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  1. #31
    Backing up files

    Member Since
    Feb 11, 2014
    Posts
    6
    Probably a dumb question, but as I understand it the primary advantage of cloning your HDl on an iMac is that when the hard drive fails you can boot back up on your cloned external drive. It works by the way, I've done it using Carbon Copy Clone. But from what I hear, on a new iMac changing out a hard drive is difficult, certainly not an option for me or probably many of us. I don't know the cost for Apple to switch it out, but obviously if you don't replace your hard drive, then the clone doesn't appear to have any advantage (for the new iMac.) unless you plan on running your iMac on an external drive.

    Am I missing something here? What's the problem with backing up via time machine using either UBS 3.0 or Thunderbolt?

    Thanks for any info....I have a new iMac, very please with it by the way.

    James

  2. #32
    Backing up files
    chscag's Avatar
    Member Since
    Jan 23, 2008
    Location
    Fort Worth, Texas
    Posts
    45,190
    Specs:
    27" iMac i5, 3.2 GHz, iPad 3, iPhone 5c, iPhone 6+, 3 iPods, Yosemite
    I don't know the cost for Apple to switch it out, but obviously if you don't replace your hard drive, then the clone doesn't appear to have any advantage (for the new iMac.) unless you plan on running your iMac on an external drive.

    Am I missing something here? What's the problem with backing up via time machine using either UBS 3.0 or Thunderbolt?
    The cost to swap out a hard drive in a 21.5" iMac will run about $275 - $300 depending on your location and the size of the drive. The same swap out for the 27" machine will likely be more.

    There is certainly no problem with backing up using Time Machine. As a matter of fact we highly recommend that you do just that on a regular basis. Having a clone of your internal hard drive is convenient if it should fail. I have had this happen to me and by having the clone I was able to boot and continue my work. Otherwise, I would have missed a cut off date or resorted to finishing my work on an iPad. If you've ever tried to edit a long document or put together a briefing on an iPad, it's quite a challenge - especially for a dinosaur like myself.

  3. #33
    Backing up files
    Slydude's Avatar
    Member Since
    Nov 15, 2009
    Location
    North Louisiana, USA
    Posts
    8,528
    Specs:
    2.8 GHz MacBook Pro 10.10.2, 8 GB mem, iPhone 6+
    Even with the newer machines I think a clone is a good idea. Even though the drive on some of the newer machines isn't user replaceable the clone is still useful. It's possible to boot from a clone and run that way until the drive can be repaired / replaced.

    I''ve run that way for several days at a time and there's no real reason it couldn't be done indefinitely. It's slower than the internal drive but that's about the only drawback for desktop Macs.
    Sylvester Roque Former Contributing Editor About This Particular Macintosh

    "Got Time to breathe. You got time for music." Denver Pyle as Briscoe Darling

  4. #34
    Backing up files
    Collin Bl's Avatar
    Member Since
    Apr 07, 2009
    Location
    Napier NZ
    Posts
    3,291
    Specs:
    27 iMac i5, MBP 13 & iMac 20, 2TB dual TC, AppleTV, iPh4S
    Here is my system FWIW;
    have a 2 bay SOHO tank and a 3rd off site HD. After SuperDuper bakUp swap over with Off Site HD fortnightly. Theft and fire covered and minimum down time with HD failures, in fact a week after the HD on 24 iMac failed the HD on MBP failed so was inop for 15 hours.

    Have daily Time Machine back up to Time Caps for both wifes iMac and my iMac which has helped a couple of times chasing down a historic version of an overwritten file.

    All that on Fire Wire 800 so regular backups to SOHO tank takes about 10 - 14 mins.

  5. #35
    Backing up files
    urbanman2004's Avatar
    Member Since
    Jul 05, 2011
    Location
    Rock Town, USA
    Posts
    51
    Specs:
    In sig
    Quote Originally Posted by Dogbreath View Post
    I recommend using TM and a bootable backup software as these gentlemen have discussed. A bootable backup will allow you to continue to use your computer in case of hdd failure. CCC was a life-saver for me when my internal hdd died.

