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  1. #1


    Member Since
    Nov 01, 2009
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    My Apple Experience--Nice computer, Good Value NO
    I was an Apple user since 1984 and switched to XP about 6 years ago, because the new Apples wouldn't support my expensive SCSI device.

    As that PC and peripheral became obsolete, I decided to return to Apple. For what it's worth I like Apple and indeed am enjoying my new Imac.

    What's disturbs me however is the company's lack of consideration for customers. This was previously demonstrated with the early iphones when the early adopters were left with an obsolete device just a few months after the product launch.

    My experience was not as gross but very costly. I purchased in early October a "top of the line" Imac. I knew there might be newer ones coming but the company in its top secret mode didn't give a hint; didn't discount old models; and seemed to be on hold until next year.

    I was therefore quite amazed to find that my top of the line model became the entry level in mid November at $700 less in cost.

    The moral of the story is that Apple, one of the most profitable companies in the world won't hesitate to scam it's customers--they do something for those purchasing within 10 days of the change but nothing for others I'm told.

    In the PC world there are many many options, prices are driven down by competition and much better value for power available--albeit without the nice bells and whistles of Apple OS.

    I've suggested to Apple (no response) that they signal new models by discounting and perhaps earlier announcements. This would give their loyal (and disloyal) customers the choice of waiting for new models or getting a deal on the older ones. I'm sure there are numerous other purchasers who have been similarly bruised by this company who will consider other options next time they purchase--I certainly will.

    Cycledoc

  2. #2

    yamawho's Avatar
    Member Since
    Nov 07, 2009
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    Montreal, Quebec
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    Specs:
    Mac Mini late 09 version
    I feel your pain but as with any computer hardware, it will go down.

    It would be good if Apple offered a 30 day price guaranty, this way they could keep a secret and offer people in your situation a credit redeemable at the Apple store.

    In my case, I was surprised when the new Mini went down 100$ CAD from the previous model and got a faster cpu, more ram and larger hdd. This resulted in me making an impulse purchase

    I was very upset a few years ago with Apple when the Canadian dollar was worth 20% more then the US and they did not adjust the price one cent!

  3. #3

    Raz0rEdge's Avatar
    Member Since
    Jul 17, 2009
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    MA
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    27" i7 iMac, 24" iMac, 13" Macbook Air, iPhone 6S, iPod Nano 7th GeniPad 3
    And I ask you this..the new iMac you bought, was that the best fit for your needs when you were looking? With the introduction of the new iMac's, did it somehow stop doing all that you expected it would do when you bought it?

    My guess at those answers are yes and no. The only thing you are most likely feeling is the sting of having paid a higher price for a model only to have it drop in price when a newer model shows up. But that doesn't reduce the ability of your existing iMac..

    If you were planning on keeping your iMac for a while..then why not enjoy it..as @yamawho stated, hardware prices are always plumetting..

    The PC I build barely 2 years ago for just over $1000 with a top of the line Core2Duo and 2GB of memory is an entry level PC now. But I built what was appropriate for my needs and budget at that time..I can't begrudge others who manage to get a Quad Core with 8GB for the same price..

    Now to the fact that Apple is secretive about their product launches..and the fact that they CAN be in this day and age is absolutely amazing..but all that about dropping prices and all doesn't make business sense..and when you look past all the Apple cult stuff..Apple is a business trying to make a profit..pure and simple..

    I don't believe you were scammed in any shape or form..

    And oh..before you think I'm some Apple loving fanboy in love with the company..I just bought my first Mac about 6 months ago..so this is the perspective of a long time Computer user..

    Regards

  4. #4


    Member Since
    Nov 01, 2009
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    19
    You're right scam is a little strong but it is defined as : "an attempt to intentionally mislead a person or persons (known as the mark) usually with the goal of financial or other gain."

    Regarding your PC you've used it two years and your pricing was less than half that of the Mac--and with today's technology would still be half that of the MAC.

    For what it's worth I'm enjoying my MAC. But $700 in one month.....Please.

    The company is one of the most profitable in the world, earns a premium for it's product and should do better for its customers.

  5. #5

    pigoo3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cycledoc22 View Post
    The company is one of the most profitable in the world, earns a premium for it's product and should do better for its customers.
    Can you provide a link to back up this statement?

