Disk under Container disk deemed and unmounted, no permit to delete files on my Macbook pro

[mal function MacBook Pro]

Not sure since which os there is a container disk created by the system and can't be deleted. Then 2 disks under that container, the first one from time to time shows deemed and unmounted, and I, as the owner of this Macbook pro, do not have any acknowledgement as to why and how it was unmounted, neither can I mount it. I also from time to time lost permission to make changes to files on this machine.

Does this mean Apple can take over full control of these new machines? take all the data whenever? if the main disk of a computer is out of the owner's control, then you don't actually own this machine. Am I wrong?

Anybody knows how to fix this? Can we get rid of the Container disk which we don't have control over, and just have 1 disk like before in the old days? we can do partition at any time if needed, and have full control and access to the entire drive and machine, can we?

By the way, it would be much easier to show the problem if we can easily upload an image here.

Thank you very much!

 

[IWT]

A warm welcome to Mac-Forums. Here are some answers and questions too.

Not sure since which os

If your Mac is acceesible at all, Click on the Apple icon , top menu bar, far left. From the dropdown choose "About This Mac". That will open a small window which tells you exactly which Operating System (OS) your Mac is running.

Does this mean Apple can take over full control of these new machines? take all the data whenever? if the main disk of a computer is out of the owner's control, then you don't actually own this machine. Am I wrong?

No, no and again, no. Apple cannot take control of your Mac. There is a problem with the Mac which we will try to sort out.

Can we get rid of the Container disk which we don't have control over, and just have 1 disk like before in the old days?

NO! Don't try to delete the Container or partition anything. Leave what is there alone, please.

it would be much easier to show the problem if we can easily upload an image here.

Easily done. Take a screenshot of anything you want us to see. I use Command + Shift + 4 ) all three held down, then holding down left click to place the cursor where you want to start and drag it open to include the area you want.

As screenshots are saved to the Desktop by default, there are easily found. The format is png. I find it best to use Preview app to convert to a JPEG.

You may wish to adjust the size as well. Then Click on the picture frame at the top:


As shown by the red arrow. That will open a box with words "Insert Image Here". Drag the image into the box.

Now show as much as you can. For instance, what you see when you open Disk Utility. That will show all your Drives. Make sure that under "View" at the top that it "Show All devices".

When you've done that, we'll take it from there.

Ian

 

[MacInWin]

If this is what you are seeing in Disk Utility, it is normal:



To explain the image, the top line is the hardware, an Apple SSD
On that SSD is one container, named "disk3"
In that container is one volume, named "Macintosh HD" which has multiple volumes under it.
In that volume are two other volumes, one named "Macintosh HD" and the other "Macintosh HD - Data"
There is also a snapshot of Macintosh HD stored there.

So, what are these things? Well, the greyed out Macintosh HD is the system drive. It is greyed out because the security of macOS prevents anyone, including you as the owner, from writing to that volume. It contains the signed and sealed version of macOS that Apple has certified as being "correct" and exactly as Apple designed it. The snapshot is a copy of that signed and sealed volume and is the version of the OS that is actually running the system. It is verified at boot time from the signed and sealed volume. As the system boots, the snapshot volume is checked for integrity by comparing it to what Apple knows is the "correct" version in the signed and sealed volume and if it is good, the system boots from the snapshot. If it's not correct, the boot stops to let you know the system is compromised and allows you to create a new snapshot from the signed and sealed volume.

Apple made it that way to prevent bad actors from being able to take control of your operating system to install anything to harm you (Spyware, trojans, viruses, other malware).

The volume named "Macintosh HD - Data" is where YOUR data is stored, as well as all other users you have created. It is NOT greyed out because you (and the other users) can read/write to that container.

So, to get to your concerns, it is your system, but you cannot directly change the operating system components. Nor can any bad actor. Or Apple, unless you allow it. Apple will only make changes to the greyed out Volume if you install system updates. The updates will be installed to that greyed out area and the volume again locked. It is also encrypted. Both of those actions are to protect you from malware.

So, bottom line: You cannot change the greyed out volume. If you change the snapshot, you may corrupt the system there and be blocked from booting unless you allow the system to rebuild the snapshot. You can do what you want with the Data volume.

