TimeMachine on windows shared NAS drive

etaf · Sep 3, 2014

I have seen recently that NAS devices are saying they can backup windows and mac to the same harddrive on the NAS
I understood that for timemachine to recover the data correctly - the drive needed to be formatted as MAC OS EXTENDED (JORNULDED) / GUID PARTITION TABLE

and that although timemachine will write to a drive on other formats NTFS / FAT32 - it would NOT be able to recovery the files.

I'm looking at this for a friend who has a mixture of 2 windows PCs and a Mac - and I'm suggesting using a 2TB NAS connected to the router - as at the moment they are quite cheap and on special offers on the UK

any advice welcome and thanks for taking the time to answer

RadDave · Sep 3, 2014

etaf said:
I have seen recently that NAS devices are saying they can backup windows and mac to the same harddrive on the NAS
I understood that for timemachine to recover the data correctly - the drive needed to be formatted as MAC OS EXTENDED (JORNULDED) / GUID PARTITION TABLE

and that although timemachine will write to a drive on other formats NTFS / FAT32 - it would NOT be able to recovery the files.

I'm looking at this for a friend who has a mixture of 2 windows PCs and a Mac - and I'm suggesting using a 2TB NAS connected to the router - as at the moment they are quite cheap and on special offers on the UK

Hello and welcome to the forum!

You might ask your friend to simply join the forum - assume he or she has an internet connection - would make exchanges easier - just saying?

Not sure 'what' NAS storage is being considered (size, RAID or not, brand/model, etc.), but if backup of both PCs (NTFS) & Apple (Mac OS Extended) machines to one external HD is desired, then I guess partitioning the drive into two different formats would be one solution - quoted below is a shorten post of HD formatting from Mac Rumors which might be useful.

A Mac OS Extended partition would be needed if Time Machine and/or cloning software is to be used for the Mac computer; as to the other partition(s) - review the options and solutions are suggested. Of course, two external HDs could be used w/ each formatted appropriately - please post back, as needed. Dave

Format A Hard Drive Using Disk Utility (which is in your /Applications/Utilities folder)

Choose the appropriate format:

HFS+ (Hierarchical File System, a.k.a. Mac OS Extended (Journaled) Don't use case-sensitive)
Read/Write HFS+ from native Mac OS X
Required for Time Machine or Carbon Copy Cloner or SuperDuper! backups of Mac OS X system files.
To Read/Write HFS+ from Windows, Install MacDrive
To Read HFS+ (but not Write) from Windows, Install HFSExplorer
Maximum file size: 8EiB
Maximum volume size: 8EiB
Mac OS X: Mac OS Extended format (HFS Plus) volume and file limits
You can use this format if you only use the drive with Mac OS X, or use it for backups of your Mac OS X internal drive, or if you only share it with one Windows PC (with MacDrive installed on the PC)

NTFS (Windows NT File System)
Read/Write NTFS from native Windows.
Read only NTFS from native Mac OS X
To Read/Write/Format NTFS from Mac OS X, here are some alternatives:
For Mac OS X 10.4 or later (32 or 64-bit), install Paragon (approx $20) (Best Choice for Lion)
For 32-bit Mac OS X, install NTFS-3G for Mac OS X (free) (does not work in 64-bit mode)
For 64-bit Snow Leopard, read this: MacFUSE for 64-bit Snow Leopard
Some have reported problems using Tuxera (approx $36).
Native NTFS support can be enabled in Snow Leopard and Lion, but is not advisable, due to instability.
AirPort Extreme (802.11n) and Time Capsule do not support NTFS
Maximum file size: 16 TB
Maximum volume size: 256TB
You can use this format if you routinely share a drive with multiple Windows systems.

FAT32 (File Allocation Table)
Read/Write FAT32 from both native Windows and native Mac OS X.
Maximum file size: 4GB.
Maximum volume size: 2TB
You can use this format if you share the drive between Mac OS X and Windows computers and have no files larger than 4GB.

Slydude · Sep 3, 2014

I haven't tried backing up both Mac and Windows to the same NAS so I can't comment from personal experience. When Time Machine backups are created on a network drive they are saved in a large sparse bundle file. In that case I don't think Time Machine expects the drive to be formatted as Mac OS Extended Journaled.