    - Nick
    - Too many "beachballs", read this: Beachballs
    - Computer seems slower than it used to? Read this for some slow computer tips: Speedup
    - Almost full hard drive? Some solutions. Out of Space
    - Apple Battery Info. Battery

  6. #6

    cwa107's Avatar
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    Dec 20, 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by pigoo3 View Post
    Can you provide a link to back up this statement?

    - Nick
    See their last earnings report. Apple makes money hand over fist every single quarter and are easily one of the most profitable computer companies in the world.

    With that said, technology changes constantly. As many of these threads as I've seen, my advice remains the same - buy the computer you need when you need it and it will continue to serve those needs long after upgraded models are released. Also, don't look at your computer as an investment. As with a car, it devalues the instant you pull it out of the lot. So although you may look at it as having lost $700 the instant the new model was released, at least some of that money was lost the instant you broke the seal on the box.
    Liquid and computers don't mix. It might seem simple, but we see an incredible amount of people post here about spills. Keep drinks and other liquids away from your expensive electronics!

    https://youtu.be/KHZ8ek-6ccc

  7. #7

    pigoo3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cwa107 View Post
    See their last earnings report. Apple makes money hand over fist every single quarter and are easily one of the most profitable computer companies in the world.
    It also sort of depends on how you define profit. Profit can be the absolute profit a company earns after all expenses...or it could be the amount of money the company makes per item sold.

    For example...if Apple only made $50 dollars on every computer sold (I don't know how much they actually make, but we know profit margins are slim on computers)...I would not consider that outrageous for a product that may cost $1000-$1500 dollars!

    Here's Apple profit ranking for 2009 (2008 profit)...#71 on the Fortune 500 list:

    Apple 2008 Revenue Profit 2009 Fortune 500 Rank : Finance : eConsultant

    Although #71 is high...there still are 70 companies ahead of it including these high-tech firms:

    - Hewlett-Packard
    - IBM
    - Dell
    - Microsoft
    - Cisco
    - Intel

    Remember...profit is not just a function of how much money you make per unit sold (in this case per Apple computer sold)...it's also a function of how BIG the company is.

    For example both Kraft Foods and Procter & Gamble have larger profits than Apple...but that's because both of those companies are very large.

    I think that the OP is suggesting that Apple is very very profitable due to the amount of $$$ they make per computer sold...and I really don't think that is the case.

    - Nick
    - Too many "beachballs", read this: Beachballs
    - Computer seems slower than it used to? Read this for some slow computer tips: Speedup
    - Almost full hard drive? Some solutions. Out of Space
    - Apple Battery Info. Battery

  8. #8


    Member Since
    Sep 07, 2009
    Posts
    41
    The other computer companies do the price guarantee because they're competing with companies in the exact same business with no real exceptions.

    Apple is a computer company, but quite different from the others that would've been mentioned above. They design and make their own computers that visually look very different from other would be competitors. Their OS is also something that isn't purchased off the shelf to work with anything.

    Anticipation in this case leads to excitement about Apple products coming out. It's on of their best marketing strategies. It's like getting a wrapped present, you have no idea what it is, you can only speculate. Rather than knowing exactly what you'll be getting and letting the hype of it ruin the experience because it doesn't do exactly what your imagination lead you to believe.

    I don't see Apple having to do the rest as their product is somewhat more of a luxury item than other computers and not subject to the same marketing, nor policies. The computer does what you wanted it to do or you would've have purchased it. A better model comes out a little while after you purchased yours. If a company believes that they'll lose marketshare to another then they'll put things such as price matches into place, but Apple knows it has a very devoted client base which makes a marketshare that can't get another product similar elsewhere. So why would they need to change what they do?

  9. #9


    Member Since
    Nov 01, 2009
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    You are confusing revenue vs profit. There is a difference.

    For what it's worth the NY times reported a 47% increase in profits for Apple in the 4th quarter of 2009. http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/20/te...s/20apple.html

    Fortune magazine notes Apple to be the 28th most profitable company overall. This was before the end of year results.

    It's indisputable that Apple makes lots of money.

    They don't need to change anything unless enough of their customers are unhappy. That capitalism.

  10. #10

    pigoo3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cycledoc22 View Post
    You are confusing revenue vs profit. There is a difference.

    For what it's worth the NY times reported a 47% increase in profits for Apple in the 4th quarter of 2009. http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/20/te...s/20apple.html

    Fortune magazine notes Apple to be the 28th most profitable company overall. This was before the end of year results.

    It's indisputable that Apple makes lots of money.
    You're right...the link I provided lists the companies according to revenue not profit.

