Here's what i think...

[Xer0]

Apple computers are for people who are style consciouse, and task orientated. The G5 is a wonderful piece of technology... that certainly performs well against Wintel solutions. But with that said, the lead is marginal - with AMD's Athlon 64 FX about to be released at 2Ghz this month ending, and solutions from Chipset manufacturers like VIA, Asus, NVIDIA, Samsung etc. The lead will be greatly short lived.

The Problem with Apples, before the the G4 line was the fact that they were expensive to upgrade with extremely limited hardware support.

The G4 has changed that... and the introduction of the G5 acrhitecture has taken given Apple a significant speed boost that is now comparable with todays PC technology.

BUT just how scaleable is the G5?

We all heard the G5 will ramp up to 3Ghz Q4 2004, but by then the PC architectures will be using 4Ghz and maybe even 5Ghz CPU's with 64-bit technology. [ Have you heard of
Yamhill? ]

And what about AMD's solutions for the PC line?
[ Hypertransport can be seen in the technical specifications of the G5 but AMD is nowhere mentioned ]

Also, the fact that Windows based computers are more open to attacks, due to it's substantial market share and populairty [ yes popularity due to it's massive driver and developer support ] - wouldn't Apple also suffer from this - if positions were reversed?

The way i've seen it in this forum here today, i've seen many biast arguments on MAC and Windows fans sites, and this is what i think...

Anyone can buy a PC for as little as $400, but with Apple - your looking at $$. Furthermore, Apple's support for it's own products are extremely limited [ OS9 etc ] and depend on developers like M$ for office productivity software...

Why do Apple users even bother using Windows emulators if the reason they switched from PC to MAC was for the 'experience' as some of them claim?

I think PC's are wonderful technology... and the pace at which they develop is far more staggering than MAC's - i guess thats why Apple adopted some PC architecture with the introduction of G4 and G5. Also, if i wanted to play the latest computer game like Half Life 2, Doom 3 or Duke Nukem Forever - i wouldn't be waiting Forever on the PC.

Just why do most developers produce applications for the PC if the MAC is so superior? I must admit Windows XP is a rip-off of the OS-X GUI, but it holds it's own by staying traditional and familiar.

But i'm sure your all aware that Longhorn won't be just a simple tweak of the Windows O/S. Were going to see some major changes with Longhorn, and it might just be Apple ripping off windows 3D interface when it come's to release [ although i wouldn't hold my breath as it wouldn't be so obviouse ]

I'm a PC user, and always have been... but i can see myself switching to a G5 solution very soon now. NOT because i am unhappy with my PC's - but because they have grown more than simple tools for word processing etc... to highly distracting environments with soo many functions.

I am making my switch to Apple G5 because, i believe that is where i can be more productive without the constant security updates, games and chat clients taking me astray from my work.

Why the G5?

Because switching to a G4 solution would feel, just too slow

 

[Murlyn]

I will respond to some of what you say since the other points, either I do not know enough about it to respond, or I agree.. you pick which

with AMD's Athlon 64 FX about to be released at 2Ghz this month ending, and solutions from Chipset manufacturers like VIA, Asus, NVIDIA, Samsung etc. The lead will be greatly short lived.

Of course.. this is the way of the Personal Coputer industry.. but it is nice to have the lead for awhile..

We all heard the G5 will ramp up to 3Ghz Q4 2004, but by then the PC architectures will be using 4Ghz and maybe even 5Ghz CPU's with 64-bit technology. [ Have you heard of
Yamhill? ]

I am quite curious as to whether or not the Ghz battle is still the same one as that has been going on for years.. as in.. that between the two processors a 2Ghz Mac is a whole lot faster than a 2Ggz PC due to architecture differences..

Also, the fact that Windows based computers are more open to attacks, due to it's substantial market share and populairty [ yes popularity due to it's massive driver and developer support ] - wouldn't Apple also suffer from this - if positions were reversed?

Yes, but I also think that due to the mac's backbone, which is, correct me if I am wrong, the most secure *nix out there. They are much better and updating any vulnerabilities, etc etc.. but yes indeed Macs would have more hacking attempts, more viruses, etc etc..

Anyone can buy a PC for as little as $400, but with Apple - your looking at $$. Furthermore, Apple's support for it's own products are extremely limited [ OS9 etc ] and depend on developers like M$ for office productivity software...

