Scroll jank after macOS update(s)

[mafocari]

I try to keep my Mac up to date, though only with Big Sur for the moment (which broke some necessary stuff initially for a month, so I'm avoiding Monterey for now), and since the last minor update or two, scrolling has become jittery (janky? laggy? inconsistent?). It's annoying. It's like old Android phones before Pixel. It doesn't matter the app, many are affected in some way, though not all in exactly the same way.

Before, things scrolled like a typical iPhone. I don't know what's going on, but at this point I want to revert, but I can't, and I don't want to lose anything that might be good anyway. It's like there's new gunk processing going on that I don't need. I'm on a MacBook Pro 2019. I and my boss don't see any reason to just go buy a new Mac, and this isn't reason enough.

So, I'm sure there's the typical suggestions, but I'd like to know if you know anything about macOS updates causing scroll performance issues.

 

[Lifeisabeach]

Well with problems like this coming on immediately after an update, I usually recommend you try running Onyx' suite of cache cleaning tools. This has been successful in the past at ironing out problems. If that doesn't do it, try running EtreCheck and see what problems it can turn up.

It would also help to know how much drive space is used/free. And how much RAM you have and is in use when you have this happen. You can get those stats from Activity Monitor off the Memory tab.

 

[mafocari]

I neglected to mention that I reported a problem here earlier that I thought was the fault of the touchpad, but that it didn't happen when "flicking"... but since the last Mac minor update, even flicking has had jank. So annoying. I'll have to try all of the suggestions then.​

 

[Rod]

I do notice this same issue on my 2015 13" MBP running the current macOS Monterey from time to time but after all it is a 7 year old model with only 8GB RAM and a heavily used GPU. Monterey is a big jump from the original OS.
Having said that Monterey is not a big jump from Big Sur and in my experience works better and manages CPU resources better than Big Sur.
So, I would not let performance issues prevent you from upgrading to Monterey.
The only time I notice this stuttering behavior is when I have a lot of apps running in the background or if the device gets a bit overheated as a result.

 

[Lifeisabeach]

I neglected to mention that I reported a problem here earlier that I thought was the fault of the touchpad, but that it didn't happen when "flicking"... but since the last Mac minor update, even flicking has had jank. So annoying. I'll have to try all of the suggestions then.​

Hmmm. Running any 3rd party apps that manage scrolling or touch/click behavior, like BetterTouchTool?

 

[mafocari]

I'll try Monterey soon then if it performs better.

I'm not running any apps that manage scroll or touch or click behavior.

 

[Rod]

Mafocari, let me be clear, upgrading your OS is unlikely to fix anything. I just meant that as far as performance goes there is no reason not to.

 

[mafocari]

I've uninstalled Avast for another reason, and the performance is the same after Mac reboot.

I think the issue is poor Apple software driver responsiveness handling or logic with external trackpads.

Otherwise the trackpad is just broken, and I'll have to continue my quest of trying every mouse and trackpad on the planet until I find a good one.

 

[Randy B. Singer]

I've uninstalled Avast for another reason, and the performance is the same after Mac reboot.

It's a good idea to keep Avast uninstalled forever. Avast does several malware-like things and is not to be trusted:

Leaked Documents Expose the Secretive Market for Your Web Browsing Data

An Avast antivirus subsidiary sells 'Every search. Every click. Every buy. On every site.' Its clients have included Home Depot, Google, Microsoft, Pepsi, and McKinsey.

www.vice.com

The Safe Mac » Avast installs adware!

Everything you need to know to protect your Mac

www.thesafemac.com

The Safe Mac » Avast’s man in the middle

Everything you need to know to protect your Mac

www.thesafemac.com

Were you careful to uninstall Avast completely?

Uninstalling Avast Security from Mac | Official Avast Support

Instructions for removing Avast Security from Mac.

support.avast.com

I think the issue is poor Apple software driver responsiveness handling or logic with external trackpads.

That sounds highly unlikely. It just isn't a complaint that anyone ever has.

Otherwise the trackpad is just broken,

I kinda doubt that too. What you describe doesn't at all sound like a broken trackpad.

and I'll have to continue my quest of trying every mouse and trackpad on the planet until I find a good one.

