A supposedly bootable drive not showing on opening screen

[pm-r]

Right. But my aim was to use the Fantom as the Carbon Copy Cloner backup drive that I could boot from if the internal drive failed. And I can't do that if the Fantom does not show up as a boot drive choice on startup.

You could do that with doing an extra boot using Recovery HD and select the boot drive there as I believe someone already suggested as a possibility.

But what Ian states is also critical any yo need to check, but I gather it will act as a boot drive as it exists.

Maybe Fantom drives don't act or work normally with Macs???




- Patrick
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[Slydude]

@Mark F before going too far down the rabbit hole I would try cloning the drive again using CCC. I've been using CCC for years but I have had one or two instances where the cloning process failed for reasons I never did figure out. Of course, you'll want to set the drive as HFS+ Extended Journaled and GUID partition type.

Check the settings in your version of CCC to make sure that it understands that you want a clone.

 

[Mark F]

IWT, you do understand the situation, but let me summarize it again. The Fantom drive is not an ssd drive, is formatted Max OS Extended (Journalized) and GUID. I use it for CCC backups and would like to have it a bootable disk in case my internal drive fails.

If I make the Fantom drive the startup drive in System Preferences, my iMac will boot from it. But if the internal drive is the startup drive and I restart holding down the Option key, the Fantom drive does not show up as one of the possible startup drives. So I would not be able to boot from it if my internal drive fails. It is possible that Fantom drives have a hardware incompatibility but their tech support says that is not the case.

CCC is set to Clone, copy all files. I do not know what a booable installer is and could use some guidance on that, but if CCC also works, I'm guessing the bootable installer would not help either.

Again, I thank all of you for your time and suggestions.

 

[pm-r]

CCC is set to Clone, copy all files. I do not know what a booable installer is and could use some guidance on that, but if CCC also works, I'm guessing the bootable installer would not help either.

Maybe these could help and give you some suggestions or solutions:

Bootability comes down to a few simple rules:

The hard drive enclosure must support booting a Macintosh (applies to external hard drives only).
The computer must support booting from the interface used to attach the hard drive (e.g. USB, Firewire, Thunderbolt).
The computer must support booting from the hard drive's partition format (e.g. GPT vs MBR).
The cloned filesystem must have all the required components of macOS.
The cloned operating system must be properly "blessed".

https://bombich.com/kb/ccc4/what-makes-volume-bootable
https://bombich.com/kb/ccc5/what-makes-volume-bootable
https://bombich.com/kb/ccc4/help-my-clone-wont-boot

Check for these possibilities if you can't see your disk in Startup Disk preferences or Startup Manager, or your Mac won't start up from it.

If you can't select your startup disk or start up from it
https://support.apple.com/en-ca/HT202796




- Patrick
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[Slydude]

If I'm understanding the thread correctly the enclosure, interface, and partition type are not likely to be the issue since the drive will boot if he selects it in the Startup preference pane. I still suspect that something did not clone exactly correctly. Might be worth another try.

 

[ferrarr]

Why not try a new install to the drive/enclosure?

 

[Mark F]

If I'm understanding the thread correctly the enclosure, interface, and partition type are not likely to be the issue since the drive will boot if he selects it in the Startup preference pane. I still suspect that something did not clone exactly correctly. Might be worth another try.

Well, I followed an earlier suggestion and cloned from a currently bootable CCC backup drive directly to the Fantom drive, but the same result. The Fantom drive (destination drive) does not show up when restarting holding down the Option key, but the source drive does. At this point I'm about to give up unless someone knows some special incantation to bless the drive.

Once more, thanks to all for your time and suggestions.

 

[ferrarr]

Let me ask you this, in Disk Utility, do you have View > Show All Devices, selected? If so, what device are you selecting, to format/partition the FusionHD? Screen shot maybe?

You need to select the Disk, not the partition, to properly format the internal drive. Here's mine,

&

 

[chscag]

Well, I followed an earlier suggestion and cloned from a currently bootable CCC backup drive directly to the Fantom drive, but the same result. The Fantom drive (destination drive) does not show up when restarting holding down the Option key, but the source drive does. At this point I'm about to give up unless someone knows some special incantation to bless the drive.

Once more, thanks to all for your time and suggestions.

I believe the drive is either not compatible or there is something about it (perhaps hidden software) that's keeping it from being shown as a boot option. Obviously the drive will boot under certain conditions as you have already stated.

I would try to return the drive for a refund if possible. If that's not possible, perhaps you can use it for data storage, however, I would not continue using it for a CCC clone with the hope that it can be used in an emergency to boot from.

 

[pm-r]

And of course, there's always some gold old advice hanging about:
How to Reformat a New External Hard Disk
https://tidbits.com/2009/05/28/how-to-reformat-a-new-external-hard-disk/

I'd be inclined to do this again, yes all existing data will be erased, and then run CCC again to make a clone backup, and make sure the CCC version is capable.

