Troubleshooting startup disk + how to proceed?

[noeb36]

Hi!

I have the following setup:

-- Late 2012 (new 2013) iMac. Startup disk is a Samsung EVO SSD 500 GB in a Delock enclosure (externally powered), connected to the iMac via Thunderbolt. The disk is less than 3 years old. Power indicator is on, so it's not a power connection issue.

-- Internal 2 TB HDD, used for storage and files that don't need quick access. I don't think the HDD has a partition that's bootable, but I'm not quite sure.

-- I have updated Time Machine backups of both disks.

-- I have an external disk with a (not so fresh) clone of both the startup disk and the internal disk. I think it's USB 3, and I think it's bootable. Used Carbon Copy Cloner to make it

Today, when i started the iMac, the "gear" icon was spinning forever. No login window. I restarted (holding the power button), and voila: the flashing folder icon, with a question mark. I assume this means the startup disk wasn't found.

Tried the following:

-- Hold Shift during startup for Safe Mode: did not work. Only got to the flashing folder/question mark
-- Hold Cmd+R: this works. I get to a menu with options for Time Machine recovery, OSX install, Help/Support and finally Disk Utility. Tried to open Disk Utility - I can only see the internal HDD and in addition some small partition (1.19 GB) called "OSX Home..." or something like that. Verified both without issues. I do not see the SSD.

So, the question is:

1: I assume the SSD is dead. Is this reasonable to assume? How can i verify it?
2: I have a complete and up-to-date Time Machine backup, but I can't start up from it, right?
3: I guess I could start up from the internal disk - but how (with my setup)? Do I need to delete everything on it first?
4: My guess is that I will have to get a new SSD, install it into the enclosure, format to Mac OS extended journalled, and then recover backup. And then continue as I have done for the last 3 years. Other suggestions or comments?

Thanks a lot in advance!!

 

[pigoo3]

-- Late 2012 (new 2013) iMac. Startup disk is a Samsung EVO SSD 500 GB in a Delock enclosure (externally powered), connected to the iMac via Thunderbolt.

Just so we know...so we don't make any incorrect assumptions. Why are you using an external drive as your startup drive? Not that this can't be done...just very very unusual.

1: I assume the SSD is dead. Is this reasonable to assume? How can i verify it?

Try plugging it into a 2nd computer.

3: I guess I could start up from the internal disk - but how (with my setup)? Do I need to delete everything on it first?

Nope. Boot into Recovery Partition (as you've already done)...and install the Mac OS on the internal drive. Assuming there's enough free space to install the Mac OS. And if there isn't...then enough free space needs to be made.

4: My guess is that I will have to get a new SSD, install it into the enclosure, format to Mac OS extended journalled, and then recover backup. And then continue as I have done for the last 3 years. Other suggestions or comments?

Well...

You could do this. But it would REALLY make MUCH more sense to install the SSD as the internal drive...and the 2 TB internal drive (not 2 GB)...as the external drive. Yes you have (or had) the external SSD connected via Thunderbolt (which would faster than USB)...but I'm pretty sure having the SSD installed internally would still be faster (which is why folks install SSD's internally).

Yes we know that opening up a 2012 iMac is a pain in the butt...but installing the SSD internally & having your startup disk being internal as well...is really the way it's done.

HTH,

- Nick

 

[noeb36]

Hi Nick, thanks for helping me out.

First of all, the internal is 2 TB - of course, thanks

Well, the external SSD is way faster than the internal HDD (the speed improvement is really huge) - and the cost of doing it this way is significantly lower. And it's way easier than installing it into the iMac myself.

I'll try plugging it in another Mac later today.

Nope. Boot into Recovery Partition (as you've already done)...and install the Mac OS on the internal drive. Assuming there's enough free space to install the Mac OS. And if there isn't...then enough free space needs to be made.

Great! This means I could install directly via wifi, no DVD required? (BTW: is OSX free these days?)

It would of course be neater - and maybe, although I'm not sure - faster to install the SSD internally. But yes, I'm sure it's a pain, and I don't think I'll even try I'm quite happy with the setup as it is. But I guess you're right, most people would have it installed

 

[Slydude]

You can indeed reinstall over wi-fi without using a DVD. When you login to the App Store you will have access to any OS X versions that you have already purchased. The last several versions of OS X have been free.

