Mac Forums Sunday Chat

chscag

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Thanks Sly. Have you thought about blogging your tips and tricks or is it something that might occupy too much of your time?
 

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Thought about it. I haven't had a lot of blogging experience but i am going to take a serious look at that and the prospect of posting them through FB or Twitter. Never done either of those either so input from any members with experience in this area is appreciated.

Edit: I think when I have time tomorrow I'll start a new thread specific to this issue. It might be possible to gather a series of tips over the weekend and post the tips daily or several times a week in a semi-automated/template driven process.

Doesn't the forum already have a FB /Twitter presence?
 
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chscag

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Yes, here's our Facebook link. Not sure about Twitter, I'll have to search for that one. By the way, the link to Facebook is rather old and rusty (dated 2012). But many of our members have a Facebook account including me.

Edit: I just found the Twitter link. It too is rather old and still reflects the old iNET logo.
 
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Join me at 7:00 p.m. Central Time tonight (1:00 Monday GMT) for the Mac-Forums Sunday Video Chat. I'll have the usual forum roundup for this week as well as whatever else comes to mind. In our Mac tips section we'll discuss the basics of Time Machine.

Show Notes

Welcome Newest Member aduepito

Apple releases free support app.Thanks to Charlie for this tidbit. The app is available from the iTunes App Store. It can be used to gather support information and schedule Genius Bar appointments, etc. It runs on IOS devices but can help with information on other Apple gear as well.

DiskImageMounter Can’t Open Time Machine Backups I wasn’t experiencing this error until I tried accessing my Time Machine soarsebundle file during the show. After the show I followed the directions in the tip to access the sparsebundle in Disk Utility. The sparsebundle mounted in Disk Utility and appeared in the list on the left side of the Disk Utility window. Right-click the file and allow First Aid to run. It takes a while to run -- presumably the time required depends upon the size of the backup -- but it worked for me.

Basic Time Machine tips This Macworld article is from 2008 but the tips are valid. It’s well worth a read if you are considering adding Time Machine to your backup regimen. It’s a good overview despite being a few years old.

Verify Time Machine Backups Backups are not worth the drive space they take up if the files are corrupt because they did not copy properly. Macworld’s Senior Editor Christopher Green has a new ideas for verifying the integrity of a Time Machine Backup.

More Time Machine Troubleshooting Info than you will probably ever need Nothing more need be said. This site is my secret weapon when it comes to solving Time Machine issues.

Clear unwanted items from you Bluetooth menu If you have items in your Bluetooth menu that you want to remove there are two easy methods for removing unwanted items:
1. Go to System Preferences>Bluetooth Hover over the device to be deleted and click the X that appears on the right.
2. If the Bluetooth item is in the menubar Option click there. This presents a variety of information as well as the option to remove a device.

iPhone 8 Rumors iDownloadBlog cites a report from the Korea Harold suggests the next generation iPhone will feature plastic not glass screen and a curved OLED panel similar to the Galaxy S7 Edge. It may also include three distinct models with differing features. Wireless charging has also been suggested as a possibility.

Bonus Time Machine Tip: Used alone Time Machine backups are not "bootable" in the sense that you cannot start your Mac directly from your Time Machine backups. As I see it you have two options:

1. Use cloning software (Carbon Copy Cloner, SuperDuper et. al) to "clone" your boot drive. In the event of an emergency you can boot from this drive so you can restore things from your Time Machine backup. Make sure to keep this "clone" reasonably current.

2. The other option is to format a hard drive and partition is so that there is one partition for the OS and one for the Time Machine backups. Install the minimal OS on the smaller partition and direct Time Machine to use the second partition. In an emergency boot from that drive and then use Time Machine to restore everything.



The upload may have clipped part of the show. It should be about 31 minutes not the 9+ that is showing now. I was in a hurry and I think I closed something out in the wrong order. If necessary I'll upload a corrected version tomorrow evening and post that info here.
 
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Join me at 7:00 p.m. Central Time tonight (1:00 Monday GMT) for the Mac-Forums Sunday Video Chat. It's the first video chat of 2017. I'll have the usual forum roundup for this week and a tip or two. This week I'll spend some time looking at some of the things to be considered if you're looking to use streamed content to replace/supplement your TV subscriptions.

