much better). FYI, if I were to try to modify (or even open and format) the code of this site in Dreamweaver or any WYSIWYG editor, the site would become unusable very quickly. And you'd all probably want my head on a stake ;) Macs come with Apache ready to go (check a box and you're away), and PHP and mySQL preinstalled. It's a matter of spending a couple of seconds in the terminal to activate them (there's GUI tools you can download to do it for you). Web development is far more suited to the out-of-the-box mac than to any similar PC.
 
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MoltenLava

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I am a recent PC to Mac convert myself. The one thing that's not easy to quantify, nevertheless the most important feature of the Mac is the usability. I've switched to Mac because Panther is much more usable than Windows.

The stability was a factor when there was Win95 and OS9, but it's a history. All modern OS are just as stable. Moreover, stability was never a factor as far as end users are concerned. If it was, IBM OS/2 would have won long before Win95 came out. The reason OS/2 has lost is because it was not really usable. The reason Linux is only popular among the developers and power users are the same, it's not very usable.

Mac platform and OS being less susceptible to virus and adware is not really inherent advantage of Mac. It's rather a side effect of Mac not being a popular platform! You'll be surprised how many security holes are discovered and patched on modern Unix variants just like Windows. Hackers don't get as big of bragging rights writing MacOS virus than Windows virus, that's all.

Yes, Windows has come a long way. XP is certainly much more usable than NT and Win2000. But to me Panther is still a generation ahead in terms of usability.
 
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The mac 13

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there are tons of softwares!mac ppl aro pro ppls..so they buy standart things like lexmark rpinters. n lexmark have drivers for macs!
 
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The mac 13

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all those adware ppl don under macs..so they don have adwares for mac. virus is a prob.even steve jobs agree...but it is not a big one like windoze...office bui;t in?must b note pad which suxs...bu good for normal basic useage..for memor part, try running opera on anyversion using adsl modem at 1.13 ghz xp and 128 ram...c wat happens...mine suxs..for the game part like i say, macs r for pros...they don play games..even if they play games, they play gambling games!
 
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Mouse26

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The security thing I will grant you, but I agree with Moltenlava that the lower occurence of Mac viruses is simply because viruses are designed with hitting the most people, and that will be PC users. If Mac was the prevalent platform then I'd guess that alot more flaws in Mac security would be exploited. Is it really tested at the moment?!

The reason I asked the question in the question in the first place was that I am thinking of buying a new desktop, and was considering a G5. With all the evidence though I see no good argument why an Apple desktop is better than a PC. The design is miles ahead and the interface is more user friendly, but it's just not practical. You can just do more things more ways with a PC.

But having said that, when I come to upgrade my laptop, I'll almost certainly stick with Apples, in terms of portable office work and organisation (which I use it for), there's not a PC laptop that can touch it.
 
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" You can just do more things more ways with a PC."

I disagree: you COULD do a lot more things with a pc, but they're all difficult to do!

If i plug in my camera to my pc i get the files on a drive, my mac imports them to my photo library automatically. A pc COULD do the same, but it takes a bit of searching for the software and a bit of know-how to set up the automation.

I plug in an external soundcard for recording. My mac recognises it straight away and i'm recording.

My pc loads a hardware installation window and i am required to install drivers and reboot, THEN I'm recording...

Lets say i want to manage my address book on my pc, use it for mail contacts AND sync that to my mobile phone..(bluetooth or infrared..)

First i need a special driver for the supposedly built-in plug in and play infrared port. Then i need software to transfer data to the phone.

Then i need to export my contacts as vcards and then upload them manually to my phone. Tada i'm already done! Oh and your mail prog. probably uses a seperate address book where you have to import your contacts as well (see entourage)

Macs do so many things seamlessly, THAT's the advantage!

No hunting for drivers, bugfixes and tweaking tools (WITH exceptions!) most of the time, things play nice with each other! My phone likes isync, my address book likes mail and isync, my soundcard and camera like garageband and iphoto respectively....


It lets me work with the computer, not fight it all the time.
 
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Mouse26 said:
....can anyone really give me a serious, non-emotive, fact-based argument for why Macs are better than PC’s?

I am going to assume here that you are really asking the question, "Why is the MacOS better than the WindowsOS?", and if you want a fact, then here it is:

MacOS is not better than Windows and Windows is not better than MacOS.

I am sure there are some here who will undeniably become upset with that statement and do their best to discredit it, but what needs to be considered is this...
What OS or computer system a person chooses depends on their personal needs. Each OS/system has the same capabilities, there are just different ways to achieve them. It comes down to personal preference and opinion.
And opinions are not necessarily facts. The great Mac/Windows debate can be argued favorably for either side, each one having pros for itself and cons for the other. But in reality, there is no 'right' or 'wrong' OS.
I myself use computers with MacOS (OS9.2.2, OS 10.3.4), WindowsOS (98,ME, XP) and LinuxOS (Suse 6.2, Mandrake 7). While I may feel that certain functions perform better for me on each platform, it is personal preference. I am certain that if I put time, money and effort into each computer I own, I could uprgade hardware and software on each to make them perform virtually indistinguishable from each other, but I don't. It is easier for me to use each system as it is. Notice that it is easier for me, not for everyone.
So again, the answer to the question
....can anyone really give me a serious, non-emotive, fact-based argument for why Macs are better than PC’s?
I don't believe that anyone honestly can. They can only give their opinions, not facts. The bottom line is that one must make the choice on their own, according to what they plan to accomplish with their computer.
 
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D3v1L80Y said:
So again, the answer to the question I don't believe that anyone honestly can. They can only give their opinions, not facts. The bottom line is that one must make the choice on their own, according to what they plan to accomplish with their computer.