I don't know which version of OS X you have installed but unless you have purchased/downloaded it before the only version that will show as available is Sierra. Your machine should run Sierra quite well.

 

[noeb36]

That's great.

However, I don't really want to update my mac (or my ipad), as the updates render the devices useless (as in "so laggy and slow that you want to kill and burn them") sooner or later. But this time maybe there's no way around it...

 

[Slydude]

If you have downloaded previous versions of the OS they will be available when you log into the App Store. Look under the Purchases / Purchased tab. There are essentially two methods of recovery commonly used on Macs. I'm discounting clones for the moment since that'spm;y helpful if the cone is done beforehand.

1. Reinstalling the OS from the recovery partition on a Mac's hard drive installs the OS that was on that drive at the time. Quite useful if the recovery partition is intact.
2. Using the internet recovery option installs the OS versions that shipped with the computer. See here for an explanation of what it is and how to do it.

 

[pigoo3]

Slydude expertly addressed your questions. Still would be great to know what OS version you're currently running on your iMac...so we can understand where you & your iMac are currently.

- Nick

 

[Slydude]

Slydude expertly addressed your questions.

- Nick

Thanks. I don't hear that often. Break out the tape measure. Might be time for a bigger hat. lol

 

[pigoo3]

Hey...you'll make the hat shop (millinery store) very happy if you're shopping for bigger hats! Lol

Just don't dip into the new iMac Pro fund!

- Nick

 

[Slydude]

There is absolutely nothing in that fund at the moment. Now if you and Charlie would like to take steps toward solving that problem, I'm open to discussing the amount of your contribution.

 

[pm-r]

You could do this. But it would REALLY make MUCH more sense to install the SSD as the internal drive...and the 2 TB internal drive (not 2 GB)...as the external drive. Yes you have (or had) the external SSD connected via Thunderbolt (which would faster than USB)...but I'm pretty sure having the SSD installed internally would still be faster (which is why folks install SSD's internally).

Yes we know that opening up a 2012 iMac is a pain in the butt...but installing the SSD internally & having your startup disk being internal as well...is really the way it's done.

Hmmm…???

I've often wondered a bit about this but I'm fast enough for my use with the "normal" setup but neither does my 2011 iMac have the fastest Thunderbolt speed.

But, this is interesting:
iMac internal SSD vs external Thunderbolt SSD
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/imac-internal-ssd-vs-external-thunderbolt-ssd.1604225/

and

Booting Thunderbolt iMac from LaCie Rugged SSD
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/booting-thunderbolt-imac-from-lacie-rugged-ssd.1489710/

using just a quick google search…




- Patrick
======

 

[noeb36]

Thanks a lot so far, people.

First, with regards to the OS, I'm not quite sure but could it be Mountain Lion...? Don't think I updated since I got it in 2013 or 2014.

Update - now I'm a little wiser:

-- First of all, the enclosure definitely has power.
-- I tested the disk (in the enclosure) with the same Thunderbolt cable on a Macbook. The power indicator on the enclosure is initially yellow, a little later turns green. The disk shows up in the Finder menu. I can not eject the disk properly (only "forced")
-- Tested once more on the iMac, but another Thunderbolt-port on the iMac. Same as when the problem started: flashing folder icon with question mark. Interesting: the power indicator on the enclosure is yellow, not green.
-- Now I connected to the Macbook again, and ran Disk Utility. Verification of the disk is OK. However, I can not repair ("Error: can not deactivate volume for repair" or something like that)
-- Now I tested the disk with a SATA-USB interface on the Macbook. Disk shows up in Finder. I can now eject properly.
-- Tested the SATA-USB interface on the iMac - interesting: First the folder/question icon flashes for some seconds. Then, VOILA! the iMac boots from the SATA-USB connected SSD disk.
-- Tested one last time with the original enclosure/Thunderbolt cable, nothing happens (only flashing folder/question mark), even if I wait a long time.

So...Conclusion? I guess the enclosure is the problem. Agree? Any other ideas, or things I should verify/check?

Thanks once more in advance!

 

[ferrarr]

Did you test with a new thunderbolt cable? A different thunderbolt connector on the enclosure?

 

[noeb36]

Yes, just tested with another TB cable. No luck. So I guess it's the enclosure