The link above will take you to an edited version of the chat. The upload clipped a bit of the show so I uploaded an edited version of the chat. i clipped the very beginning because no one needs to see the state of the broadcast studio at the moment.

Show Notes

Welcome to our newest member 82bluevette

This weeks forum roundup and news /tips segment is short. I wanted to devote the bulk of the4 time to a discussion of some things to consider before starting to use streamed content as your primary form of entertainment.

Based on a few threads I've run into here and elsewhere recently I want to remind everyone of two things.
1. Any time you are considering reinstalling OS X make a backup of your data first.
2. Depending upon which version of the OS you are using during a re-install you mat be asked whether you want to do a clean install or an archive and install. The difference is important. A clean install erases everything on the drive -- including your user data. An archive and install preserves your date while reinstalling the operating system.

If you erase your data while reinstalling OS X recovery is highly unlikely given that at least some of the space where your information was may have been overwritten by the new copy of the OS and any temporary files written to the drive during installation.

If you don't already own an Apple watch but are considering one, here's a quick explanation of why the iTunes Guy is setting his aside for a while. His needs may or may not match yours.

In his "Hey Apple Fix This" column Kirk mentions a few things he'd like to see changed about the way the App Store handles it's list of your previously purchased items.

This week my initial foray into relying more heavily on streamed content for entertainment led to several questions about the Apple TV 4. Thanks to all who contributed answers.

If you're making your initial foray into steamed content you probably need to answer several questions first. I summarized some of those questions in the video chat. I'll probably start a separate thread with those questions as soon as I get them into a coherent written form. I'll start a separate thread and add the link here.

If you are looking for a streaming media player this series of reviews might be useful. I'm currently using Hulu and Netflix but there are a myriad of other services available. Several sites have reviewed these and several; other services. A quick search should get you multiple comparison reviews of some of the more popular services.

Review of Sling TV
 
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Join me at 7:00 p.m. Central time tonight (1:00 a.m. GMT Monday) for the weekly Mac-Forums Video Chat. We'll have the forum roundup and a tip or two.

If you're an Apple TV user I'll show you one way to keep iTunes Home Sharing going when you log out of a user account. You don't need a server or network drive to make this work.

Finished show is up here

Show Notes

Welcome to our newest member:
hysp

If you are having trouble sharing contacts, calendars, etc with a spouse or another user make sure that you and the person you wish to share information with are logged in under the same Apple ID then choose which information you want to share.

Texas couple suing Apple over FaceTime Safety Issues

If you are sending email messages to a group of people who don't want their addresses known to everyone else in the group, try putting the group name in Mail's BCC field instead of the To field. See here. Remember that to send emails to a group of people you need to create the group in Contacts first.

If you use a disk image to protect a series of files you may be able to avoid having to manually adjust the size of the disk image each time you create it. Consider creating a sparsebundle file instead of a regular disk image. Sparsebundle files are essentially disk images but they can expand and contract as needed. My post in this thread contains a link to directions for creating sparse bundles. The directions are for an older version of the OS but should still work.

Add Siri searches to the MacOS notification center.

Basic security steps Even non techie types will find these tips useful.

Unhide your user library folder

If you are using an Apple TV to stream content from your iTunes library you may find that there may be some times when you want to continue streaming but need to log out of the the account you are using to share your library. Here's a possible solution to that problem:
1. If you don't already have a second user account on your Mac create one. I've used both administrator and standard account for this but haven't tried it from a Guest account yet but that might work as well.
2. Log into the account that you will use to share the iTunes library. If you nave never used iTunes in that account before complete the iTunes setup. Make sure that you go into the iTunes preferences and point iTunes to0 wherever you have your media content stored. (iTunes>Preferences>Advanced.
3. Turn on Home Sharing in iTunes (iTunes>File>Home Sharing

That's it on the Mac side. Leave your Mac logged in to that account and use Fast User Switching to get to other accounts. Even if log out of other accounts and go back to the login screen sharing works as long as you remain logged into the account being used to share your iTunes library. Don't forget to check your Apple TV settings See here for example
 
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Slydude

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Join me at 7:00 p.m. Central Time tonight (1:00 a.m. Monday GMT) for the weekly Mac-Forums Video Chat. Look for the usual forum roundup, a few Mac and IOS tips plus whatever else comes to mind. I got a late state on show prep this week so you'll have to tune in to see which tips get included this week.

