Has Apple lost it's edge?

[tiredretired]

A rhetorical question. I am far from an expert on computers. I have had my current imac for 5 years now and love it. I recently replaced the internal HDD with a 1GB unit and upgraded the RAM to 8 GB. All from OWC. Great company.

What the heck has happened to Disc utility? It seems neutered or scaled back. Does anyone know the reasoning behind this. After all the upgrades I decided to set up a RAID 1 mirror to back up wifey's clients forms and info instead of just relying on Time Machine. Well, that's a no go as it is no longer offered. Instead one has to buy a $179 software to do it or $50 bucks for the limited basic version. What the hey? Time Machine has issues too. The last time I used it to restore I was missing some files. I was fortunate that the ones missing were no big loss, but next time? I just can't rely on it anymore.

So, thinking of buying Carbon Copy Cloner and backing stuff up that way. I think I can trust it more then CCC.

What say you? Am I just being picky? Expecting too much from Apple? After all, they are human too and make mistakes like everyone else.

Cheers mates.

 

[harryb2448]

It is called progress. Black day when the floppy was removed from the Bondi Blue iMac!!!

I dislike Time Machine as it is not bootable and prefer a cloning utility such as CarbonCopyCloner or SuperDuper installed via an external hard drive connected via FW. Both are bootable in the even of an internal hard drive failure. And I presume you did mean CCC is more reliable than Time Machine? I believe a 1TB external WD hard dive connected by FW800 would suit you best. I believe so few Mac users actually use RADID makes it somewhat unpractical and unprofitable.

The same is happening with less user upgradeable Macs. With the company's financial report from 2012, it was reported 98% of purchasers use their Macs as they come out of the box; no memory, CPU, gfx where available upgrades at all.

 

[ipadder474]

I just have a large 3Tb and smaller 2Tb WD external hard drive. And just back up the files i need to back up. I use both a Mac Book Pro and two ASUSS Windows Computers i also use DropBox to transfer files.. All that iCloud and Time Machine Apple stuff just makes me think i can do without it.

 

[pigoo3]

What the heck has happened to Disc utility? It seems neutered or scaled back. Does anyone know the reasoning behind this. After all the upgrades I decided to set up a RAID 1 mirror to back up wifey's clients forms and info instead of just relying on Time Machine. Well, that's a no go as it is no longer offered.

Not sure exactly why Disk Utility was scaled back. I can make one guess. I would bet not many users use the RAID feature. Thus I think that Apple likes to keep things as simple as possible…and removed a couple things. Of course the RAID feature has been around a long time…curious why it was removed now (maybe it was low priority…and a software engineer finally got around to removing it).

Instead one has to buy a $179 software to do it or $50 bucks for the limited basic version.

I would find it hard to believe that a free utility isn't available for free somewhere out in "internet-land".

What the hey? Time Machine has issues too. The last time I used it to restore I was missing some files. I was fortunate that the ones missing were no big loss, but next time? I just can't rely on it anymore.

So, thinking of buying Carbon Copy Cloner and backing stuff up that way. I think I can trust it more then CCC.

I don't think that there are any widespread Time Machine issues that I've heard of. Maybe just something quirky on your end.

What say you? Am I just being picky? Expecting too much from Apple?

If you consider ALL THE THINGS that Apple does…and ALL THE THINGS that Apple products do for us. And let's discount the Time Machine issue (since I don't think there's any widespread issues with Time Machine).

Isn't asking if "Apple Has Lost it's Edge" a bit much just because the RAID feature was removed from Disk Utility??

- Nick

 

[tiredretired]

It is called progress. Black day when the floppy was removed from the Bondi Blue iMac!!!

I dislike Time Machine as it is not bootable and prefer a cloning utility such as CarbonCopyCloner or SuperDuper installed via an external hard drive connected via FW. Both are bootable in the even of an internal hard drive failure. And I presume you did mean CCC is more reliable than Time Machine? I believe a 1TB external WD hard dive connected by FW800 would suit you best. I believe so few Mac users actually use RADID makes it somewhat unpractical and unprofitable.

The same is happening with less user upgradeable Macs. With the company's financial report from 2012, it was reported 98% of purchasers use their Macs as they come out of the box; no memory, CPU, gfx where available upgrades at all.

That is correct. As you say it makes a bootable copy and an exact copy, the definition of clone.

 

[tiredretired]

Not sure exactly why Disk Utility was scaled back. I can make one guess. I would bet not many users use the RAID feature. Thus I think that Apple likes to keep things as simple as possible…and removed a couple things. Of course the RAID feature has been around a long time…curious why it was removed now (maybe it was low priority…and a software engineer finally got around to removing it).



