Tired of Apple Screwing Over iOS Users Again And Again.

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@BondAMR

The Force-Restart action does depend on the age of the iPhone and its iOS.

Ian
I think this is the issue, my iOS doesn't have Force Restart.

@Raz0rEdge "hold down the power (side) button for about 5 or so seconds" - this is just a regular shutdown. And for your question; I have an iPhone 12 mini with iOS 17.2.1

@MacInWin "if Apple really was sabotaging iPhones" - I think what happens is, when Apple comes out with a terrible feature and there is much uproar about it then they will release a patch to fix their subterfuge.

Example the batterygate issue was alot of public pressure forcing Apple to patch fix it over. If there wasn't a public outcry then they wouldn't have done anything about it perhaps.

Another example is this right here, the new patch for iOS 18.4.1 for turning off Optimized Battery Charging as you and IWT described. Another poorly-thought-out feature that no one wanted or likes and Apple patching over it to fix it.

I can't upgrade now because I have no space. (I generally don't like upgrading which is why I still use Sierra daily across 3 MBP's) But for me to upgrade I'll have to factory reset then upgrade, reinstall everything and then 3 to 6 months down the road do it again because System Data ate up all the excess storage which I found doing the aforementioned. It's like trying to dig a hole in a swamp or quicksand. Is this progress, is there a better approach, can a hack fix it, am I missing out on a better cure?
 
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I can't upgrade now because I have no space.
You can always upgrade when you connect your iPhone with the USB cable to your "Trusted" PC, winOS or macOS.
 

Raz0rEdge

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I think this is the issue, my iOS doesn't have Force Restart.

@Raz0rEdge "hold down the power (side) button for about 5 or so seconds" - this is just a regular shutdown. And for your question; I have an iPhone 12 mini with iOS 17.2.1
That is not the case, all iPhones have it, it's just a matter of how you engage it. You need to hit the volume up and down buttons quickly and release and hold the side button.

When you do the see the power down indication, ignore it and keep holding the side button and the phone will restart with the Apple logo. It might take a few attempts to get it.
 

Rod


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I probably have the same number of apps as you, around 200 (how do you get the full accurate count?) but I don't have 12,000+ photos like yours, I have only 90 photos and I'm at the same 64 GB size as you are.
I have to correct you there, if you read my post carefully you will see I have 128GB. 63.82 is in use. As I said, "If I only had 64Gb storage I'd be full too." Your arguement that if you bought a new iPhone with more storage it would be used up by System Data is simply not true. I have had 3 iPhones in the last 5 years (one broke) and I have never had more (or less) than 128GB. My System Data as far as I can remember has never exceeded 5GB and I seldome go over half full as far as Storage goes.
 

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Why else would they secretly push update patches, at night, during sleep cycles, when the user has manually turned off automatic update features. Their guilt is shown right there.
If you were getting updates at night "secretly" then your iOS number would change. Yes, updates are performed at night (often) or whenever the iPhone is Locked, on a charger and connected to the internet (it states that on the page).

As you can see mine are turned off except "Security Responses & System Files" but thet can be turned off. If that's turned off you will only get Security Responses & System Files when you manually do an update.

IMG_0209.PNG

Where are all these people you refer to when you say "Nobody likes..." or, "'Optimized Battery Charging' to 80% that again no one at all likes or wants to have but can't turn off"? They're not on this forum.

Apple tends to respond to user wishes where possible, it's in their interest to do so, in iOS 18.4.1 this is how Optimised Battery Charging Settings look:

IMG_0210.PNG

As you can see you can turn it off.

So, I go back to my old argument, technology is technical and if you have an older model iPhone, running and older iOS you will have to tinker with it to get the most, or what you want, out of it. Changes made in newer models, often in response to users complaints will be absent.

If you've never had to perform a Forced Restart then you are one of the lucky ones.

Lastly, I know it's a bit outdated, maybe things have changed but I came across this article titled;

Why does the telegram app take 31gb or storage,?​


I hope it's not that hard on your storage.
 
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It might take a few attempts to get it.
oof, you are right, you have to do this like really really fast for it to work. I guess I wasn't fast enough earlier. But it didn't reduce my System Data unfortunately :(

@Rod well no I'm not getting any update patches. The first thing that I do when I buy an iPhone or download a new program to my OSX is that I shutdown all automatic updates while not online so it doesn't sneak in an update when it's first launched online.