I suspect that you will just be throwing away money to no end if you do that.

It sounds more to me like you have software running in the background that is sapping CPU time. Do you have a typing lag in your word processor? Do you have other anti-virus software running, or some other disk utility that runs all the time?

Try this:

Go in to your Utilities folder and find Activity Monitor
Launch it and click on the CPU tab
Click on the %CPU column to sort things from most to least
What's at the top of the list? Is it using a lot of CPU? That may be the culprit.

If you can't narrow things down using the Activity Monitor, try this.
Restart in Safe Mode by booting with the shift key held down.

How to Boot Mac in Safe Mode – Why & When to Use it

Learn how to boot Mac in safe mode. 5 steps to easily start Mac, MacBook Pro, Air or iMac in safe mode to fix hardware or software issues

www.unlockboot.com

See if the problem is gone while running is Safe Mode. If it is, then the solution is to do a clean install of your system software, then only add back third party software one item at a time until you find what is causing the performance suck.

 

[mafocari]

Uh oh, another thread sidetracking into Avast hate

I don't like Avast either, but if someone says they uninstalled Avast and nothing changed, that's not a reason to post about how bad Avast is

I appreciate the recommendation though; I'll try the "full uninstall" of Avast to see if that changes anything... but I didn't think Apple would have performance problems from an uninstalled Avast, because nothing from it should continue to run, right?! If so, I'd consider that an Apple security issue.

> I think the issue is poor Apple software driver responsiveness handling or logic with external trackpads.

>> That sounds highly unlikely. It just isn't a complaint that anyone ever has.

Why do you think that's unlikely? It seems most likely. Note that I'm not an Apple fanboy, though I don't jump to blaming Apple first either; so I hope you're not in the Apple fanboy camp (as in, being often highly doubtful that a problem is caused by Apple), because that can too easily close avenues of solutions.

I don't think the trackpad is broken, though I'm open to the possibility that there's a software/hardware design or implementation (even manufacturing) flaw... is that a possibility for you or do you doubt that?

Go in to your Utilities folder and find Activity Monitor
Launch it and click on the CPU tab
Click on the %CPU column to sort things from most to least
What's at the top of the list? Is it using a lot of CPU? That may be the culprit.

I look at Activity Monitor whenever there's a performance issue I can't identify; there's been nothing in there that's been unusual for this issue.

Things seem to be working fine today however, so maybe the issue went away.

 

[MacInWin]

but I didn't think Apple would have performance problems from an uninstalled Avast, because nothing from it should continue to run, right?!

IF and only IF, you actually did the uninstall properly. AVAST is known to be persistent, leaving behind crapola that runs even after the user THINKS it's been uninstalled. That is one of the reasons it's viewed with hostility. Software should behave properly, AVAST does not.

You can run Etrecheck to see if any left over stuff is loading at boot or login.

Why do you think that's unlikely? It seems most likely.

It is unlikely because if it were systemic, there would be lots of comments/complaints about the issue. The absence of those comments/complaints is generally a good indicator that the odd occurrence of the issue is more likely to be a local problem to that user/system. Apple generally responds well to user complaints, particularly those that affect the user experience. Now, if only Apple would plug the memory leak in the Finder Search function...

 

[Randy B. Singer]

Uh oh, another thread sidetracking into Avast hate

No one here "hates" Avast. I gave several citations for multiple reasons to be extremely wary of Avast. It's up to you if you are going to be wise enough to check out the links and heed the admonition.

I don't like Avast either, but if someone says they uninstalled Avast and nothing changed, that's not a reason to post about how bad Avast is

Actually, yes it is. First, several sketchy anti-virus programs, and especially Avast, are insidious, and if you don't fully uninstall them....YES, they can still run. The fact that these sketchy anti-virus programs install themselves deep into your operating system is why they impact your Mac's performance and cause problems, and why you need either an uninstaller program, or very detailed instructions, to fully remove them.

I appreciate the recommendation though; I'll try the "full uninstall" of Avast to see if that changes anything... but I didn't think Apple would have performance problems from an uninstalled Avast, because nothing from it should continue to run, right?!

