This is a scary tale...

Emptyage — Yes, I was hacked. Hard.

From what I can search up, it seems to be a legit post and experience.

I have said from the beginning that the Cloud seems to be a disaster waiting to happen. I still think so, but this tale is eye opening. I had no idea that iCloud had such control over iDevices and Macs - if indeed the above posting is true.

How about some iCloud expert reading the link and posting the validity of the story?

That is indeed true and a good reminder to ensure that all your passwords are secure. Password managers like 1Password or the free Keepass are great at creating very strong passwords that don't get caught up in bruteforce or simple guessing hacks.

I wouldn't think the blame can be placed on cloud services since we all enjoy the benefits..

So a good warning to all: secure your passwords!

This would be a good opportunity to make use of the openssl install included with OS X. Here's an article on using it to generate random passwords.

Scary, yes. Preventable, sure. A 7 digit password? Really? Come on folks, wake up. None of my e-mail accounts have the same password so guessing one will not get to the other. My recovery email goes to my wife and vice versa. This is basic stuff here.

Does Apple share some of the blame? You bet. Getting around the security barrier while talking to an Apple rep is a serious breach on their part and they should have confirmed everything with him. If it comes down to it use the CC # on the iCloud account etc.

All that being said, I'll bet in the end the hacker is actually someone this guy knows, at the very least on-line but possibly in real life. Then again, life is random.

The comments on that linked file are entertaining since most of this isn't Apples fault but the posters and it could probably happen with any cloud based account service and someone who knows their way around.

What I got from reading the article was the Hack wasn't due as much to a fault on the writer's end (weak password) but by working through Apple Tech Support and in some manner convincing them the Hacker was the account holder.

EDIT: Typed too slow . . . Baggss beat me to he post.

Ah yes - the magic cloud - the solution to all your problems. I'll store my stuff locally, thanks.

I don't have, use or want iCloud, and iPhone, an iPad, Gmail or twitter - so I'm safe there.

This guy backs up his PHONE every night, but doesn't bother to back up his computer over a 2 year period? Says a lot about his priorities - or the value of whatever he has on his computer. In any case, I bet he'll start backing it up NOW.

anynamewilldo said:

Ah yes - the magic cloud - the solution to all your problems. I'll store my stuff locally, thanks.

I don't have, use or want iCloud, and iPhone, an iPad, Gmail or twitter - so I'm safe there.

This guy backs up his PHONE every night, but doesn't bother to back up his computer over a 2 year period? Says a lot about his priorities - or the value of whatever he has on his computer. In any case, I bet he'll start backing it up NOW.

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That's a pretty xenophobic view of cloud technologies (or even technologies in general), but to each his own I guess.

anynamewilldo said:

I don't have, use or want iCloud, and iPhone, an iPad, Gmail or twitter - so I'm safe there.

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I'm willing to bet that there is more of "you" online than you think.

Raz0rEdge said:

That's a pretty xenophobic view of cloud technologies (or even technologies in general), but to each his own I guess.

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I guess. I just try to avoid being sold stuff that I don't need - or convinced that, in fact, I do NEED it. FWIW, I'm not the only one who doesn't get warm & fuzzies about The Cloud: http://apple.slashdot.org/story/12/08/06/1533233/wozniak-predicts-horrible-problems-with-the-cloud

vansmith said:

I'm willing to bet that there is more of "you" online than you think.

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Me too. Unfortunately.

I didn't quite get my point across. Yes, there are far to many passwords out there that would stand up against a DOS 3.3 based cracker for about a microsecond. And way too many people using the same simple password on all their hardware and all of their web sites. But, it appears that this problem was entirely caused by Apple, but aggravated by the guy not even bothering to purchase a 59 dollar usb drive to use the very good Time Machine software that is provided free.

My problem is that the iCloud of the guy was hacked and it WIPED his Macbook, iPhone and iPad? Isn't that the tail wagging the dog? I could understand if he logged on and his data in the sky was missing, but how did the hacker get through to the BSD Unix that OSX runs on? The iCloud can override the admin password? I can't believe that. Besides, I run Mountain Lion now and I see no change to the security, and believe me, after reading that link, I have hammered on it with every tool I can come up with.

Do you have to provide the admin password to use iCloud? That would do it, but again, I can't believe that because...?