Yeah Optimised Battery Charging Settings as in your photo is not on my iOS 17 so it must have been an updated patch (because users hated it) on iOS 18+ most likely. Telegram is a "hog" like someone else here said before. I just did the Forced Shutdown-Restart to no avail.
 

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I think this is the issue, my iOS doesn't have Force Restart.

Yes it does. I've set the Link to iOS 17, which is what you tell us you have. The article clearly tells you how to use Force Restart,


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I can't upgrade now because I have no space. (I generally don't like upgrading which is why I still use Sierra daily across 3 MBP's)
I feel the same as you about upgrading. However, there is a very strong case for you to upgrade one stage further to High Sierra. You wouldn’t see much difference in the OS itself, but you could run much more software than in Sierra (though obviously still much less than recent OS’s). One example: you could run Firefox 115 ESR as your browser, which is still supported.
 
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@MacInWin "if Apple really was sabotaging iPhones" - I think what happens is, when Apple comes out with a terrible feature and there is much uproar about it then they will release a patch to fix their subterfuge.
If you really do believe that, then why ever buy anything from them? Go get an Android and leave Apple behind.
 
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Yes it does. I've set the Link to iOS 17, which is what you tell us you have. The article clearly tells you how to use Force Restart,


Ian
yes I was successful in doing the Force Restart in iOS 17, I had to perform the action really, really fast to activate it. I wasn't making the motions fast enough before.
I feel the same as you about upgrading. However, there is a very strong case for you to upgrade one stage further to High Sierra. You wouldn’t see much difference in the OS itself, but you could run much more software than in Sierra (though obviously still much less than recent OS’s). One example: you could run Firefox 115 ESR as your browser, which is still supported.
yeah I think the same way as you, I subscribe to the maxim of - "if it ain't broke, then don't try to fix it" I have used High Sierra before and I only use Firefox but even with that last Firefox 115 ESR version it keeps hitting you with a browser update alert which I can't find to turn of. So now I'm using Waterfox G5.1.10 and it's a cleaner version than Firefox and I can turn off automatic updates and all the extensions are available.

I like Waterfox much more now than Firefox but the keep is the leftside vertical bookmarks tree index. It's a far, far superior layout than the top toolbar layout (which is still use for frequent bookmarks) but for deep-layered archived bookmarks, the vertical tree index is the best in my opinion.
If you really do believe that, then why ever buy anything from them? Go get an Android and leave Apple behind.
yes I firmly and truly do believe that and I'm definitely not the only one. I read a ton of complaints by other users about the same key problems I mentioned above. This is an Apple mgmt centric problem, not a user problem.

And I'm going to take your advice unfortunately and started shopping for a Chinese-made Android as I'm reading they are making the best Android phones now. If anyone compared a spec sheet of a Huawei vs an iPhone a Huawei crushes the iPhone on every metric. And since both of them are made in China what doesn't it matter than about the stigma of Chinese-made products... everything is made there anyways.

But what does that say about me; a devoted Apple customer for 18 years? I have 7 MBP's in all sizes, 1 MBA, 1 iPad, 2 iPods, 2 iMacs, 2 Mac Minis, 5 iPhones, plus whatever Apple add-on peripherals.

I would have to say that I am (or was) a very, very good Apple customer for them. So for Apple-dedicated me to go to their competitor must show that Apple has screwed up here, not me.

It's a shame because I hate the Android system, and I hate Windows. I refuse to use a PC so I'm going to stick with my OSX's across all my home platforms but for mobile - Apple has forced me to start looking for Huawei Android, and that's is just crazy. I never thought I would.

Now I will never buy another iPhone unless there was an installed manual button to clear cache on a new iOS. And even then I would wait a year later to make sure that Apple didn't insert a new scam to drive phone sales into that iOS. You failed me iOS, and that's truly sad. :(
 

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I hope you are satisfied with that solution but having had a few Android phones over the years I personally doubt it. Preloaded with Google's invasive software, complex system preferences, annoying prompts and the almost unavoidable subscription to the software developer (in my case Samsung) just to get the thing working...well, I could go on and on. I still get emails from Samsung years after I terminated my account. I remember it took me 2 days just to work out how to comply with the security requirements to erase the thing so I could give it to a friend. Even the now discontinued Windows phone was better then the 2 Galaxy's I had. The second one took me a week to setup even though I had already some experience from the first.🥺

PS. Don't get a cheap one their CPU speed is so slow.
 