I would find it hard to believe that a free utility isn't available for free somewhere out in "internet-land".



I don't think that there are any widespread Time Machine issues that I've heard of. Maybe just something quirky on your end.



If you consider ALL THE THINGS that Apple does…and ALL THE THINGS that Apple products do for us. And let's discount the Time Machine issue (since I don't think there's any widespread issues with Time Machine).

Isn't asking if "Apple Has Lost it's Edge" a bit much just because the RAID feature was removed from Disk Utility??



- Nick

When things that are useful get taken away for no apparent reason, it leaves me, as well as others scratching heads, that is all. There are more then just a few stories around the internet about the loss of RAID and the neutering of disc utility. Apple has always been innovative and included such things, making OS/X what it is. When useful things get taken away and not replaced by something better, innovation takes the hit, that is all I am saying.

Just looking to get opinions and feedback. I got yours.

Cheers mate.

 

[harryb2448]

So, thinking of buying Carbon Copy Cloner and backing stuff up that way. I think I can trust it more then CCC.

Was cleaning up the typo error you wrote was all.


http://www.macworld.com/article/298...tool-for-storage-devices-gets-a-facelift.html

 

[tiredretired]

So, thinking of buying Carbon Copy Cloner and backing stuff up that way. I think I can trust it more then CCC.

Was cleaning up the typo error you wrote was all.

My typing skills are suspect at best. Thank you sir.

Cheers.

 

[harryb2448]

I guess it is brought about by changing demands of customers. Looking back over twenty years, many things have changed. Serial connections, floppy drives, zip drives, DVD-RW's, user upgradeable memory modules, graphics, e-SATA and these are just a couple of the top of the head. Regarding Disk Utility have a read of this article:-


http://www.macworld.com/article/298...tool-for-storage-devices-gets-a-facelift.html

 

[pigoo3]

When things that are useful get taken away for no apparent reason, it leaves me, as well as others scratching heads, that is all.

I understand…no problem Apple has made changes to the OS in the past (added & removed features)…useful & not useful. This time around it was the RAID feature in Disk Utility.

There are more then just a few stories around the internet about the loss of RAID and the neutering of disc utility.

Give me a topic (any topic)…and I'll find "more than just a few stories" on it on the internet about it. The point is. Probably less than 1 person in 1,000 (maybe 1 person in 10,000) or more…uses the RAID feature in Disk Utility. There are tons & tons of folks out there that don't even know how much ram is in their computer (or how to find this info out). These folks certainly aren't using RAID with HD's.

So MAYBE this is a reason Apple removed it. Keep things simple…and "maybe" keep folks from trying to use that feature (that don't know what it is)…and mess things up.

Apple has always been innovative and included such things, making OS/X what it is. When useful things get taken away and not replaced by something better, innovation takes the hit, that is all I am saying.

Everyone has their favorite features in the Mac OS (or included Mac Apps like Disk Utility). And when they are modified or removed…this will upset folks. This time around a feature you enjoyed was removed (so this change hit very close to "home").

Again. Removing a single feature like this in one app is not a strong enough reason to suddenly question…"Has Apple lost it's edge?".

If I put my mind to it…I could probably make a list as long as my arm of changes that Apple has made over the almost 30 years of my Apple experience that I didn't like. And because of this...I'm not going to ask…"Has Apple lost it's edge?".

- When Apple starts closing Apple Stores.
- When the price of Apple stock drops 25% in a single year (while competitors stock prices are stable).
- When someone says…"What's an iPhone?"
- When Apple's market share (in any category) drops significantly.
- When Apple starts charging $150 for OS upgrades.

Then we can start asking if Apple has lost its edge!

- Nick

 

[ipadder474]

Maybe it's just the fact today that Apple, is not caring a lot about their computers,and pushing their tablets and phones.
There is not a lot of money in a Disk Utility to be made for them.

 

[IWT]

@tiredretired

Totally support the use of cloning software for all the reasons you (and the others) have mentioned. Please make sure you use a dedicated External Hard Drive. Don't put it on the same EHD as Time Machine.

Although Harry and, indeed, others dislike Time Machine, I think there is a place for it despite its being unbootable. It is there to cope with the "Oh no, I've just gone and deleted.......whatever". Or the time when one of your non-Apple apps offers an update that simply doesn't work and "wouldn't it be great to have the old version back". So easy to go back in TM and find the deleted stuff or the previous version of the app and click Restore.