Microsoft does not support it's older OS's either.. plus they keep changing what is under the hood, and will continue to do so thus causing serious problems with upgrading. Same as when Apple changed to OS X, although they did supply Classic which was a very user friendly touch. And no there are many applications out there that we can use instead of M$ products.. Many people just choose to use M$ products because either that's what they know or that's what the PC's use that they share files with.. interoperability... There are also converters out there that can convert to Office files, but it adds another step.. and you know.. most computer users are just too lazy

Why do Apple users even bother using Windows emulators if the reason they switched from PC to MAC was for the 'experience' as some of them claim?

For a couple of reasons.. 1) they have a hard time getting away from the PC completely.. humans have a tendency to grow fond of things that they know.. even if it is bad for them.. they know it.. it fills familiar so they continue doing/using/eating etc whatever it is. 2) sometimes there are programs on the PC that are not on the Mac so they want to have the option to be able to use it. 3) The most important.. is that even though there are quite a few PC users out there that would love to use some of the Mac software.. they just do not have that option.. well us Mac users.. we do have that option.. with one computer we can get the Mac experience.. we can get the *nix experience.. we can get the PC experience.. Why not then?

I am not an advocate for narrow mindedness.. explore, research, decide for yourself what you like better, what works for you, etc.. do not bash a computer platform, a person, a government etc if that is all you know.. PC's have some great options. they are cheaper.. there are many good things, but if you are a mac user and that's all you know, and even if you don't, keep your mind open and experience life/computers/people with an open mind and you'll see benefits to all of them.. do not close your mind just because it's not what you know. When I say 'you', 'your' etc I do not mean you personally I mean anyone, everyone.. myself included. I find myself putting down PC's etc just because I love my mac, because I love the experience, but they are tools and just like food.. we all have different requirements, desires etc.. what is best for me might not be best for the next person..

I think PC's are wonderful technology... and the pace at which they develop is far more staggering than MAC's - i guess thats why Apple adopted some PC architecture with the introduction of G4 and G5. Also, if i wanted to play the latest computer game like Half Life 2, Doom 3 or Duke Nukem Forever - i wouldn't be waiting Forever on the PC.

If I was a game developer I would want to make money.. just like every person out there.. one way of doing that is creating a product that people would want to purchase.. now would I create for the mac which has something like 2% of the market or create for the PC which has something like 95% of the market? it's pretty obvious.. It has nothing to do with the OS at all.. the reason we are seeing a lot of these games coming to the Mac is because they developer see some huge potential.. maybe not in the users, but in the architecture.. they have more to work with and would love to try it out and see how it does.. the Mac is most definitely a gaming machine.. it's just going to take time and market share to really influence companies who are out to make some money.

Just why do most developers produce applications for the PC if the MAC is so superior? I must admit Windows XP is a rip-off of the OS-X GUI, but it holds it's own by staying traditional and familiar.

Your answer is above.

But i'm sure your all aware that Longhorn won't be just a simple tweak of the Windows O/S. Were going to see some major changes with Longhorn, and it might just be Apple ripping off windows 3D interface when it come's to release [ although i wouldn't hold my breath as it wouldn't be so obviouse ]

I am really not sure on this one.. I've read so many things that I am beginning to wonder if they really even have anything to show at this point.. or if they are even working on it! It's shrouded in mystery.. and I hope, for the PC users sake, that the "awesomeness" of longhorn is not just a bunch of smoke and mirrors.. it'll be interesting to see where the Mac OS will be by the time Longhorn comes out.. Is it still slated for 2005?

I am making my switch to Apple G5 because, i believe that is where i can be more productive without the constant security updates, games and chat clients taking me astray from my work.

Amen to that! Although.. there are a lot of games and chat clients for the mac.. watch out!

Anyways I appreciate your insight.. I was a PC user way before I was a mac user.. and then I went to Classic, but it couldnt do everything I needed so I had to use both a PC and the Classic Mac to accomplish my goals. Once OS X came out.. I was able to completely leave the PC and have not looked back since. I have friends and family who use PC's and they are constantly having problems.. crashing, hardware problems, etc etc and Im always trying to help get them out of whatever problem they are having this week.. since hey I know a decent amount about PC's and can help them. But at the end.. I usually say.. you should get a Mac.. you wouldnt have those problems.. and they wouldnt either.. they might have other ones though. Because who can account for what a newbie can do to a system

Thanks again for your insight and I would love to hear how your experience with the G5 goes after you've had it for a couple of months. I wonder how the new OS is doing also.. whether they have lots of bug fixes or if it runs like a well-oiled machine..

Cheers!

 

[Murlyn]

I just realized this was a cross post so I am closing this thread and here is the link to go to the previous thread. Cheers! oh and please do not post to more than one thread with the same message Thanks!

http://www.mac-forums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8420