RadDave · Sep 3, 2014

Slydude said:
I haven't tried backing up both Mac and Windows to the same NAS so I can't comment from personal experience. When Time Machine backups are created on a network drive they are saved in a large sparse bundle file. In that case I don't think Time Machine expects the drive to be formatted as Mac OS Extended Journaled.

Hi Sly... - I've never tried to backup Windows & Mac computers onto the same drive, so have no experience, but my feeling was that Time Machine requires a Mac OS Extended (Journaled) format, so would guess that two partitions w/ different formats might work? For myself, I'd probably use two separate external drives. Thanks for the input. Dave

Slydude · Sep 3, 2014

Several years ago I had an old drive around and decided to try a procedure for creating a drive with one Mac partition and one Windows partition. It seems that every time I connected that drive the Windows partition mounted successfully but the Mac partition would not mount unless I did it manually.

I suspect that what the OP wants to do can be done because Time Machine backups to network drives do nt specifically require Mac OS Extended Journaled as the format. I've seen a post or two suggesting that what the OP wants can be done. The directions are a bit dated and may have unnecessary steps. I'll have to do a bit more research.

@OP I would probably attach separate drives to the NAS and put the Windows backup on one drive and Mac data on the other. The advantage is that in the event of errors the drives can be connected directly to a Mac or PC and checked for errors.

etaf · Sep 4, 2014

Thanks for all your replies

The friend will not be able to reply, as they have very little understanding of technology and look to me to provide all the support

The NAS I have looked into , are single drive devices from seagate/WD quite cheap at the moment as on offer @ £89 - £100 each

Its just the adverts mentions can be used with Mac and Windows
Home Sharing, Media Streaming, Wireless Backup | Seagate

Back up multiple PCs and Mac computers

My Cloud

Flexible backup options

Back up, your way. PC users, WD SmartWare Pro offers options for how, when and where you back up your files. Mac users, utilize all the features of Apple Time Machine backup software to protect your data.

I suspect i will need to contact the company directly, as most of the replies indicate my understanding

And more of my firends and family - who all turn to me for help - are buying macs now

RadDave · Sep 4, 2014

etaf said:
......
The friend will not be able to reply, as they have very little understanding of technology and look to me to provide all the support

The NAS I have looked into , are single drive devices from seagate/WD quite cheap at the moment as on offer @ £89 - £100 each..........

Well, after reading the first statement above, you should likely offer the easiest to understand and least confusing solution(s) - I have 2 Seagate 1 TB external HDs to backup my iMac & MBpro using Time Machine which is virtually automatic once setup - the drives are of course formatted as Mac OS Extended (Journaled). You can then add a separate drive for the PC backups formatted as NTFS (or FAT32 depending on their needs, understanding the advantages & limitations from my previous post) - good luck! Dave

BTW, the Seagate drives like I own (probably newer models) are running $70 each on Amazon.

etaf · Sep 4, 2014

you have been very helpful and quick to reply, I think thats the best solution

adding an external harddrive do you just leave it connected all the time to a desktop
if the external harddrive fails - what happens on the Mac - do you get a message or is it just a note at the top of the screen on the time machine icon

I also read that if there is no device attached to backup to - then it will cache the 1hour changes and when the drive is re-connected it backs up all the missing data

thanks again for the help

RadDave · Sep 4, 2014

etaf said:
......
adding an external harddrive do you just leave it connected all the time to a desktop
if the external harddrive fails - what happens on the Mac - do you get a message or is it just a note at the top of the screen on the time machine icon......

On my iMac, I keep the external HD always attached; you can check in Finder to see if the HD is 'mounted' and also run 'Verify' on the drive from Disk Utility; if a problem arises, a notification should indicate a 'failed TM backup' - then Disk Utility's repair feature may be helpful - more information HERE.

Now I've been considering buying an external dual HD w/ RAID 1 just to be sure, BUT I also do 'cloning' w/ CCC (Carbon Copy Cloner) on both our Macs - in addition, I backup our personal files w/ the online service Carbonite on the iMac & an external LaCie SSD on the laptop - redundancy is KING!

etaf said:
.......
I also read that if there is no device attached to backup to - then it will cache the 1hour changes and when the drive is re-connected it backs up all the missing data....

On my MBPro, I do intermittent TM BUs about once a week (I'm retired and few changes are made to the computer on a weekly basis), so the cache issue applies - there are ways to change that scheduling (I'd have to google or others may 'chime in') - Dave

TimeMachine on windows shared NAS drive

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