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I hope you are satisfied with that solution but having had a few Android phones over the years I personally doubt it.
...well I won't be satisfied I tell ya' for sure. I had a Samsung Android back in 2017 and absolutely hated it. So I agree with you 100% but what can I do? Either phone platforms and I'm still suffering. "complex system preferences" was a thing I really hated. Android and Windows are far too complicated and layered when it doesn't need to be.

I always use dump email inboxes for any subscription sign-ups that don't matter to me so if they flood that email I don't care, I have like 100+ emails by now. My primary 1 or 2 emails are never submitted for anything unimportant. I think I'm skipping Samsung this time and going pure Chinese lol
 
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So I did a crash course on global phone sets last week, compared multiple models from 9 brands, even made an Excel comparison, watched videos, etc. to come up with my #1 choice based on my needs of a superior camera and video formats, RAM speed, storage, battery, (the basics).

For only $200.00 bucks, I think it is extremely hard to find something on the market that beats these 3 models, the ZTE Nubia Focus line, specifically the 2024 Focus Pro and 2025 Focus 2 & Ultra versions.

On every measurable metric these phones literally kick-ass regardless of price-point, competing with features of phones of $1,500 dollars. As I continue to struggle with my unwanted, uncustomizable iOS features of "Charging on Hold" and "System Data Cache" I believe I made a wise choice in my purchase.

Now I'll use my iPhone as a washed secondary with minimal retailer and taxi apps so if I drunkenly-loose it at a bar I won't care much since nothing vital will be on it anymore. Thanks to all for the discussion.

I bought the 2024 model here:

I will buy a 2nd 2025 model for dual filming:
 

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Well, it's "different horses for different courses" I suppose so I hope your choice suits your needs. At 73 I think I've tried most things at some time, I even had an Oppo phone at one point.
By far the easiest phone to "fix" so long as it's not mechanically broken is the iPhone. One click and your password is all that's necessary to erase and return to factory settings. Restoring as New or Restoring from local or iCloud backup can get you back to a "new" empty or original (as before) state. Try doing that with Android, I have an it's a PITA.

Your major issues with, "uncustomizable iOS features of "Charging on Hold" and "System Data Cache" were unusual to say the least but the charging issue was fixable, at least in the current iOS and the cache would have been emptied on erasure (Nuking). That was the odd one and I cant help feeling it was due to some application because neither I nor anyone else I've asked has much more that 2 GB of System Data Cache but it's clear that messaging apps are high on the list of culprits hence I suspect Telegram although both the Message app and Safari can use a lot. "
"Generally speaking, Other System Data can be a few gigabytes in size at first. Depending on how you use the iPhone, it can grow and shrink by several gigabytes over time."

The bloating problem comes into play if that change in the size of Other System Data continues on an upward trajectory. Over time, some users may see that their iPhone's System Data takes up a lot of space, possibly tens of gigabytes." This can occur because in the case of some third party apps iOS is unable to clear "unnecessary" cached data.


With native apps its easy;

Screenshot 2025-05-06 at 09.25.22.png

With others like the previously mentioned FaceBook and FB Messenger just deleting and reinstalling the apps can clear a massive amount of storage, even WhatsApp offers a Clear all Threads option.

At least you have considerably more storage on the Nubia and ZTE models but I fear that over time the same thing may happen and I'm not sure that the same options available on the iPhone will be available.

As for backing up a ZTE/Nubia it seems your only option is Google Drive involving 13 steps and possibly an upgrade in your Google drive storage plan;


As for an AI search on the ZTE nubia Focus Pro, well, I get this;

Issues with ZTE nubia Focus Pro​

The ZTE Nubia Focus Pro 5G has received some criticism regarding its camera performance. Users have reported that the focusing speed is slow, and video recording focusing can be problematic, often resulting in blurs as the camera tries to focus on objects. Additionally, the shutter speed is noted to be slow, causing objects to blur when in motion.
Another concern is the potential for the device to remain on its initial operating system, Android 13, without updates to newer versions. Some users have expressed doubt about whether the phone will receive updates to more modern versions of Android.
Overall, while the phone is considered a good choice in its class and offers features such as a high-resolution display, ample storage, and a powerful battery, these issues with camera performance and potential lack of software updates are notable drawbacks.
AI-generated answer. Please verify critical facts.