You seem to be having a problem with your TM. Perhaps after creating your clone and confirmed it's working, it might be a good idea to reformat your Time Machine EHD and start afresh. The first backup will be long, as you know, but thereafter the incremental BUs are speedy. This should ensure that there are no gremlins in your Time Machine.

Just my thoughts.

Ian

 

[tiredretired]

@tiredretired

Totally support the use of cloning software for all the reasons you (and the others) have mentioned. Please make sure you use a dedicated External Hard Drive. Don't put it on the same EHD as Time Machine.

Although Harry and, indeed, others dislike Time Machine, I think there is a place for it despite its being unbootable. It is there to cope with the "Oh no, I've just gone and deleted.......whatever". Or the time when one of your non-Apple apps offers an update that simply doesn't work and "wouldn't it be great to have the old version back". So easy to go back in TM and find the deleted stuff or the previous version of the app and click Restore.

You seem to be having a problem with your TM. Perhaps after creating your clone and confirmed it's working, it might be a good idea to reformat your Time Machine EHD and start afresh. The first backup will be long, as you know, but thereafter the incremental BUs are speedy. This should ensure that there are no gremlins in your Time Machine.

Just my thoughts.

Ian

And good thoughts they are. Thank you sir. My plan was to have two external hard drives with each partitioned in half. Each half to have Time Machine on one and CCC on the other. RAID 1 mirrored so to have two copies of each. I hope I am making this clear.

I still will do this, but now have to purchase the RAID software via third party or downgrade the OS/X to 10.10. I do not consider downgrading the OS X version an option at this point as otherwise I am enjoying the latest version very much. This is NOT the end of the world, but it will now cost monies I had not planned on spending and I generally only like surprises on Xmas and my birthday and today is neither. LOL.

Somehow, I will survive this. LOL. I may only be a MAC fan for five years now, but I am now one for life.

 

[chas_m]

For 99 percent of users, Disk Utility has not been "neutered" at all. Everything you used to be able to do with it, you can still do with it except RAID management. Yes, that feature has been removed (might be put back if enough people complain), but apart from that ... what specifically are you imagining has been "neutered," or is that just your way of saying "WAAAH, things are slightly different than they were and I hate change!!"

 

[pm-r]

Just for the benefit of the OP and their RAID backup intentions, it may be why Apple dropped the DU RAID part they refer to when reading this:

"RAID 1 Is Not a Backup

Although commonly used as part of a backup strategy, RAID 1 by itself is not an effective substitute for backing up your data. Here’s why. …"
http://macs.about.com/od/usingyourmac/ss/raidmirror.htm

But read for more…

 

[tiredretired]

Just for the benefit of the OP and their RAID backup intentions, it may be why Apple dropped the DU RAID part they refer to when reading this:

"RAID 1 Is Not a Backup

Although commonly used as part of a backup strategy, RAID 1 by itself is not an effective substitute for backing up your data. Here’s why. …"
http://macs.about.com/od/usingyourmac/ss/raidmirror.htm

But read for more…

Good article. Oh, and very interesting, page one concludes by saying this:

You can use RAID 1 for your startup drive, a data drive, or even your backup drive. In fact, combining a RAID 1 mirrored set and Apple’s Time Machine is an optimum backup method.

This is exactly what I said I want to do in my Post #11, before Disc Utility was neutered or scaled back. Of course I still can and will. It will just cost me extra money now.

 

[pm-r]

Did you happen to come across this comment for their RAID setup, but not sure it's exactly what you're wanting:

"I just did it, successfully - quit & restart with Option/Command/R - open Disk Utilities & BINGO! there it is> RAID as in Yosemite - I dragged my 2 HDs into it & I was good to go on a restart - no Terminal No nothing - Apple did't even know about it.
https://discussions.apple.com/thread/7266129?start=0&tstart=0

Just may be a nice cheap El Capitan RAID solution for you… if it works properly…

 

[tiredretired]

Did you happen to come across this comment for their RAID setup, but not sure it's exactly what you're wanting:

"I just did it, successfully - quit & restart with Option/Command/R - open Disk Utilities & BINGO! there it is> RAID as in Yosemite - I dragged my 2 HDs into it & I was good to go on a restart - no Terminal No nothing - Apple did't even know about it.
https://discussions.apple.com/thread/7266129?start=0&tstart=0

Just may be a nice cheap El Capitan RAID solution for you… if it works properly…

Now that is interesting. Thank you, thank you for posting that. Looks to me at first glance to be what we had before and that is just what I want.

I find it funny Apple does not know it is there. I'm no code writer, but it sounds to me someone forgot something. LOL.

Again, much appreciated.