Show Notes

Welcome for newest member: Vorpike

Member Peter Natscher is having issues with a 27” 5K Retina iMac Stalling during startup. We haven’t fully resolved this issue yet but a cybersecurity app and Mac “cleanup” are both loading. I generally avoid both types of applications as the security apps often identify windows malware this creating false positives for Mac users. The cleanup apps are often a bit overzealous in their efforts and can in some cases do more harm than good.

Assuming for a moment that there is a need to run such apps due to work requirements or some similar concern it should be noted that it's rarely if ever a good idea to have two apps which do similar things running at the same time. Ask your Windows uses friends what it's like to run to antivirus applications for example. One suggestion for this user is to create a new user account with none of these types of applications running to see if this improved performance and corrects a slowdown.

Saving Favorite Locations in IOS Maps Application Jim Karen iPhone Life Saving map locations can save you quite a bit of time. No need to re-enter a location each time it’s needed.
1. Mark ark the location you want to save.
2. Swipe up on the information card till you reach the very bottom
3. Tap Add to Favorites

  • To access your Favorites in the future, swipe up on the search field. Doing so shows your recent locations. Scrolling to the bottom of the list will show your favorites. down to the bottom and tap on Favorites if you tap there.

  • Tap on a Favorite then tap Directions and Go—you'll be on your way.

Listen to Free Radio Stations in Apple Music Conner Carey iPhone Life

  • Open the Music app.
  • Tap the Radio tab at the bottom of the screen.
  • From here, you can select one of the featured shows and it will begin to play.
  • Or tap either Beat 1 Shows or Radio Stations. You can play what’s live on Beats 1, or you can select Radio Stations to see various genres from which to choose, such as a News and Sports, Alternative & Indie, Workout, Holiday, and much more.

Download & Watch Netflix Offline on iPad or iPhone Conner Carey iPhone Life

  • First, we need to update (or download) Netflix. To do this, open the App Store, tap Updates, and tap Update next to Netflix. Once your Netflix app has the latest update installed, open the app.
  • When you first open the app after updating Netflix, you’ll likely see the screenshot below informing you of the new offline watching feature. You can tap Find something to download or dismiss it.
  • However, the typical way you’ll access downloadable Netflix content is by tapping the Menu icon in the upper left corner that looks like three horizontal lines.

There is no official way, approved by Netflix, to download content on a Mac or PC for offline viewing

Buying Tracks from Apple Music
If you are listening to Apple Music and want to buy the track you are listening to try the following on your mac It’s there, but perhaps not where you’d expect. If you right-click on a track in iTunes, you’ll see a contextual menu. Choose Go To > Song in iTunes Store. This doesn’t work on IOS devices. As an alternative Kirk suggests creating a playlist on the IOS device that contains the tracks and transfer the playlist to your Mac and check for the songs in the iTunes store.

Gifting across borders
Q: Can I gift something to someone on iTunes if it’s available in my country but not available in theirs?
You can’t send a gift of anything to someone in another country. This is due to licensing rules.

Also briefly discussed during the show was the need to keep a backup of the content in your iTunes library. Although there is a way to re-download purchased content, that does not help if the content is no longer available in the iTunes Store.
 
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Join me tonight for the weekly Mac-Forums video chat. 7:00 p.m. Central Time US (1:00 a.m. Monday GMT) as usual. I'm still working on the shows tips for this week but one topic up for discussion is the importance of checking the integrity of your backups.

Show Notes
Welcome to our newest member theroy

Member T’Pring is getting annoyed by reminders to update iPhoto and GarageBand which are not used. Although these are Apple supplied apps they can be deleted. Some of the Apple supplied apps, such as Safari, are tightly integrated into the OS and can’t be removed but GarageBand and iPhotos can be removed.

In that same thread member Chscag reminds us that removing unneeded languages can cause problems with some apps such as the Microsoft Office suite. “Removing all the unnecessary languages does save quite a bit of room but for some reason removing them causes MS Office for the Mac to refuse to update and in some cases it will crash and need to be reinstalled.”

Member Chris_18 wants to use iMessage in an older iPhone without using cellular data. Member KevinJS lets us know that this can be done although an AppleID needs to be set up for the phone to use iMessage, FaceTime, or download apps. This may not be needed for other messaging apps/services.