At the end of the day all portable communication devices come with their own challenges, I prefer the iPhone because of its overall quality and features plus I know how to "fix" its few problems. I can see no reason to have to re learn all that knowledge and for that reason I am unlikely to swap to a Windows PC or and Android phone.

I hope you have a better experience.🙏
 
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Try doing that with Android, I have an it's a PITA.
I never heard "PITA" before, but have figured it out, that’s funny lol yeah the "Charging on Hold" update from an originally bad idea is not available on my version of iOS yet since I don't like to update anything, I still can't because I don't have the space to do it because of my other "System Data Cache" problem so I'm in a Catch-22 there.

I would have to factory reset and reinstall which really is such a drastic move that it shouldn't even have to come to that measure just to get back some more space. So this game with client vs Apple of trying take back control over my own phone is what has pushed me away from iOS.

Yes, the application is Telegram since I never use Message nor Safari at all. But look right there, the fact that Safari causes this bloat problem and ALL the other browsers do not is another indication of erroneous behavior on the part of iOS coders to cause this "System Data Cache" problem. This is just not moral.

I also don't use Facebook, its Messenger, Instagram, WhatsApp, or any other Western app at all. And any Eastern app is minimal usage, virtually none. Eventhough some Eastern apps are installed I don't use them much and I shut down Background App Refresh for all apps, every app.

"The bloating problem comes into play if that change in the size of Other System Data continues on an upward trajectory." ...but I'm flatlined at the top maximum for 2+ years with no upward trajectory. I keep getting the popup and features become inoperable until I change the year ahead in the timestamp.

I've gone over every fix online on how to supposedly fix "System Data Cache" and none of them work besides the nuclear option of reset which I haven't done. Whatever amount of space that a user claws back is then easily eaten up again by the cache in a matter of days so you are right back to where you started.

For backing up my phone, (to avoid System Data popups) I've become so accustomed now to moving any photos or video over to my computer via Image Capture within' days so I don't have alot of data on my phone as is.

I don't use Google Drive. I omit myself from using any of the usual Western styled apps like Gmail, Chrome, Safari, the other aforementioned. I use lean, slimmed down program versions with turning off automatic update controls like Waterfox and Chromium.

Almost all of my programs on my OSX Sierra(s) are older versions were I shutdown automatic updates and I have absolutely zero limitations on any functionality whatsoever. Once in a great while, like 1% of the time I may have a website navigation problem in Waterfox whereby I switch Brave to see it, but its rare.

The "if it ain't broke, don't try to fix it" maxim really does apply here. I have live by this creed for 15+ years of avoiding updates on everything at all costs and it has never, never compromised any of my systems.

About the ZTE Nubia, I’ve watched many YouTube videos and reviewers are so critical about every little minute thing it’s like they are comparing the phone camera to a DSLR. I’ve watched their shot photos and videos and they look great to me.

"Another concern is the potential for the device to remain on its initial operating system, Android 13, without updates to newer versions. Some users have expressed doubt about whether the phone will receive updates to more modern versions of Android." ...to me that's a huge bonus and not a drawback at all that I didn't even know about, so thank you for that info :)

Thank you for your nice words. I hope to have a better experience than I had with the Samsung Galaxy ‘POS’ I had many years ago. But you know, if Apple didn’t play these sabotage games of hindering and harboring customer devices to push more phone sales (and yes, I truly believe this to be so) then maybe I would have been looking to make my 6th iPhone purchase. But iOS has lost me now forever. I’m tired of being a victim of their cosplay subterfuge. But I will stick with OSX until the end of time.
 
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I found, and posted this the other day:

If you need more space when updating wirelessly​

If a message asks to temporarily remove apps because the software needs more space for the update, tap Continue to allow apps to be removed. After installation is complete, those apps are automatically reinstalled. If you tap Cancel instead, you can delete content manually from your device to add more space.

From here, Update your iPhone or iPad - Apple Support
 

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