The Official Mac AntiVirus and Firewall FAQ

[ronindavid]

Hello, I am a brand new switcher. In fact, I don't even have my new computer yet. I just ordered it (iMac) last night.

P.S. - I also agree that since this thread is intended for 'switchers' who would most likely have the latest release of OSX, maybe it should be updated to include information about security for just Leopard and Tiger. Just a thought. Thanks again!

I'm in the same boat (except I'm getting a Mac Pro).
I'd also like to know the answer if anyone has one.


As far as the lack of Mac virus/trojans/etc, I have to say I'm SHOCKED. One or two? That's all?! And they were in programs you had to install?

One thing I don't think anyone's mentioned (forgive me if I missed the post) is that I've read in several articles, both online and in magazines, that claim OSX is the new Windows 95. That everyone here who owns a mac is completely unprepared for a bombardment of viruses that will soon be written and released. And unlike most long-time PC users such as myself, mac owners who think they need no protection will soon be hit hard.
I noticed awhile back even Macworld featured the need for security.
And there's one claim I constantly keep hearing about why OSX users don't get infected; not enough Mac's online to entice virus writers...up until now which is why it'll be Win95 all over again.

This worried me so much that I went to CompUSA (only place near me selling Mac related stuff) to check for software. None there. Searching on the web I've only found a few so far that makes a security suite (Doorstop X, Norton, and Intego).

I already know the common sense things about where not to go on the web and what not to do when checking email to keep from getting infected.
Is that really enough? And if not, which of the above mentioned software is my safest bet?

 

[Gbeav]

From my understanding OSX is like Linux and Linux users seem to write most of the viruses. They would be taking a chance with themselves if they wrote a mac virus.

I don't run any spyware or anti-virus stuff and I personally don't expect to in the near future. I wouldn't be paranoid unless I was a business user.

 

[Brown Study]

One thing I don't think anyone's mentioned (forgive me if I missed the post) is that I've read in several articles, both online and in magazines, that claim OSX is the new Windows 95. That everyone here who owns a mac is completely unprepared for a bombardment of viruses that will soon be written and released. And unlike most long-time PC users such as myself, mac owners who think they need no protection will soon be hit hard.

This is the usual run-of-the-mill FUD that's been propogated by those with vested interests in anti-virus apps, those who are anti-Mac and the innocently ignorant since the first version of OS X in '99 or 2000. It's a refrain that is no more true now than it was then, the equivalent of the scruffy cartoon-character nutbar standing on a corner with a sandwich board reading The End is Nigh.

Here's a precis of all the virus posts and threads on this board:

At least one — if not both — viruses written for OS X was created in an anti-virus company's lab. I don't remember which company wrote it, but it was created, the company claims, as a "proof of concept." Even then it failed, because like every other OS X application, the virus needed the user to install it. Some virus.

The other, if I remember correctly, could be loaded only through a chat application and was disguised as a jpeg of all things. It, too, needed the user to agree to install it, so it wasn't a virus anyway. It was a Trojan. In any event, a user would have to agree to load a program to display a jpeg. Moronic.

The rest of the condensed version: There are no anti-virus programs for Mac because there are none that would know what to look for in a database, because there is no code to check against, and no heuristics that could serve as a template — because there are no viruses.

Anti-virus apps for OS X check only for Windows viruses, so if you don't have a Windows box hooked up to a Mac, they're an utter waste of money, time and computer resources. Even if there were Windows boxes hooked up to the Mac, the anti-virus app would still be almost useless. What Windows box isn't loaded to the gills with anti-virus apps, anyway?

If and when a Mac virus ever appears, it'll be front-page news, and you'll hear about it long before any anti-virus app could be written to recognize it. Run a search for the word virus on this board, read the stuff, then forget about it.

Security isn't synonymous with virus, though. Holes are occasionally found, but Apple is fast and thorough in filling them. Often, the free OS updates include security patches. Most of these occur before word of the problem leaks out.

Any mention, especially a comparison, of OS X and Windows 95 in the same breath could be fatal — for the Mac user doubled over and dead from uncontrollable laughter.

