Apple: "We stopped supporting Carrier IQ with iOS 5"

OneMoreThing... · Dec 1, 2011

Apple: â??We stopped supporting Carrier IQ with iOS 5â?³

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alexsd123 · Dec 2, 2011

They only care when they get caught. Oh well, they all do it.

Lifeisabeach · Dec 2, 2011

alexsd123 said:
They only care when they get caught. Oh well, they all do it.

What does that even mean? Apple released iOS 5 long before this brouhaha developed. And more to the point, it's been demonstrated that Apple was not only collecting a very small subset of what the Carrier IQ software is capable of collecting, but that you have to actively opt IN to allow the collection; Apple has been upfront about WHAT is collected; and you can opt OUT any time you please.

alexsd123 · Dec 3, 2011

lifeisabeach said:
What does that even mean? Apple released iOS 5 long before this brouhaha developed. And more to the point, it's been demonstrated that Apple was not only collecting a very small subset of what the Carrier IQ software is capable of collecting, but that you have to actively opt IN to allow the collection; Apple has been upfront about WHAT is collected; and you can opt OUT any time you please.

Yeah, I definitely believe them...

Companies only care about doing something wrong when people find out... Why are they going to stop Carrier IQ if it wasn't doing anything bad? Hmmm...

And it was still found in iOS 3.13, 4, and 5... Most companies have done this and most are getting heat for it.

What were they using it for? Maybe they should release a statement exactly what they were doing with the data and what exactly that data was. I really don't trust them, as well as all the other phone manufacturers/providers.

Lifeisabeach · Dec 3, 2011

alexsd123 said:
What were they using it for? Maybe they should release a statement exactly what they were doing with the data and what exactly that data was. I really don't trust them, as well as all the other phone manufacturers/providers.

They have released a statement. You are commenting on a post related to that announcement.

I started to make a more in-depth response to your entire post, but decided against beating my head against a wall. The problem here is that you won't believe anything short of the worst possible scenario, no matter how much evidence that may come out showing Apple or anyone else involved, is doing nothing benevolent. You've outright stated as much. Debating with that mindset is an exercise in futility.

XJ-linux · Dec 3, 2011

alexsd123 said:
They only care when they get caught. Oh well, they all do it.

Well, as long as they all do it... guess that makes it alright. Back to the Michael Jackson Dr. trial... or Caylee Anthony... or something... This is probably something that more Fedgov regulations can fix. They are here to help.

resistance-goethe-logrus-surgol-hypercube69-demotivational-poster-1209587003.jpg

Dysfunction · Dec 3, 2011

Remember not to use anything other than cash, don't use computers, any cellular devices, frequent shopper cards, land line phones, or walk on the street. The sheer amount of data collected on everyone is massive. While that sounds reactionary, it's also very true.

I guess what I'm saying is that privacy, in the digital era, is largely gone. Might as well at least come to terms with that and focus on things that are worthy of concern.

_Stormin · Dec 3, 2011

alexsd123 said:
Yeah, I definitely believe them... .

You should. It has been demonstrated by numerous sources that unlike on other devices, you can turn off data collection on the iPhone.

Diagnostics & Usage ----> Automatically Send or Don't Send

It even shows you a log of what has been sent already and when.

alexsd123 · Dec 4, 2011

_Stormin said:
You should. It has been demonstrated by numerous sources that unlike on other devices, you can turn off data collection on the iPhone.

Diagnostics & Usage ----> Automatically Send or Don't Send

It even shows you a log of what has been sent already and when.

What I don't understand is why they are no longer supporting it if it was such a great thing? It seems like Apple used it appropriately, so they should have no reason to stop using it.

Lifeisabeach · Dec 4, 2011

alexsd123 said:
What I don't understand is why they are no longer supporting it if it was such a great thing? It seems like Apple used it appropriately, so they should have no reason to stop using it.

I already outlined reasons why Apple may have done so. It's not like Carrier IQ is the end-all be-all in diagnostic reporting.

EDIT: Oh wait, I had started to outline those reasons, then decided not to bother. It's simple: maybe they decided to develop and implement an in-house solution that was cheaper, had less of a compromise on performance, and/or provided better information. Simple as that. CIQ doesn't provide those tools or do the analyses out of the goodness of their hearts.

Dysfunction · Dec 4, 2011

Could also be due to public perception.

alexsd123 · Dec 4, 2011

lifeisabeach said:
I already outlined reasons why Apple may have done so. It's not like Carrier IQ is the end-all be-all in diagnostic reporting.

EDIT: Oh wait, I had started to outline those reasons, then decided not to bother. It's simple: maybe they decided to develop and implement an in-house solution that was cheaper, had less of a compromise on performance, and/or provided better information. Simple as that. CIQ doesn't provide those tools or do the analyses out of the goodness of their hearts.