A. It's hard to believe that Apple would have the audacity to require that password for an online service.
B. It is also very difficult to believe that there might possibly be users out there so ignorant that they would give it out to ANYONE at ANYTIME for ANY reason. Clueless windows icon clickers, yes. But enlightened Mac owners?

I still don't follow what happened.

but aggravated by the guy not even bothering to purchase a 59 dollar usb drive to use the very good Time Machine software that is provided free.

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People are lazy. They don't worry about backups until it's too late.

My problem is that the iCloud of the guy was hacked and it WIPED his Macbook, iPhone and iPad?

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If I had to guess (and it's only a guess, since I don't use iCloud), this is a "feature" promulgated by Apple to its customers. The idea being that if your stuff is stolen, you can remotely wipe it using this service. It sounds like a good idea on the surface. Who wouldn't want to remotely wipe their stuff if it is stolen? But if you look a bit further, you can figure out, "gee, in order for that to work, I have to give access to my stuff to some third party" - if you think about that for more than a few seconds, you can easily realize that it's probably not a good idea.

B. It is also very difficult to believe that there might possibly be users out there so ignorant that they would give it out to ANYONE at ANYTIME for ANY reason.

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Are you kidding? Just look at all the people who walk around with their social security cards in their wallet or purse, succumb to various on-line scams (Nigerians - STILL!!), will happily let themselves have their rights trampled by the police, or even vote for the likes of Obama! People are clearly morons. I can see many of them giving up their passwords without too much resistance - esp. if they're the kind of people who go 2 years without backing up their data.

Clueless windows icon clickers, yes. But enlightened Mac owners?

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Oh come on. I like my Mac as much as the next guy - but Mac users certainly have no special technical awareness or ability - just look at many of the posts on this forum. I'm no Windows fan (not by a long stretch), but I'm not willing to believe that Mac users are typically more inclined to have such awareness relative to Windows users.

anynamewilldo said:

Oh come on. I like my Mac as much as the next guy - but Mac users certainly have no special technical awareness or ability - just look at many of the posts on this forum. I'm no Windows fan (not by a long stretch), but I'm not willing to believe that Mac users are typically more inclined to have such awareness relative to Windows users.

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Actually, that was mostly sarcasm, rather than a statement. However, I must disagree (and I am more of a Unix dude, rather than a dye-in-the-wool Mac user.) In my admittedly unscientific sampling of my friends, acquaintances, and customers, I notice that people who buy a computer as an appliance almost always go with the flow. i.e., they buy Windows because that is the "standard." That is the group of people who know nothing about how it works and care less. There is nothing wrong with that - I buy lattes on occasion and have no idea how the machine and the barista put it together. And don't care.

Mac users, on the other hand, paid more for a better machine. They did it because they at least had an interest in what they were going to buy and use and how well it worked. Not to say that they are all Gurus, but they tend to be more involved with the machine. Note that I didn't say that they were more intelligent, or handsome, or drive better cars. Just that they tend to take less for granted while using their machine and that translates to safer usage.

At the coffee shop, my Mac buddies will be showing me the enhanced features of this or that offering from the software company. My Windows friends will be demoing the latest really neat screen saver that they just downloaded from somewhere. And it was free, even. Imagine that.

cptkrf said:

Mac users, on the other hand, paid more for a better machine. They did it because they at least had an interest in what they were going to buy and use and how well it worked. Not to say that they are all Gurus, but they tend to be more involved with the machine. Note that I didn't say that they were more intelligent, or handsome, or drive better cars. Just that they tend to take less for granted while using their machine and that translates to safer usage.

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Evidently you don't know many university students since most of them buy Macs but fall into the "computer as a tool/I don't really know how to use them" group. The hivemind is alive and well there.

vansmith said:

Evidently you don't know many university students since most of them buy Macs but fall into the "computer as a tool/I don't really know how to use them" group. The hivemind is alive and well there.

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Well, you got me there. I have to say that college students are one faction that I have very little contact with now. Interesting. One would think that the campus would be the bastion of thought. Probably doesn't bode well for the country.

Come to think of it, my informal research results are probably greatly skewed by the fact that most of my acquaintances went to school back when parents and teachers were actually concerned about us learning something.

cptkrf said:

Well, you got me there. I have to say that college students are one faction that I have very little contact with now. Interesting. One would think that the campus would be the bastion of thought. Probably doesn't bode well for the country.