KevinJS provides us this additional information:
One thing I was not aware of, because I simply kept my SIM card in the phone after it ceased to function, was that the phone needs a SIM card installed after it has been restored. If I remember correctly, it's something to do with validating itself with Apple's servers. It's a one time operation. Once this validation is done, the SIM card can be removed and the phone will continue to function, until the next time it is restored. The SIM card does not need to be functional. It just needs to be present.

Apple and Qualcom battle over patent infringement issues? Apple battles one of its major chip suppliers in a patent infringement case. My understanding is that, according to Apple, Qualcom wants royalties on some iPhone functions that don’t involve Qualcom chips. Admittedly, I’m a bit confused by this so I’ll keep you posted.

Former Apple engineer thinks its “golden age” is over? What are your thoughts?

Restoring a Mac when you can’t access the recovery partition. This is probably a good article to keep handy in the troubleshooting toolbox.

Killian Bell at Cult of Mac describes a situation where some AirPods (wireless headset) users are experiencing faster than anticipated battery drain, The following reset procedure may fix the problem. If this doesn’t work it might be time to contact Apple.

  1. Press and hold the setup button on your AirPods case for at least 15 seconds until the status light starts flashing amber.
  2. Reconnect your AirPods to your devices. If you previously setup the double-tap to pause feature, you’ll need to activate this again.

If your data is important to you a backup strategy is a must. In addition to considering ease of use, deciding what needs to be backed, and how much space you will need, good backup strategies have multiple backups. For really important data, at least one copy should be maintained offsite.

The Best Online Backup Services of 2017 by Jeph Preece
Three: You should always maintain three copies of all your essential files. You can maintain more than three copies if you want. But three is the minimum.
Two: You should store your files on at least two different formats. For example, you might have two copies on your primary hard drive and one copy on an external hard drive.
One: Always store one of the formats off-site. This protects information from being lost due to physical threats – theft, fire, flood, etc. If a catastrophic event happens to your home and you keep both formats on-site, then both formats will likely be destroyed.

Speed of Online Backups (for 1 TB backup)

Average speed was over a month, though some services were over six months.
The fastest services, Dropbox and IDrive, were capable of backing up 1TB in less than a week

As mentioned, it's important to note that your backup speed may differ from our results. First, it's unlikely that you'll allow your backup to run uninterrupted for a month, hogging your bandwidth and CPU resources. As a result, the actual time it takes you to complete a full backup could take much longer. Our results are indicative of the speed and performance and not definitive. As such, you should treat it as an apples-to-apples comparison.

Backup Seeding & Courier Recovery
A full backup to an online service can take months, To remedy this, some services offer backup seeding and courier recovery services.

Backup seeding — an option where the service sends you an external hard drive. which you use up your data to and mail the drive back. It's physically added to the company’s server.

Conversely, courier recovery is an option where they send you an external hard drive with your backed-up files on it and you restore it to your computer. Most cloud backup services, offer backup seeding and courier recovery for an additional fee.

Michael Muchmore at PCMag The Best Online Backup Services of 2017
Different services allow different types of files from differing sources. Some don't let you protect system and program files. Others don't let you back up files and folders on external or network drives. If you have any of those needs, make sure the service you choose supports them.”

Most services allow you to store music online but do not allow you to stream music that is in your backups.


As I noted during the show a friend in California used to solve the problem of offsite backup by keeping backups on several hard drives. About once a month he would update a backup, take it to the bank, and place the drive in a safe deposit box. The next month one of the drives at home would be updated and placed in the safe deposit box. The drive previously in the safe deposit box was taken home to be updated.
 
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chscag

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Hey Sly:

Integrity of backups is one of the most important topics that users need to explore. Nothing worse after a hard drive crash to find out your backup is corrupt or was never made. Also, you might want to throw in a quick pointer about off site backup plans such as Carbonite or BackBlaze.
 

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I was just thinking the same thing. I've mentioned the importance of backups recently in relation to some threads about damaged /lost iTunes media libraries. Unfortunately I may have some damage to my iTunes library and it looks like the backup files may have the same problems.
 
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Big oops on my part guys. I completely forgot to set up thine link for the Sunday chat till about two minutes ago. I'll push the show to tomorrow night at 7:00 p.m. Central time. I'll have a link up later tonight. I'd run the show now but haven't had a chance today to check my audio setup.
 

chscag

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You might also think about cancelling the show for next Sunday and moving it to Monday. As you know, next Sunday evening will be Superbowl evening. I may look at the game even though the Cowboys didn't make it.
 