    I also recommend burning all photo, video, and music files to flash drives...or DVD if you have an optical drive of some sort. Considering the convenience, storage capacity and cost, flash drives are a good deal.
    CCC is what does it for me

  6. #36
    Backing up files
    MBP17•David's Avatar
    Member Since
    Feb 04, 2014
    Location
    England
    Posts
    517
    Specs:
    MBP17 8GB 2x960GB SSDs 10.9 • MBA11 4/128GB 10.9 • TC 2TB • TV3 • iPh6 128GB • iPh6+ 128GB
    I have:

    • Weekly TM backups to a TC;
    • Daily CCC clone of both 960GB SSDs to two 1TB external drives;
    • Separate weekly clone of iTunes library to another external drive;
    • grsync backup of all documents to a couple of 128GB USB sticks - about 3 times a week;
    • grsync weekly backup of Mail to 64GB USB stick;
    • daily CCC image clones of both SSDs to an offsite 3TB HDD (took a very long time to do the first sparseimage, but quite manageable now - about 10-15min)
    • Also grsync does weekly Digital Photographs folder sync between MBP17 and MBA11 and backs up to an offsite drive.


    Separate arrangements for when I travel - portable CCC clones etc ...

    MBA11, which is mostly used by my wife, gets weekly TM backups and weekly CCC clone, which I suspect is overkill, but I'm sure those videos of piano playing cats are important

    Haven't used DVD or BluRay for about three years now as a backup medium.
    Dvid

  7. #37
    Backing up files
    chscag's Avatar
    Member Since
    Jan 23, 2008
    Location
    Fort Worth, Texas
    Posts
    45,190
    Specs:
    27" iMac i5, 3.2 GHz, iPad 3, iPhone 5c, iPhone 6+, 3 iPods, Yosemite
    MBA11, which is mostly used by my wife, gets weekly TM backups and weekly CCC clone, which I suspect is overkill, but I'm sure those videos of piano playing cats are important
    Believe me, it's not overkill. I make a CCC cloned backup every other day and Time Machine once a week - or more often if needed. And in your situation if you can keep the wife happy - that means you'll be happy.

  8. #38
    Backing up files
    urbanman2004's Avatar
    Member Since
    Jul 05, 2011
    Location
    Rock Town, USA
    Posts
    51
    Specs:
    In sig
    Quote Originally Posted by MBP17•David View Post
    I have:

    • Weekly TM backups to a TC;
    • Daily CCC clone of both 960GB SSDs to two 1TB external drives;
    • Separate weekly clone of iTunes library to another external drive;
    • grsync backup of all documents to a couple of 128GB USB sticks - about 3 times a week;
    • grsync weekly backup of Mail to 64GB USB stick;
    • daily CCC image clones of both SSDs to an offsite 3TB HDD (took a very long time to do the first sparseimage, but quite manageable now - about 10-15min)
    • Also grsync does weekly Digital Photographs folder sync between MBP17 and MBA11 and backs up to an offsite drive.


    Separate arrangements for when I travel - portable CCC clones etc ...

    MBA11, which is mostly used by my wife, gets weekly TM backups and weekly CCC clone, which I suspect is overkill, but I'm sure those videos of piano playing cats are important

    Haven't used DVD or BluRay for about three years now as a backup medium.
    That would be a little overkill for me, but to each their own. Don't get me wrong, I condone whatever method you feel is safe enough to secure your data.

  9. #39
    Backing up files

    Member Since
    Sep 06, 2013
    Posts
    38
    I have a related question. I use CCC to back up my rather large collection of photographs on a daily basis.
    I believe that somewhere in this thread, someone recommended that this back up drive should be bootable. I did not think of this when I set up CCC several years ago. How can I tell whether my back-up disk is bootable and if it is not can I now make it so without having to re-save all my data?

  10. #40
    Backing up files

    Member Since
    Mar 12, 2014
    Posts
    12
    Quote Originally Posted by DougStocks View Post
    I have a related question. I use CCC to back up my rather large collection of photographs on a daily basis.
    I believe that somewhere in this thread, someone recommended that this back up drive should be bootable. I did not think of this when I set up CCC several years ago. How can I tell whether my back-up disk is bootable and if it is not can I now make it so without having to re-save all my data?
    I use SuperDuper, but you could certainly check if it's bootable by going to system prefs and selecting Startup Disk, if it's bootable it will show up there. My guess is it won't be bootable and you won't be able to make it bootable without redoing it.