It's a fact that there are more commercial applications for Windows.
It's a fact that Linux is free.
It's a fact that there are more viruses and worms (and spyware) for Windows than for other platforms.

There is also lots of factual evidence to support some opinions. I'm of the opinion that Apple hardware is more reliable, on average, than the competition. I base this on evidence from
Consumer Reports and PC Magazine.

I also think OS X is more secure. I base this on evidence from mi2g.

On a slightly more whimsical note, there's factual evidence to suggest that Mac users are better educated and make more money than the average computer user.

I'm not, and have never, said that OS X is better than Windows. If it was, I might not ever have to use Windows. But Macs do have real, quantifiable advantages for some applications.
 
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The fundamental structure of the Unix OS has inherent advantages, and having no registry is truly a major advantage ;)
 
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d4rr3n

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technologist said:
There is also lots of factual evidence to support some opinions. I'm of the opinion that Apple hardware is more reliable, on average, than the competition.

I know i've said this before but, "apple hardware" is the same as "pc hardware" except for the cpu and motherboard everything is the same. I wonder how many of those pc's brought in for repair in the consumer reports listing were due to software problems like viruses and such.
 
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I am going to play Devil's Advocate here for a bit....keep in mind the original poster's question of "..why Macs are better than PC’s?"
(Let me also say that it is not my intent to start a flame ware here so before anyone takes this personally...well..don't :) )
technologist said:
It's a fact that there are more commercial applications for Windows.
This may be true, but does it mean that Windows has an advantage?
There is always VPC for Mac. Plus a large number of those commercial windows apps are redundant in that you can do the same thing with several different programs.

technologist said:
It's a fact that Linux is free.
And Macs are more expensive than Windows PCs. When does price necessarily indicate which OS performs better than another?

technologist said:
It's a fact that there are more viruses and worms (and spyware) for Windows than for other platforms.
This is also true. There are over 70,000 known malicious viruses for the Windows OS alone. There are 0 known malicious viruses for Mac OS X.
There are also several extremely effective anti-virus programs and software out there, as well as some very secure firewall software for Windows PCs. I have been running Windows XP Pro since about 4 months after its release and I have never had a problem with any worms, trojans, spyware, or other virus on my PC running that OS.
 
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Nightblade

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I'm actually gonna clarify a point I made earlier. No, FrontPage doesn't come bundled with Windows IF you have an operating system lower than XP. But from what three Grade 10s at school tell me, they all have FrontPage on their computer because it comes bundled with Office XP. I got into this conversation with them because in Grade 10 (which I'll be going into), in Business & Technology, we learn how to use FrontPage and then we have to design our own web pages using it. Now, the computers at school are running Windows 2000, so naturally the school had to buy FrontPage. But, I saw the finished product of their website on the computers at school, and it looked AMAZING! The teacher said she would actually give them 100%! And that's because, as they told me, they worked on it at home (using e-mail to transfer it back and forth, I presume), since Office XP comes with FrontPage and so they naturally have it on their computers. If I took the course, then naturally I would have to do all the work on the school computers.

Anyway, the point is, I'm almost positive that Office XP comes with FrontPage.
 
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I'm a recent switcher too, but have always been attracted to Apple before...just couldn't afford one ;-)
As IT Administrator, I know all MS OSes, from DOS to WinXP, and allthough I'm not a big MS fan at all, I have to admit that WinXP has become a grown up OS.
At home, I use a Mac, at work I use Win2k, and I administer also Win 9x and WinXP machines, at work and privately. I can say that there is really nothing a Windows PC can do witch a Mac don't. Only at a professional level there are some restrictions because of software that simply isn't available for Mac, like AutCAD or CATIA, for example.
WinXP has become pretty good, but nevertheless Mac OS X simply feels a lot better.

Just one big general advice for Win users: DON't use IE or Outlook for Internet and mails... Mozilla does those job just much better und much securer, no virus has been written to spread itself via Mozilla.

Windows still has it's registry that is easily messed up, (un)installing software/hardware is a task that has a variable easyness, going from incredibly easy to a big pain in the ass (sorry for the expression).

You can't generally tell that Macs are better, or PCs are better. It's generally a question of what you want and what you like. You can do everything with both, just that each one has it's specialities. Macs are still Nr1 for Musicians and professional Audio, and for Video editing. PC's with Windows are Nr1 if you want a gaming machine, the choice of games simply is bigger (if you have the very newest Graphic card, off course) and PC's with Linux are the cheapest and securest network servers.
But for any thing else, it's just a choice of taste and money...

As for myself, I'm really happy with my Mac, and I definitely won't switch back to PC. The community of Mac user is very friendly and (mostly) tolerant. I can understand why people love Macs, but I don't agree with too much fanatism.
Working on a Mac, for me, is simply much more pleasant and easier than with a PC, but we shouldn't forget that both simply are computer, and as somebody else already said, computers are tools as long as they work, and if they don't work anymore, they are just simply expensive paperweights.

But hey, a dead iMac or Cube is still a **** good looking paperweight, isn't it? :D
 
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D3v1L80Y said:
I am going to play Devil's Advocate here for a bit....keep in mind the original poster's question of "..why Macs are better than PC’s?"...

Well, if you take the original poster perfectly literally, then you're right. The word "better" is just to broad and vague. It's not falsifiable or quantifiable in any way. You can't wave a Better-o-meter over a computer and get a Betterness® reading to use as a comparison.

What I said was, there are real and often quantifiable differences between computer operating systems. These often constitute advantages for one OS over another. You can't say "My OS has fewer viruses, so it's Better®" or "My OS costs less, so it's Better®" But if you're worried about security, you might choose the former; if you're under a budget, you might choose the latter. Not because of some emotional attachment, or some all-encompassing standard of what's Better, but because the facts (and your judgement) led you to that decision.
 

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