 

[Mathiau]

There is the thought of Apple gaining market share in the OS area it could be come more of a target with the usual saying "why target %8 of the market with a virus when you can hit %90." and apples attitude about being above everyone else and so much better in every way (just check their marketing), i am sure people have tried, but most all have failed.

it does make sense, but OSX being built on BSD for the most part, that lone makes it less prone to intrustion, most of Windows problems are it being so open to so much 3rd party drivers / applications it is prone to be open to more exploits, i am sure the code base to allow this is ten fold what OSX is.

i am sure if either OSX of Linux opened their doors the sheer amount of software / hardware windows could support, they too would have their share of exploits, or at least attempts, or if MS made the OS and the hardware, they would be far less open to exploits.

OS X is no where near windows 95 in anyway.

I do recall recently their being some exploit found to get into OSX, cant recall it, i also recall in the past steve holding events to have someone try to hack into a Apple system alone, but then the truth was found out that this apparent stand alone system was behind numerous firewalls and protection.


personally, if a virus came out for OSX, i dont think it would be front page news until it spread a little, a virus writer /phreaker / cracker doesnt want their work being found out until some damage gets done, also i am sure Steve would try to keep a lid on it cause the day a virus is written and succesfully infects OSX, is a whole can of worms being open and one of OSX greatest feats over the windows world, toss out the "window"

 

[Brown Study]

i am sure if either OSX of Linux opened their doors the sheer amount of software / hardware windows could support, they too would have their share of exploits, or at least attempts, or if MS made the OS and the hardware, they would be far less open to exploits.

There is no way of knowing how many exploits have been attempted. But the argument that 5,001 word processors for Windows (or whatever the number) against the 1,000 for Mac (or whatever the number) is the reason why Windows is plagued by viruses is flawed. Windows is a virus magnet because of its structure.

I do recall recently their being some exploit found to get into OSX, cant recall it

There are many attempts, recently and in the past. There will be tomorrow.

i also recall in the past steve holding events to have someone try to hack into a Apple system alone, but then the truth was found out that this apparent stand alone system was behind numerous firewalls and protection.

Steve never held such an event. Yes, folks, the truth is out there, has been found out! and you read it here, first. Only in this thread, but here, nevertheless.

also i am sure Steve would try to keep a lid on it

Yep. The all-powerful Steve can keep a lid on a virus. He suspended the law of gravity yesterday, but no one noticed because he kept a lid on it.

cause the day a virus is written and succesfully infects OSX, is a whole can of worms being open and one of OSX greatest feats over the windows world, toss out the "window"

LOL!

 

[ronindavid]

From my understanding OSX is like Linux and Linux users seem to write most of the viruses. They would be taking a chance with themselves if they wrote a mac virus.

I don't run any spyware or anti-virus stuff and I personally don't expect to in the near future. I wouldn't be paranoid unless I was a business user.

I never knew that most viruses were written on Linux. I guess it makes sense not to write a virus on the same OS you're trying to infect others with...

This is the usual run-of-the-mill FUD that's been propogated by those with vested interests in anti-virus apps, those who are anti-Mac and the innocently ignorant since the first version of OS X in '99 or 2000. It's a refrain that is no more true now than it was then, the equivalent of the scruffy cartoon-character nutbar standing on a corner with a sandwich board reading The End is Nigh.

Here's a precis of all the virus posts and threads on this board:

At least one — if not both — viruses written for OS X was created in an anti-virus company's lab. I don't remember which company wrote it, but it was created, the company claims, as a "proof of concept." Even then it failed, because like every other OS X application, the virus needed the user to install it. Some virus.

The other, if I remember correctly, could be loaded only through a chat application and was disguised as a jpeg of all things. It, too, needed the user to agree to install it, so it wasn't a virus anyway. It was a Trojan. In any event, a user would have to agree to load a program to display a jpeg. Moronic.

The rest of the condensed version: There are no anti-virus programs for Mac because there are none that would know what to look for in a database, because there is no code to check against, and no heuristics that could serve as a template — because there are no viruses.

Anti-virus apps for OS X check only for Windows viruses, so if you don't have a Windows box hooked up to a Mac, they're an utter waste of money, time and computer resources. Even if there were Windows boxes hooked up to the Mac, the anti-virus app would still be almost useless. What Windows box isn't loaded to the gills with anti-virus apps, anyway?