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Good idea Charlie.

I'm in the same boat as you are Charlie. Neither the Saints or Cowboys made it so I'm kinda stuck this year.
 

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Join me at 7:00 p.m. tonight (1:00 a.m. GMT Tuesday) for the Mac-Forums Video Chat. We'll have the forum roundup, a few tidbits of Apple-related news, an IOS tip or two and a few MacOS tips.

Show Notes

Welcome to our newest member, randhimself

Jacob Siegal at bgr.com has an overview of the steps Apple takes when one of its suppliers is found to be using child labor.


iPhone 7 Plus vs Google Pixel ‘bokeh’ shootout isn’t even close Tidal and Sprint Partnership

Apple’ tips for prepping to get rid of an IOS device

Are you being tracked as you travel the Net? Here’s an overview of how it’s done.

Controlling how long Notifications stay on screen. You can also find more information here.

If you’ve got playlists in iTunes that contains a large number of tracks you may find this tip from the iTunes Guy helpful.

Typing special characters on IOS devices The show includes a short video clip that demonstrates how this is done.
 
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Join me Monday February 6, 2017 (1:00 a.m. GMT Tuesday Feb. 7) for the for the Mac-Forums Video Chat. Look for a forum roundup and the usual assortment of MacOS and IOS tips and tricks. Among this weeks tips I'll demonstrate split screen browsing on both MacOS and IOS. Pretty sure there will be a few other tricks as well.
 

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Join me for the weekly Mac-Forums Video Chat. We'll have the forum roundup and an assortment of tips and tricks. Among other things we'll look at the way iTunes handles your media when it's stored on a network volume, stop MS Word macros from automatically executing, and Nightshift comes to MacOS.

Show Notes

Welcome to our newest member Justinr518

When installing Windows under BootCamp it’s important to know whether your Mac originally had an optical drive. This can affect the installation process.

Member MikeFromMesa is planning to pass his computer on to a family member. He discovered it is not necessary to install each succeeding version of the OS after a clean install. One could skip several intermediate versions.

Member MikeFromMesa was wondering why TextEdit opens to the Documents folder rather than an actual editable document. He had to make a call to Apple support for the answer but he found a solution. “I called Apple Care and, although they had to look this up, they found the answer. Apparently if TextEdit is enabled in iCloud Drive, that is the way TextEdit opens.”

The FoxNews tech page has a series of tips for improving wireless network performance. Essentially these tips involve the following:
1. Check the bands available on your router. For best speed “. . . keep older devices that support only the slower G specification on the 2.4GHz band and newer N or AC devices on the beefier and speedier 5GHz band.”
2. Check the channel that your router is using. If there are other networks nearby it may improve performance to assign your network to a different channel.
3. Secure your network with a strong password. Having someone pirate your signal decreases your overall bandwidth.

Mac Malware targets Microsoft Word users via Macros Cult of Mac writer Killian Bell discusses a new piece of malware that spreads via Microsoft Word macros. This type of malware has been a problem on PCs for some time and the latest one seems to target Macs. Buried inside a document entitled “U.S. Allies and Rivals Digest Trump’s Victory – Carnegie Endowment for International Peace.” the document does the following of Word is set to execute macros automatically:

1. Checks to see if LittleSnitch is running. In my mind this is a moot point because many users do not pay close enough attention to / understand the warnings from Little Snitch.
2. Downloads and decrypts its payload.
3. The payload goes active and the virus/malware is executed.

“The payload is no longer being served, so researchers were unable to determine exactly what it did. However, the open-source framework it is based on has a number of capabilities, like the ability to monitor webcams, take encrypted keys from Keychain and more.”

You can stop Microsoft Word from automatically executing macros with a simple settings change. Open Word's preferences and check the Security tab. The last setting in the list controls whether macros execute automatically (Office 2011).Similar settings are in other versions of Word. Similar settings exist for Excel.

If your iTunes library is on a NAS device make sure your network device is mounted before launching iTunes. iTunes handles this situation much better than previous versions did but it it still better to make sure the device is mounted before launching iTunes. This article from the Kirkville site lists a script that tests to see if the appropriate drive is mounted before launching iTunes.