CCC v. 4 should work from Mavericks to High Sierra with that Fantom HDD.




- Patrick
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[Rod]

I think this has just been said but all and any EHD's I use for backups or bootable sources I first erase them using Disk Utility to erase the volume itself and re partition it with the same format and mapping scheme to ensure all manufacturer pre installed data is gone such as built in security programs.
Oh and I think this was mentioned way back, if you elected to clone the Recovery Partition as part of the CCC cloning process this should also be visible as a startup option if the Option key is pressed on startup.

 

[pm-r]

I think this has just been said but all and any EHD's I use for backups or bootable sources

Still worth repeating Rod.




- Patrick
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[Jaiman]

I'm not familiar with Carbon Copy Cloner. But This is what i'll do to get what you want.

-format the external hdd to OS X Extended Journaled or AFPS
-create two partitions, one for OSX and one for your data. say 100GB and 900GB.
-Install OSX on one partition
-setup the second partition as a time machine backup

With this you can boot from the external HD and browse the files on the time machine partition in case you need to.

Right. But my aim was to use the Fantom as the Carbon Copy Cloner backup drive that I could boot from if the internal drive failed. And I can't do that if the Fantom does not show up as a boot drive choice on startup.

 

[Slydude]

I've done this in the past but don't recommend it anymore for the following reasons:

1. On newer versions of OS X, including the one Mark is using, one can boot from a Time Machine backup if necessary. No need to create separate partitions.
2. It's usually not a good idea to have your boot OS and Time Machine backup on the same drive. A failure in either partition could mean that both the OS and backup could be lost.

I doubt the procedure you're suggesting would resolve the issue Mark is having. This seems to be an issue with that drive.

 

[pm-r]

I'm not familiar with Carbon Copy Cloner. But This is what i'll do to get what you want.

Please excuse me for being so blunt, but from what you suggest you're not really very familiar for the normal reasons of using Time Machine either.

Sorry, or I misunderstood what you were suggesting.




- Patrick
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[chscag]

On newer versions of OS X, including the one Mark is using, one can boot from a Time Machine backup if necessary. No need to create separate partitions.

@Jaiman:

Apple refers to that procedure as an EFI boot. And having tested it myself, I can say that it works just like Apple says it's supposed to. Creating separate partitions as noted above is never a good idea. There are many reasons for not doing so. You can do your own research on that.

 

[Jaiman]

I think my suggestion works perfectly well as to what he is trying to achieve. he needs the fantom drive which serves as the backup to be bootable in case a crash happens.
i'm not suggesting that the computer boots primarily on the backup drive all the time, it's an option in case the internal hd crashes, you can boot from your external hard drive.
Having 2 partitions on the external hard drive gives you more flexibility, you can boot from a pristine, uncorrupted operating system and use that to browse the files on both the internal hard drive and that of the time machine backup, with this setup you no longer need a 3rd party app like carbon copy cleaner.

I've done this in the past but don't recommend it anymore for the following reasons:

1. On newer versions of OS X, including the one Mark is using, one can boot from a Time Machine backup if necessary. No need to create separate partitions.
2. It's usually not a good idea to have your boot OS and Time Machine backup on the same drive. A failure in either partition could mean that both the OS and backup could be lost.

I doubt the procedure you're suggesting would resolve the issue Mark is having. This seems to be an issue with that drive.

 

[Jaiman]

Please excuse me for being so blunt, but from what you suggest you're not really very familiar for the normal reasons of using Time Machine either.

Sorry, or I misunderstood what you were suggesting.




- Patrick
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I think you misunderstood.

 

[Rod]

Jaiman, with respect I'm not sure you have thought this though from a practiclal point of view and I don't see how it helps our user, which is after all the whole point of this forum.
Say for example an internal HD fails for whatever reason. Would you rather startup with a mint Operating System that then needs to access a TM backup which cannot by itself run your device in order to restore your backed up data. This will not give you access to your data, just a way of restoring it to a new HD.
OR would you like to be able to boot your device with all of your data, settings, preferences and passwords intact exactly as they were and have the ability to restore all of this to a new replacement HD when you are able to replace it in the space of an hour or so?
My wife ran her MBP for two weeks from a clone while waiting for a replacement SSD and only required 2 hrs to restore her cloned data and Operating System to the new drive.
This is the beauty of a bootable clone and I fail to see how your suggestion would replace this fuctionality.

 

[pm-r]

his is the beauty of a bootable clone and I fail to see how your suggestion would replace this fuctionality.

I guess you can join me Rod in not "understanding" the suggested solution.

Yes it could work, but sure not anywhere close to ideal or convenient IMHO.




- Patrick
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