If you boot from some external source and then mess with either of the system volumes, you will render the Mac unbootable and be forced to reinstall the OS, which will recreate the system as it shows in the image I posted.

 

[ferrarr]

Great explanation @MacInWin.

@mal function MacBook Pro, what Mac are you having this issue on?

 

[Lifeisabeach]

Going way off on a tangent here, but it cracks me up that Apple still labels these drives as "HD" for "Hard Drive" when they are universally SSDs now.

 

[ferrarr]

Going way off on a tangent here, but it cracks me up that Apple still labels these drives as "HD" for "Hard Drive" when they are universally SSDs now.

I agree.

I changed the drive name to macOS ID (internal drive) about 3 months ago. Even though I installed my SSD awhile back.

 

[mal function MacBook Pro]

If this is what you are seeing in Disk Utility, it is normal:

View attachment 36531

To explain the image, the top line is the hardware, an Apple SSD
On that SSD is one container, named "disk3"
In that container is one volume, named "Macintosh HD" which has multiple volumes under it.
In that volume are two other volumes, one named "Macintosh HD" and the other "Macintosh HD - Data"
There is also a snapshot of Macintosh HD stored there.

So, what are these things? Well, the greyed out Macintosh HD is the system drive. It is greyed out because the security of macOS prevents anyone, including you as the owner, from writing to that volume. It contains the signed and sealed version of macOS that Apple has certified as being "correct" and exactly as Apple designed it. The snapshot is a copy of that signed and sealed volume and is the version of the OS that is actually running the system. It is verified at boot time from the signed and sealed volume. As the system boots, the snapshot volume is checked for integrity by comparing it to what Apple knows is the "correct" version in the signed and sealed volume and if it is good, the system boots from the snapshot. If it's not correct, the boot stops to let you know the system is compromised and allows you to create a new snapshot from the signed and sealed volume.

Apple made it that way to prevent bad actors from being able to take control of your operating system to install anything to harm you (Spyware, trojans, viruses, other malware).

The volume named "Macintosh HD - Data" is where YOUR data is stored, as well as all other users you have created. It is NOT greyed out because you (and the other users) can read/write to that container.

So, to get to your concerns, it is your system, but you cannot directly change the operating system components. Nor can any bad actor. Or Apple, unless you allow it. Apple will only make changes to the greyed out Volume if you install system updates. The updates will be installed to that greyed out area and the volume again locked. It is also encrypted. Both of those actions are to protect you from malware.

So, bottom line: You cannot change the greyed out volume. If you change the snapshot, you may corrupt the system there and be blocked from booting unless you allow the system to rebuild the snapshot. You can do what you want with the Data volume.

If you boot from some external source and then mess with either of the system volumes, you will render the Mac unbootable and be forced to reinstall the OS, which will recreate the system as it shows in the image I posted.

Thank you very much, this is the most detailed explaination of the new multiple disks puzzle on the Macbook pro so far I have found online. So what do you think about the permission issue I have from time to time? The pop up message saying I don't have the permission to it. I mostly do photo and video editing, they are all my files, why is that I don't have permission to it?
Thank you again very much.

 

[mal function MacBook Pro]

Oh also, 2015 version Macbook Pro, OS is Mac Big Sur, 11.6.7 just updated last week.

 

[MacInWin]

Thank you very much, this is the most detailed explaination of the new multiple disks puzzle on the Macbook pro so far I have found online. So what do you think about the permission issue I have from time to time? The pop up message saying I don't have the permission to it. I mostly do photo and video editing, they are all my files, why is that I don't have permission to it?
Thank you again very much.

You may have to give an app permission to write to the drives that you have access to yourself. To do that, you can go to System Preferences/Security & Privacy, then on the Privacy tab, click the lock icon on the bottom left and provide an admin password (probably your own password will do). The in the left hand side window scroll down to "Full Disk Access" and click it. The right window will now show drives that have access to write to your drives. Click on the "+" and add the app that reported the permission problem to the list. You can then repeat that process for "Files and Folders" to make sure that app has access it may need. That should sort out the access issue. You may need to repeat this process each time the error message appears until all of the apps you have that don't have permissions gain permissions they want or need.