More Flash-based malware

If you are using the Nightshift settings on an IOS device you may be surprised to fine the Nightshift has come to MacOS 10.12.5 (Sierra). The relevant settings are found in a tab of the Displays preference pane.

Looks like Google borked up the upload twice tonight. I'll try again tomorrow to upload the video.
 
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Join me at 7:00 p.m. US Central Time tonight for the Mac-Forums Video Chat (1:00 a.m. Monday GMT). Our forum roundup will include tips on deleting Apple-supplied apps from your Mac, a Safari tip or two and whatever other tips come to mind.

Show Notes

Member Dittoman1 wants to control where screenshots are saved. Normally screenshots taken with the Shift+Command+4 keyboard command are saved to the Desktop. Apparently if you have certain Dropbox settings in place. Default that can change. The default setting for filetype is .png. The maintenance utility Onyx can be used to control the save format and location. Launch Onyx and select Parameters>General. Member RadDave has provided a chart describing the pros/cons of various formats

In a resurrected thread about removing Taboola from Chrome, member Hughvane reminds us that Safari1 doesn’t seem to have a reset function anymore One cure is ONYX. Go to Cleaning>Internet. After the show I saw a post from member ferrar that opening Safari with the Shift key held down accomplishes the same thing.

Deleting Apple installed apps. If you want to know which Apple-supplied apps can be deleted from your Mac have a look at this thread. This Apple article may also be useful.

Under the current version of Sierra when audio playing in a tab right clicking in the address bar shows the name of the tab playing the audio. This only works if audio /video is playing. Otherwise the reload page options appear. You have the option to mute the tab or selecting it from this menu.

Paul Wagenseil via Foxnews Tech talks about the need to Protect your Apple ID. Given the number of things in the Apple ecosystem that make use of Apple IDs its more important than ever to protect the security of your Apple ID.

Zach Epstein points us to a list of 25 “hidden” iPhone features.

A different take on whether Apple plans to move more manufacturing to the US. My view is that any decisions Apple makes in this regard would take some time to implement no matter what decisions they make. I’m not expecting any decisions until actual US policy changes, whatever they may be, are announced.

Given the interest in that thread about screenshots I’ll try to address that in a separate video later this week. I’m working on an Automator workflow that would gather screenshots from one folder and convert the images to a specified size and format. Check here to find out when the video is posted.
 
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Slydude

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Join me at 7:00 p.m.U.S. Central time tonight (1:00 a.m. GMT) for the Mac-Forums video chat. We'll have the forum roundup including some thoughts on charging your Macs, batteries, an extension of the reflective coating repair program and s few other things. I'll also look at a few things iTunes currently cannot do, and a tip or two.

Show Notes

Welcome to our newest member, eyelovemycats

Apple extends the repair program for notebooks with defective reflective coatings on the screens. This program appears to be in addition to whatever AppleCare a user may have.

An ongoing forum discussion of notebook battery charging recommendations.

If your Time Machine backups are on a Time Capsule you may not automatically see all files in the backup. One thing to check is to make sure that you log into the Time Capsule as one of its registered users not as a guest user.

Lots of Apple Hardware Test info as well as some diagnostic codes,

Apparently some groups/tech companies think the tech press is being mean. People/companies with this view seem to think the primary mission of the tech press is to make tech companies more profitable.

Newly registered government domains / subdomaisns to force use of secure protocols such as https The headline for this article verges on implying that this is part of a vast conspiracy. The reality is much different. New .gov domains / subdomains will be using more secure protocols such as https:

Kirk “The iTunes Guy" shows us things iTunes cannot currently do including get rid of the play button in certain views, smart playlists that guarantee no songs by the same artist, play counts on IOS devices, etc.

There has been a change to the key sequence which is used to show the hidden Library folder. Reports are inconsistent so this may be a bug.
 
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chscag

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Hey Sly.... better wear your "flame" retardant vest if you start the chat about batteries. Lots of pros and cons and just plain conjecture flying around on that one. Maybe you can get Randy and Jake to join in. That should prove to be interesting. LOL.
 

Slydude

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That would definitely make things interesting. I'd love to get Randy on for a chat sometime.

The Daytona 500 is this today, maybe I can borrow a fire suit from one of the race teams. Don't think they make them in my size. Too bad.
 

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