Wrong.

> I think the issue is poor Apple software driver responsiveness handling or logic with external trackpads.

>> That sounds highly unlikely. It just isn't a complaint that anyone ever has.

Why do you think that's unlikely? It seems most likely.

Because I'm regularly in touch with literally tens of thousands of Macintosh users. I'm the head of a user group with close to 10,000 users all by itself. I have Web sites that have been visited by millions of Mac users, many of whom I've been in touch with. I'm on about a dozen Macintosh discussion lists. I've had hundreds of articles about the Macintosh published all over the world. etc. etc. I've helped countless Mac users troubleshoot problems with their Macs. If I haven't heard of any Mac users complaining of something, then it is simply not a common problem, and it's likely that it's never a problem.

Note that I'm not an Apple fanboy... I hope you're not in the Apple fanboy camp

This is a Macintosh discussion list. Accusing a Macintosh user of being a "fanboy" is highly offensive. It's the kind of low class thing that a Windows bigot would say. Doing it on a Macintosh discussion list is an extreme faux pas. Read the room.

Accusing ME of being a fanboy, while I'm assisting you with your Macintosh problem (for FREE, giving you the benefit of my experience for no other reason than just to be nice) is a huge insult. If you want further assistance from me, I'm going to need an apology.

___________________________________________

Randy B. Singer • Attorney at Law
Co-author of The Macintosh Bible (4th, 5th, and 6th editions)
Macintosh Routine Maintenance • Macintosh Routine Maintenance
___________________________________________

 

[mafocari]

OK I'm done with this thread. The issue happens randomly, I'm sure I didn't do something exactly perfectly right as expected but I'm not a Mac expert and if I was I'm sure I could never say there's an issue with the Mac at all that's fixable in any way, it's always the user, Macs are perfect and Apple is perfect.

 

[MacInWin]

it's always the user, Macs are perfect and Apple is perfect.

Nope, nope and nope. Apple and Apple products have lots of curious behaviors. It's just that what you are describing isn't one of them widely seen.

Just curious, I don't remember if you said what applications show this behavior. Is it in Safari? I ask because Safari has shown me some jerkiness in scrolling on long pages. Brave browser is better on those sites.

 

[mafocari]

MacInWin: Please don't comment on my posts anymore.

You've gotten lost on several posts, and have caused more problems for me to try to work out than solved.

Other senior members have been better. Please step aside and let them do what they've been doing, which has generally been helpful. I can't keep getting sidetracked having to re-explain to you what's said or to explain basic usage to you to try to get past an unnecessary sidetrack.

You're not helpful and have been basically getting into the equivalent of flaming.

Please just stay out of my threads.

Bye!

 

[Slydude]

Just curious, I don't remember if you said what applications show this behavior. Is it in Safari? I ask because Safari has shown me some jerkiness in scrolling on long pages. Brave browser is better on those sites.

This is a valid question that needs to be answered. I've seen Safari do this numerous times recently. Just yesterday I experienced this on the Amazon site.

It has not occurred often enough for me to decide if it is occurring more often since the last OS update.0

 

[MacInWin]

@mafocari, please avert your eyes. This post is not for you

Sly, it started recently. Safari is stuttering quite a bit for me on some sites, particularly ones with lots of ads on them. That's why I asked. If he-who-doesn't-want-me-to-post-in-his-threads is seeing it just in Safari, it may not the the trackpad or overall Mac. But the thread never identified what apps or circumstances, so he-who-doesn't-want-me-to-post-in-his-threads isn't helping us much with information.

Good luck with trying to help.

 

[Slydude]

I first noticed it on Amazon, but I have noticed it on a handful other sites, I hadn't thought of the ads being an issue but that may not be all of the problem because I'm running and ad blocker.

 

[MacInWin]

As am I Sly. But I think when the ad tries to load and the blocker stops it, something is going on in Safari to not let the page load smoothly. Brave works better for me, as I said.

 

[Slydude]

The next time I notice this I'm going to try loading the same page in Brave and see what happens.