If and when a Mac virus ever appears, it'll be front-page news, and you'll hear about it long before any anti-virus app could be written to recognize it. Run a search for the word virus on this board, read the stuff, then forget about it.

Security isn't synonymous with virus, though. Holes are occasionally found, but Apple is fast and thorough in filling them. Often, the free OS updates include security patches. Most of these occur before word of the problem leaks out.

Any mention, especially a comparison, of OS X and Windows 95 in the same breath could be fatal — for the Mac user doubled over and dead from uncontrollable laughter.

Thanks for the input. I had a feeling that all these claims were exaggerated. I guess what had me wondering if some were true was the fact that mac security software has just started hitting the shelves. Made me wonder "Why would they make software that's essentially useless?" Guess I now have my answer.

Though, I have heard another reason claiming macs need security software. Now that macs can run windows, there's worry that a virus you'll eventually get in windows will invade your mac. I'm planning on using VMware because there's a small handful of apps that I need that are XP only.

Personally, I'm not worried about this at all and don't really care if it's true or not. Only a few of the programs I'll be using through VMware ever go online to check updates and maybe play a few online games (not EVER going to use web browser. Why? Safari is faster.) And I've been successful at keeping my current PC from being infected many months using Kaspersky. I just have to make sure to set the firewall so it's locking out everything that's not one of the programs I'll be using.
For the record, I've tried every, I repeat, EVERY major internet security software package made. So far, Kaspersky is the only one to keep my machine from being infected. Though, last I tested was 2006 and Kaspersky achieves the near-perfect security the same way many other windows security software does...
DENY,DENY,DENY,DENY,DENY,DENY,DENY,ACCEPT,DENY,
DENY,ACCEPT,DENY,DENY,DENY,DENY,DENY

This sound familiar to some of you?

 

[Mathiau]

WHy do you laugh at the idea of a virus being written that will infect OSX? once one person figures out how to do it, you dont think others will follow? or are you that secure in your OSX you think it is impenetrable and perfect and safe forever from the world of infection?

 

[Kuwisdelu]

Viruses for Mac are kind of like Y2K was.

Everyone says it's coming. But in reality, it's not much to be worried about yet.

Are a lot of us preparing anyway? Yeah.

 

[Brown Study]

Now that macs can run windows, there's worry that a virus you'll eventually get in windows will invade your mac.

The Mac OS can't run Windows apps, so it can't run Windows viruses, whether they attempt to invade a machine that runs both OSes or via the web.

Windows viruses that arrive in emails can't do anything to the Mac. The virus, being a Windows app, is nothing more than impotent, random, garbage characters that can merely take up disk space. Of course, forwarding such an email to a Windows machine might infect that machine. But it's hardly likely that Windows box wouldn't scan it, so why should I waste my machine's resources in such a miniscule addition to the Windows war on viruses? It's not my war because I don't and won't run a Windows box, especially networked to my Mac.

No doubt the Windows virus threat is considerably reduced with Vista because MS has adopted application-loading permissions. But MS's ''solution'' isn't inherent in Vista, as it is in OS X. It's an ad hoc quick fix sitting on top of a flawed design — the registry, for one — and causes its own problems (as though there aren't enough in Vista, anyway). For that matter, the entire OS grows more ad hoc with every release and service pack.

. . . cause the day a virus is written and succesfully infects OSX, is a whole can of worms being open and one of OSX greatest feats over the windows world, toss out the ''window''

WHy do you laugh at the idea of a virus being written that will infect OSX? once one person figures out how to do it, you dont think others will follow? or are you that secure in your OSX you think it is impenetrable and perfect and safe forever from the world of infection?

I'm not laughing at the idea of a virus ever infecting OS X; besides, OS X is far from perfect. It was a reaction to the argument or belief that the lack of viruses is the only reason OS X is superior.

But contributing to my LOL was your stating as fact your laundry list of misinformation:''Steve'' running a crack-a-Mac scam but the ''truth'' being found out; stating as fact your ''recalling'' a successful exploit that in the same sentence you ''can't recall'' so you don't have to provide evidence; stating as fact that ''Steve'' put a lid on a virus, and dragging out the old chestnut of Mac ''market share'' as the reason there are no viruses. Except for switchers on this board and those who find the post far into the future, who know the Windows world much better than they know the Mac world and so might believe this load — it's in a Mac forum, after all — it would be funny.