  11. #41
    Backing up files

    Member Since
    Sep 06, 2013
    Posts
    38
    Quote Originally Posted by quizzical View Post
    I use SuperDuper, but you could certainly check if it's bootable by going to system prefs and selecting Startup Disk, if it's bootable it will show up there. My guess is it won't be bootable and you won't be able to make it bootable without redoing it.
    Thank you for your assistance. You are correct, it was not there. Since posting my query, it has occurred to me that this really is not very important. If I had a catastrophic failure of my internal HD, I would either have it repaired & get a new OS put on it, or, more likely, just buy a new Mac. Is there a fallacy in my reasoning?

  12. #42
    Backing up files

    Member Since
    Mar 12, 2014
    Posts
    12
    Quote Originally Posted by DougStocks View Post
    Thank you for your assistance. You are correct, it was not there. Since posting my query, it has occurred to me that this really is not very important. If I had a catastrophic failure of my internal HD, I would either have it repaired & get a new OS put on it, or, more likely, just buy a new Mac. Is there a fallacy in my reasoning?
    There is no question of 'fallacy' of reasoning because you haven't given any reasoning for making your choice. Having said that, I recently had an iMac repaired and completely unnecessarily Apple reformatted my HDD, I know they did it in this case just to be asses, but it mattered not to me because I just cloned my clone back to the HDD and wa la, exactly as it was when I handed it in. I'm not sure if TM is able to do this type of thing or not. Also another side benefit of cloning a bootable clone of your internal HDD back to the HDD is that during the process ALL the fragmentation that was on the internal drive and is also on the clone to a lesser extent is completely removed in the restored internal drive. Hope that wasn't too confusing.

  13. #43
    Backing up files

    Member Since
    Sep 06, 2013
    Posts
    38
    Quote Originally Posted by quizzical View Post
    There is no question of 'fallacy' of reasoning because you haven't given any reasoning for making your choice. Having said that, I recently had an iMac repaired and completely unnecessarily Apple reformatted my HDD, I know they did it in this case just to be asses, but it mattered not to me because I just cloned my clone back to the HDD and wa la, exactly as it was when I handed it in. I'm not sure if TM is able to do this type of thing or not. Also another side benefit of cloning a bootable clone of your internal HDD back to the HDD is that during the process ALL the fragmentation that was on the internal drive and is also on the clone to a lesser extent is completely removed in the restored internal drive. Hope that wasn't too confusing.
    No, not confusing (or I'm so confused I don't know I'm confused). And you give a very good reason for making the BU HD bootable. I reckon I'll just move my present BU to an off-site location and then start a new BU, this time making it bootable.

  14. #44
    Backing up files

    Member Since
    Mar 12, 2014
    Posts
    12
    Quote Originally Posted by DougStocks View Post
    No, not confusing (or I'm so confused I don't know I'm confused). And you give a very good reason for making the BU HD bootable. I reckon I'll just move my present BU to an off-site location and then start a new BU, this time making it bootable.
    Another more obscure reason for having a bootable clone is that you can use it as a sandbox for example if you have some software to install, and you suspect it may possibly cause some problems, or if you remove it you don't want any trace of it on your system. Or if you simply want to do an update but you are a bit concerned that you may not like it and won't be able to revert back, then you can boot from your bootable clone and do the installation there, check it out thoroughly and if you don't like it just ignore it and boot back into your system, the clone will be restored next time you update it. I presume that CCC has a smart update function like SuperDuper where it only updates what has changed.

  15. #45
    Backing up files

    Member Since
    Sep 06, 2013
    Posts
    38
    Yes, the option I use for CCC does only update those items that have changed. Thanks for the "sandbox" tip. Would that also work with regard to the OS? I'm reluctant to upgrade from my Snow Leopard, but I know that eventually this will become a necessity.

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