Done Deal - Apple converts to x86 Intel

[sarahsboy18]

I'm not too concerned about the technical side of it.... You are talking about two companies, Apple and Intel, that know how to do things right... (though they don't always put the effort into it) I think Intel has faced more critisism that it deserved because of the Microsoft OS their processors have always had to put up with.... My hope is that between Apple and Intel they will spare no expense making sure this transition is easy and beneficial.... OSX is certainely a world class OS that has plenty of bite to take on XP... we'll see about Longhorn.

My concern is more the effect on Apple's brand image. It is going to be interesting to see how well Apple can downplay the last 10 years of x86 bashing from their marketing team. But this won't be first time Apple has had to reinvent their image... but I sure hope it's the last... My little heart can't take much more of it.

 

[Avid6eek]

I think Intel has faced more critisism that it deserved because of the Microsoft OS their processors have always had to put up with.

Uhhh...I guess that's an odd way of looking at it.

 

[menace3054]

so yea.. all these years apple has been saying how much better the powerpc is over the x86, and now.. ok, well he started the intel presentation by showing how much power the powerpc uses and how little performance it gets per watt over the intel.. who would go and blow 3,000 on a dual 2.7 now?

 

[RGertner]

...he started the intel presentation by showing how much power the powerpc uses and how little performance it gets per watt over the intel..

It's all marketing, there is a stat for everything. How much processing power vs number letters in the name of the chip so the Intel Pentium 660 with HT Technology vs PowerPC G5 etc.

 

[livatlantis]

It's an interesting thought; why should Apple choose to work with processors they've disliked in the past and why should they abandon PPC if it's better?

What I think is, it's not that PPC is bad and Intel is good, all of a sudden. PowerPC was good, but it probably couldn't allow Macs to move ahead. The future of IBM-Apple was the problem, I guess, and the future of Intel (and x86), the solution.

 

[mynameis]

What I think is, it's not that PPC is bad and Intel is good, all of a sudden. PowerPC was good, but it probably couldn't allow Macs to move ahead. The future of IBM-Apple was the problem, I guess, and the future of Intel (and x86), the solution.

Thats pretty much exactly what Jobs said in the keynote address.

 

[mcsenerd]

It's an interesting thought; why should Apple choose to work with processors they've disliked in the past and why should they abandon PPC if it's better?

What I think is, it's not that PPC is bad and Intel is good, all of a sudden. PowerPC was good, but it probably couldn't allow Macs to move ahead. The future of IBM-Apple was the problem, I guess, and the future of Intel (and x86), the solution.

Here's a thought...I'm inclined to agree with the thought that it actually may have been more of IBM telling Apple to take a hike rather than vice versa. That being said however...I do think that Apple has been working on this for quite some time...if for nothing more than a bargaining chip to use in previous negotiations w/ Motorola/Freescale/IBM. Who knows how many times they tried to float the idea (aka...threat) of moving to x86 processors in negotiation with those companies over the years...

But regardless of the motivation...I'm hoping it all works out well for Apple in the end. I think it's a problem...potentially a large one...that they'll have to reassure their existing PPC base in some way or risk several quarters of much reduced sales. It could really be a difficult time the next few quarters with the reports of iPod stagnation and increasing inventories on top of this announcement.

I do also think that this smacks of Apple growing into a pure software company. I'm sure many analysts would love that to occur, and regardless of what everyone else thinks/feels/knows...if they (the analysts) say that long enough...eventually investors/stockholders start to listen...pretty soon the executive board is acting...and whammo!...it happens. Could be a shrewd business move for Apple to do so anyway...although I would be sad for their depart from hardware design...we all know that the real margins are made selling software and soft assets (aka iTunes). All this being speculation however...maybe Apple could even be envisioning the day when the company spins off the hardware side and leaves the rest to focus on the software and OS aspect of their business.

The best thing about it all is...it should be an interesting next few years in the computing world...

 

[livatlantis]

I'd love to watch the video of the keynote, but my Quicktime keeps giving me "Switching transports" and a 503 error.

But that's another issue Is there going to be any other keynotes by Jobs?

 

[sarahsboy18]

The best thing about it all is...it should be an interesting next few years in the computing world...

That is for sure!

 

[smeshy123]

I doubt apple will go purely software, Jobs didn't indicate that in any way during the speech, he kept on stressing Intel based Mac machines that Mac will be coming out with, as opposed to stressing the phase out of apple hardware...also...I think this is a good move, I forsee a new generation of faster and lighter laptops...I also beleive that the majority of the software for the new Intel based Macs will be backward compatible, Apple cannot ignore the face that for the past 10 years their computers were on PowerPC...and I don't think they will...

 

[MadSkillzMan]

i wont really care whats running under the hood, as long as jobs gives us a heads up on compatability and long time users. I mean it seems pretty stupid to me to turn their backs on us, and even if it took a few years. Look how many of us have G3's and early G4's that are still useful, running tiger. Itd be such a ripoff to not let the new G5 users get a bunch more years out of thier computers.

For all we know, he could release a CPU card for our G5s that have his fancy new intel chip in it. they did it back in the old 100mhz mac days, with todays technology and PCI-X cards i bet they could.