Are a lot of us preparing anyway? Yeah.

How? (I'm not being facetious.)

 

[Kuwisdelu]

How? (I'm not being facetious.)

Oh, nothing big. There are a lot of Mac users that don't do anything, including turning on the firewall, etc. There are also a lot that do turn it on and keep AV software just in case. I'm not worried, so at this point, I'm definitely not about to throw cash into it or anything. I'm not preparing for a war, just enabling the simplest of defenses like turning on the firewall and keeping ClamXav around in case there ever ARE viruses to check for.

But is it something I think about a lot? Maybe once a month, if even that. It's certainly not something to spend money on yet.

 

[bryanstevens69@]

Questions, questions.

Hello there everyone!

My name is Bryan. I recently bought a macbook and I love it. I can honestly say that I know nothing about mac. The reason I joined this site is to simply learn more. My first and biggest question at the moment is virus and spyware protection. A friend told me that leopard is not vulnerable to viruses or spyware and I don't believe that. Do they make virus protection and spyware protection for mac? And if so who does? What's the cost? If someone could help me out that would be great.

 

[goobimama]

Yep. Your friend is right.

There is one, a Trojan, but you will come across that on a pr0n site AND to install it you will have to provide your admin/password. Otherwise it's free going for the mac at the moment at least

You do however get Virus protection for the Mac. Norton Antivirus 11 has just been released. It's main purpose is so you don't transfer a virus from your Mac to a PC. Otherwise it also checks for other viral signs, but till now there's no known virus for the mac.

Also there is ClamX or something. Again, no point.

Almost forgot,
Welcome to the forums and welcome to worry free browsing

 

[Brown Study]

Welcome to Mac-Forums, Bryan. There are 130 posts (and counting), some with links to elsewhere on the board and to external sites, that'll answer your virus questions here. You might want to read the last page first, since the thread runs from 2005 to today.

 

[Brown Study]

Oh, and there's no spyware, either.

 

[susanna]

hey everyone...

I tried following the thread, but so far could not find the right answer I was looking for... I just bought my MacBook, Leopard, and got the Office for Mac installed. Now I am searching for an Anti-Virus software (although I know about the discussion on whether to get one in the first place) and was wondering which kind of software you could recommend for my system, any experiences?

thx!

 

[Mathiau]

The Mac OS can't run Windows apps, so it can't run Windows viruses, whether they attempt to invade a machine that runs both OSes or via the web.

in leopard there is some code base that will allow the execution of EXE, people arent sure if this was left from bootcap or if apple is going the route of an integrated WINE type of thing to let exe's run with in osx seamlessly, so no if that did occur, you get a virus that infect all of your exe files and nothing else.

 

[Mathiau]

I tried following the thread, but so far could not find the right answer I was looking for... I just bought my MacBook, Leopard, and got the Office for Mac installed. Now I am searching for an Anti-Virus software (although I know about the discussion on whether to get one in the first place) and was wondering which kind of software you could recommend for my system, any experiences?

thx!

you don't need any. buying virus protection for MAC right now is like selling ice to Eskimos.

 

[Kuwisdelu]

I tried following the thread, but so far could not find the right answer I was looking for... I just bought my MacBook, Leopard, and got the Office for Mac installed. Now I am searching for an Anti-Virus software (although I know about the discussion on whether to get one in the first place) and was wondering which kind of software you could recommend for my system, any experiences?

thx!

Many will say these things aren't necessary. They really aren't yet, but if you just want to be careful and pro-active....

1) Go to System Pref -> Sharing -> Firewall and turn it on.
2) Download ClamXav, a free virus scanning software; no need to put money into this kind of thing anytime soon.

There are commercial virus software for Mac, but as Mathiau says, it's like buying ice if you're an Eskimo. You don't really need it, and if you do--you can get it for free.

 

[Brown Study]

The last I heard, MS Word for OS X, after years of existence, can still be infected by macro viruses. Gates will get around to fixing it after he solves world hunger. OS X itself remains immune, along with every other application that isn't MS Word. Gotta love that company. Here's a link.

You'll find more on it by searching the web for
''MS word'' ''os x'' ''macro virus''

 

[Kuwisdelu]

Thank god for NeoOffice ^_^