Just seemed odd Apple decided to stop supporting CIQ after all this broke out. I think you're probably right, but I think it also has to do with public perception - as Dysfunction pointed out. It doesn't really seem like a coincidence to me. ;D

Lifeisabeach · Dec 4, 2011

Dysfunction said:
Could also be due to public perception.

alexsd123 said:
Just seemed odd Apple decided to stop supporting CIQ after all this broke out. I think you're probably right, but I think it also has to do with public perception - as Dysfunction pointed out. It doesn't really seem like a coincidence to me. ;D

They started phasing out the CIQ software with iOS 5. Before this whole debacle began. Apple seems prescient at times, but this would be a bit much to believe.

EDIT: I am totally making that my avatar. LOL!

vansmith · Dec 4, 2011

Dysfunction said:
I guess what I'm saying is that privacy, in the digital era, is largely gone. Might as well at least come to terms with that and focus on things that are worthy of concern.

Especially if you live in the UK (I don't mean to pick on the Brits here) - there is one CCTV camera for every thirty two people (source). Statistically, that study is flawed but no one seems to be able to get a solid figure any other way (which doesn't legitimate the flaws in methodology). Regardless, the consensus seems to be that CCTV cameras are everywhere which would signify that even walking around subjects you to scrutiny by someone you don't know.

XJ-linux · Dec 6, 2011

Sad state of affairs, people's apparent acceptance that privacy is gone and their attitude that fighting to reverse that trend is futile, useless, unpatriotic, and maybe even an indicator of malicious or criminal intent. Even more sad is that those who have accepted it seem to actually encourage those who don't accept it to do so and "not make waves". Say that "everyone does it" and it becomes some sort of unofficial right to do so. Funny how we individuals seem to be willing to give away discretion and privacy, yet those organizations who we ceed these things to seemingly fight tooth and nail to preserve theirs. And we defend them with fervor, loyalty and passion when they do it. We are truly a strange study. Reminds me of that demotivational poster...

Dysfunction · Dec 7, 2011

XJ-linux said:
Sad state of affairs, people's apparent acceptance that privacy is gone and their attitude that fighting to reverse that trend is futile, useless, unpatriotic, and maybe even an indicator of malicious or criminal intent. Even more sad is that those who have accepted it seem to actually encourage those who don't accept it to do so and "not make waves". Say that "everyone does it" and it becomes some sort of unofficial right to do so. Funny how we individuals seem to be willing to give away discretion and privacy, yet those organizations who we ceed these things to seemingly fight tooth and nail to preserve theirs. And we defend them with fervor, loyalty and passion when they do it. We are truly a strange study. Reminds me of that demotivational poster...

You obviously missed the point of my diatribe. (Of course, since I wasn't around these parts in 2000/2001 you'd have missed my extremely lengthy dissertations on such things as how American's are blatantly giving up freedom for the illusion of safety, how the war on drugs and the war on terror have effectively been a war on the constitution so.. with that).

Let me quote myself for you on that one.

focus on things that are worthy of concern.

Personally? Things I can turn OFF are way low on my list.

XJ-linux · Dec 7, 2011

Dysfunction said:
You obviously missed the point of my diatribe. (Of course, since I wasn't around these parts in 2000/2001 you'd have missed my extremely lengthy dissertations on such things as how American's are blatantly giving up freedom for the illusion of safety, how the war on drugs and the war on terror have effectively been a war on the constitution so.. with that).

What you may or may not have written a decade ago is irrelevant to me.

Dysfunction said:
Let me quote myself for you on that one.

focus on things that are worthy of concern.

Personally? Things I can turn OFF are way low on my list.

Rank your list of tolerable BS however you like. I don't really care. However, don't be surprised if some folks to view you as anything other than a part of one of the problems on their lists if you tacitly support a behavior by encouraging others to give up their concerns about it and focus on things that are deemed more "worthy of concern". That is also a false dichotomy. I don't know about you, but not everyone is single threaded. Many can focus on a wide variety of concerns without the exclusion of issues such as privacy.

Dysfunction · Dec 7, 2011

XJ-linux said:
What you may or may not have written a decade ago is irrelevant to me.

Rank your list of tolerable BS however you like. I don't really care. However, don't be surprised if some folks to view you as anything other than a part of one of the problems on their lists if you tacitly support a behavior by encouraging others to give up their concerns about it and focus on things that are deemed more "worthy of concern". That is also a false dichotomy. I don't know about you, but not everyone is single threaded. Many can focus on a wide variety of concerns without the exclusion of issues such as privacy.

Well, then how about this. I'm simply not going to bother with storing rage and hatred indefinitely. You can, I don't care. For the phones? Just turn the thing off and don't use it. There is your ULTIMATE expression of dissent. Short of that, it's purely whining IMO. Which, to be honest, is completely banal as you're not only guilty of tacit approval, but of hypocritical actions.

Apple: "We stopped supporting Carrier IQ with iOS 5"

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