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Many of them are intelligent (and a considerable amount aren't, haha) but most of them don't have any interest in using it beyond consuming media, checking social networks and writing up assignments. In fact, most are still running the version of OS X that came with their machine even if they are a few iterations behind.

cptkrf said:

Well, you got me there. I have to say that college students are one faction that I have very little contact with now. Interesting. One would think that the campus would be the bastion of thought. Probably doesn't bode well for the country.

Come to think of it, my informal research results are probably greatly skewed by the fact that most of my acquaintances went to school back when parents and teachers were actually concerned about us learning something.

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It's not just college students. It's now a very good percentage of Windows users turned Mac. Whether that also consists of students, retiree's, soccer moms etc etc.. Then you have to consider WHY they're switching. Apple, for the past several years has marketed their computers as being virus free (technically OS X is free from native self propagating viruses, but you know the rest of the story) as well as easy to use and something that a new user won't have to struggle with even as a beginner.

The problem with that is they're coming over with all their old bad habits, and thinking : "I don't have to do anything, Apple told me I'm safe and I don't have to think about a thing. It "just works". Yeaaah, well... unfortunately, this is a mindset which IMO, Apple needs to change with people a bit. Self accountability has to come in to play at some point, because really, an Apple Genius can't be at someone's house when the hammer drops and so on.

Doug

Doug b said:

The problem with that is they're coming over with all their old bad habits, and thinking : "I don't have to do anything, Apple told me I'm safe and I don't have to think about a thing. It "just works". Yeaaah, well... unfortunately, this is a mindset which IMO, Apple needs to change with people a bit. Self accountability has to come in to play at some point, because really, an Apple Genius can't be at someone's house when the hammer drops and so on.

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This is my major concern with the whole ethos of complacency that lingers in the Apple community. Even Apple recognizes that the inevitable is more likely than ever in switching the language around viruses (see here). It's very much like people who drive like maniacs in the winter because they own SUVs - you can't go about life doing things with impunity because, eventually, tings will come back to bite you.

Back on topic, I was thinking about this and I have to say that, with pervasive mobile phone usage, two step authentication really should be more widely available with services like iCloud. I'm guessing that such a process could have saved this guy quite a few headaches.

cptkrf said:

In my admittedly unscientific sampling of my friends, acquaintances, and customers, I notice that people who buy a computer as an appliance almost always go with the flow.

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You have "sample bias".

i.e., they buy Windows because that is the "standard." That is the group of people who know nothing about how it works and care less.

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This is directly opposite my own experience and the "general stereotype" - for whatever that's worth.

Mac users, on the other hand, paid more for a better machine.

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Some did. Some just wanted to avoid Windows. Some just want to look cool. Some drink kool-aid.

At the coffee shop, my Mac buddies will be showing me the enhanced features of this or that offering from the software company. My Windows friends will be demoing the latest really neat screen saver that they just downloaded from somewhere. And it was free, even. Imagine that.

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You have a very small sample of the general population.

cptkrf said:

One would think that the campus would be the bastion of thought.

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Yeah.....not for a few hundred years.

Come to think of it, my informal research results are probably greatly skewed by the fact that most of my acquaintances went to school back when parents and teachers were actually concerned about us learning something.

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And there you go - you've discovered your sample bias

Back to the doofus in the story - so here is a guy who is a technology guy. He writes about it. He lives it. He breathes it. He is A DUDE in technology. And yet - he goes at least 2 years without making backups of his stuff - his lifeblood, his work materials - his professional life - AND he gives over access to these same materials to "the cloud" - simply taking it on faith that Apple (or whomever) will protect his digital assets. What does that say for the non-professional user?

anynamewilldo said:

Yeah.....not for a few hundred years.

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That's quite the broad generalization. As someone with multiple university degrees, I'd love to know what your logic and/or evidence is here.

vansmith said:

That's quite the broad generalization. As someone with multiple university degrees, I'd love to know what your logic and/or evidence is here.

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As someone with four university degrees, including two graduate degrees, I draw my opinion from my experience and publicly available information.

Its also no more of a broad generalization than "the campus" being a bastion of thought.