You all know intel cant to what PPC can. Jobs is just saying all this "intel is the most powerful" id say IBMs being a PITA. probably because they cant break the 3.0ghz mark, because your average idiot cant comprehend we get more per mhz. Our clock numbers have been lower for years, but our computers have always out performed the X86 machines (in the aspects of what a mac is good at, graphics, sound, multimedia)

and the new G5's, oooo 2.7ghz, wow a whole 200mhz faster than the 2.5s. is it reeally that noticeable?

we shoulda seen this comming a LONG time ago. That thread back in 2002 that got closed, operation "marklar" steve knew PPC wouldnt last forever, but IMHO, his x86 mood wont last forever either.

Im only aggervated because of the cash i just dropped on a mac. Now if stevie here has a decent compatability plan ill shut up.

 

[iluvthsgam]

got a message sent out to IBMers today talking about the switch. here are a few quotes from that message:

"As you may have heard, Apple announced it will be replacing our POWER-based microprocessors with Intel chips throughout its entire product line over the next couple of years. While we had a strong relationship with Apple, we were unable to reach a mutually beneficial agreement."

"Together, we overcame a number of challenges last year and were able to meet, and exceed in some instances, Apple's demanding yield and performance needs. We are proud of the award-winning processors we created together, and we will continue to supply Apple until the transition is complete."

"Even though Apple is a high-visibility client, they do not consume large volumes of capacity. This decision will enable us to continue focusing our portfolio on more profitable growth segments and deep strategic OEM relationships."

 

[RGertner]

got a message sent out to IBMers today talking about the switch. here are a few quotes from that message:

"As you may have heard, Apple announced it will be replacing our POWER-based microprocessors with Intel chips throughout its entire product line over the next couple of years. While we had a strong relationship with Apple, we were unable to reach a mutually beneficial agreement."

"Together, we overcame a number of challenges last year and were able to meet, and exceed in some instances, Apple's demanding yield and performance needs. We are proud of the award-winning processors we created together, and we will continue to supply Apple until the transition is complete."

"Even though Apple is a high-visibility client, they do not consume large volumes of capacity. This decision will enable us to continue focusing our portfolio on more profitable growth segments and deep strategic OEM relationships."

Funny, I didn't get that

Thanks,
Ray

 

[mcsenerd]

Exactly iluvthsgam...I think this whole switch was more along the lines of IBM saying to Apple..."Look Apple...whine, moan, gripe, pout, whatever you want...but you don't make us enough money for us to bend over backward trying to keep with your wants and needs. If you don't like what we're offering at the price we're offering it at...take a hike."

 

[mogwai]

I wish apple opted for AMD instead of Intel

 

[zap2]

i think steve made the point in his keynote that PPc would give 15 watts per( something ) and intel could give 70 , in the coming future, thats why apple is waiting to switch

 

[Amen-Moses]

i think steve made the point in his keynote that PPc would give 15 watts per( something ) and intel could give 70 , in the coming future, thats why apple is waiting to switch

It was 15 somethings per watt compared to 70 somethings per watt, unfortunately that was the weakest part of the show and complete bollocks.

Watt (sic) he was doing was comparing a present day 90nm dual 970 with a future possible Intel chip, if he was truthful he would have instead compared the future cell or Xbox chips from IBM (both of which will be put in a box little bigger than a Mini) with the proposed future Intel chip.

I'm not sure which Intel chip he even had in mind as if you take the current Pentium M as a guide and wang it up to 3Ghz (to almost compete with the 970) you'll have one toasty little chip! The figures I've seen from customising magazines is around 20-25 watts for the 1.6 Ghz and 30-35 for the 2.1. That is more power than the entire Mini uses (including the graphics chips, RAM etc) and considerably more than the 1.67G G4s in the powerbooks.

Everyone in the know probably coughed a little over that part of the show and in my case it was the dead give-away that this switch was possibly not Jobs' idea in the first place.

Amen-Moses

 

[Amen-Moses]

I wish apple opted for AMD instead of Intel

I wish they'd stopped mucking about making hardware and just ported OS X to the Power 5 range *AND* AMD 64 *AND* IA64. That way we power users could just take out a mortgage on some serious hardware (like an IBM p655 or a quad Xeon system or a multi core opteron system or ...) and be done with it. In fact you can even lease the high end stuff from IBM.

We have p615s at work with 36 inch square displays (i.e 36 inches tall by 36 inches high) which a used for Air Traffic Control (and yes they are flat panel TFT displays, resolution is 4000 x 4000 ish) and boy are they sweet machines. Hot swappable hard drives, super fast RAID, masses of RAM capability, etc etc.

Amen-Moses

 

[Avid6eek]

It's almost impossible to compare a current processor to one that does not even exist yet. Intel did just announce the Xeon Dempsey core which will be dual core clocked at 3.8Ghz and be based on the 65nm process. this would be the first single processor that would be capable of outperforming the top PowerMac's available. No thermal information was given about the processor.

 

[RGertner]

We have p615s at work with 36 inch square displays (i.e 36 inches tall by 36 inches high) which a used for Air Traffic Control (and yes they are flat panel TFT displays, resolution is 4000 x 4000 ish) and boy are they sweet machines. Hot swappable hard drives, super fast RAID, masses of RAM capability, etc etc.

Amen-Moses

The pSeries 615 is a serious system to be using as a workstation