    And sure Apple makes a lot of money...so do a lot of other companies. But your accusations in your original post seem to suggest that because Apple makes a lot of money...that they are "scamming" customers:

    'The moral of the story is that Apple, one of the most profitable companies in the world won't hesitate to scam it's customers..."

    ...which I do not agree with!

    - Nick
    - Too many "beachballs", read this: Beachballs
    - Computer seems slower than it used to? Read this for some slow computer tips: Speedup
    - Almost full hard drive? Some solutions. Out of Space
    - Apple Battery Info. Battery

  11. #11

    Dysfunction's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cycledoc22 View Post

    It's indisputable that Apple makes lots of money.
    It's also indisputable that this is exactly the goal, and to some extent both a legal and ethical requirement, of all companies.

    Additionally, no one should be surprised that prices dropped with the economy. This is true in pretty much every consumer segment out there. Actually, bicycles took a bigger hit cost wise in the same period.
    mike
    This machine kills fascists
    Got # ? phear the command line!

  12. #12

    yamawho's Avatar
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    Nov 07, 2009
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    Specs:
    Mac Mini late 09 version
    Lets not forget that windows 7 has just launched ...

    Apple does alot of windows bashing, take thier TV ads for example.

    Might be a profitable xmas for Apple.

  13. #13


    Member Since
    Apr 09, 2009
    Location
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    13 inch alMacBook 2GHz C2D 4G DDR3, 1.25GHz G4 eMac
    Quote Originally Posted by Cycledoc22 View Post
    You're right scam is a little strong but it is defined as : "an attempt to intentionally mislead a person or persons (known as the mark) usually with the goal of financial or other gain."

    Regarding your PC you've used it two years and your pricing was less than half that of the Mac--and with today's technology would still be half that of the MAC.

    For what it's worth I'm enjoying my MAC. But $700 in one month.....Please.

    The company is one of the most profitable in the world, earns a premium for it's product and should do better for its customers.
    According to the definition you gave, you didn't get scammed. You had a list of products in front of you that were currently available and what the price of each was. You paid what the product cost and got the top of the line product. There was no misleading you at all. That was what was available at the time. The salespeople aren't made aware of the new products so they cannot say to you whether or not a new model is coming out, they don't know. If you had done your research and checked out the average time between updates of iMac models, you'd have seen that we were due for a new iMac and could have waited on your purchase. This is the tech sector. It's fast moving. Your computer is still very capable, so relax.

    Also, Apple does offer price cuts... check out the special deals and refurbished Mac pages on the Apple store website. The machines that they had left over from the old model when the new models show up are usually on those pages shortly after an update.

  14. #14

    vansmith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cycledoc22 View Post
    I've suggested to Apple (no response) that they signal new models by discounting and perhaps earlier announcements. This would give their loyal (and disloyal) customers the choice of waiting for new models or getting a deal on the older ones. I'm sure there are numerous other purchasers who have been similarly bruised by this company who will consider other options next time they purchase--I certainly will.
    First off, and this is not unique to Apple, companies aren't going to change their whole marketing and development strategy because you complained that you're machine "lost value" (high end to mid-range). This is how all companies work. Secondly, you have an obvious lack of awareness of how the technology industry works. Things change, prices get cheaper and antiquated (in terms of tech products) technology gets relegated to a "lower" status (again, your machine going from high end to mid-range).

    Why does this problem seem to be specific to Apple? It seems that if product overhauls aren't made public (in the sense that announcements are made), people don't seem to care. Perhaps the most important question to be asked though is this: does your machine do what you want it to do? If so, what do you care? If not, buy a new machine.

    If you had waited and bought the machine in November, would this have somehow precluded you from complaining about new product releases when Apple updated those machines? What is an appropriate time frame for Apple to not update their machines so you can be happy?
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  15. #15


    Member Since
    Nov 01, 2009
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    vansmith: yes you are right that this isn't specific to Apple but Apple does charge a very high dollar premium for it's product. One would expect premium consideration of its customers and some protection for them when they purchase the product. At least I would, perhaps that's my delusion. And no, if there were a decent interval between purchase and upgrade I would not be complaining.

    darkestritual: Did Apple know that it was releasing within one month new hardware that moved the top of the line computer to entry level? If yes, than it was at least deceptive on their part to sell the old model at full price. As I noted above maybe not a scam certainly not the behavior of a company that values its customers and wants to encourage brand loyalty.

    As I said at the start quality yes, value NO.

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