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English?

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Hi everyone,

I'd just like to get something off my chest. I don't claim to be an English professor, but the level of English in posts is worrying. A growing number of posts are written with no attention to spelling, grammar or punctuation. For members that aren't mother tongue English that's understandable, but for native English speakers most likely armed with spelling and grammar checkers? I really don't get it.

Are these the same people that will carry our world forward tomorrow? No wonder the Asians are running rings around us.
 
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And not to be picky but what about the ladies who use the forum ~ not all members are guys!
 

Raz0rEdge

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ralph-10svxgs.jpg
 

bobtomay

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The one I like that you'll see over and over and over again...

Can you advice me what Mac I should get?
 

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Can you advice me what Mac I should get?

Don't get me started Tom;)...this is one that irks me to no end as well.

How about this one..."I need some advise..."

- Nick
 

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To grammar school go you should . . . may the parse be with you. ;)
 

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For members that aren't mother tongue English that's understandable, but for native English speakers most likely armed with spelling and grammar checkers? I really don't get it.
That's not really a properly formed question... ;)
 
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I am already enjoying this thread.
 
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And not to be picky but what about the ladies who use the forum ~ not all members are guys!
Apologies, where I'm from "guys" can loosely be used for males and females.
 

Raz0rEdge

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Apologies, where I'm from "guys" can loosely be used for males and females.

In casual conversation, "guys" can be used to refer to both males and females as well, but if you're going to take a stance on the use of the English language, it is usually best to practice proper sentence structure and word use to elicit the right response..

People in glass houses......;)
 
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In casual conversation, "guys" can be used to refer to both males and females as well, but if you're going to take a stance on the use of the English language, it is usually best to practice proper sentence structure and word use to elicit the right response..

People in glass houses......;)

My point was not about the use of casual language - read the original post. I did also state that I'm not an English professor and I'm sure that I do also make the odd grammatical error. I also do read my posts before submitting them, i.e. I make an effort. Can this be compared to the posts we've all seen?

One thing is certain though: trying to make a point about something that would benefit everyone is clearly a waste of time here.
 

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Raz0rEdge

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My point was not about the use of casual language - read the original post. I did also state that I'm not an English professor and I'm sure that I do also make the odd grammatical error. I also do read my posts before submitting them, i.e. I make an effort. Can this be compared to the posts we've all seen?

One thing is certain though: trying to make a point about something that would benefit everyone is clearly a waste of time here.

An English professor I am not either. I am also tri-lingual and didn't speak English as my primary language until my teens..

That being said, there is value in trying to get people to write posts in a non-IM, non-4 word way, but a quick glance at the posts show that people think we are Google and frequently post "I have a problem, help me fix it" with absolutely no information..

The proper use of English is less of an issue, the real issue (at least for a technical forum built around helping/teaching/learning about Apple products) is the lack of information in the posts..

I'm severely distressed at the rapid decline of the use of the English language around me from people who speak no other language. You'd think people would make a conscious effort to speak/write it well, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

I believe the initial alphanumeric texting phase before the keyboard came to the smartphones is largely to blame for the atrocious writing as well as the educational standards in our country.

Now if you think any of us are disagreeing with your attempt to add benefit to the forum, you are mistaken. It's just that having been around long enough in these and other forums and the Internet, it's a cause that isn't won with a single post..
 
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IMHO Teh way I see it thats there problem. LOL ROFL FBI DOD NASA
 

pigoo3

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My point was not about the use of casual language - read the original post. I did also state that I'm not an English professor and I'm sure that I do also make the odd grammatical error. I also do read my posts before submitting them, i.e. I make an effort. Can this be compared to the posts we've all seen?

One thing is certain though: trying to make a point about something that would benefit everyone is clearly a waste of time here.

This is what happens when you start a thread like this. Unless you are ABSOLUTELY 100% perfect (free from errors)...then you will always come under fire for errors you eventually will make.

You know the saying..."Don't throw rocks if you live in a glass house.";)

I know what you're saying. The English errors that you find irritating...you feel are really major/big. But you admitted that you make the occasional error. Which is ok...I do too!

The problem is...what is the definition of a major or a minor English error?? What you think is minor & acceptable...others will think is major. It's really all relative.

The bottom line. Unless you are perfect & 100% free from whatever the criticism is in a thread like this...don't start the thread. You will almost always end up being put under the magnifying glass yourself (which isn't much fun)!;)

- Nick
 

vansmith

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The real issue here is an expectation of particular skills and/or condition on the part of end users. While some people certainly are lazy when it comes to writing, a fair number of people have developing English language skills and/or don't have the time or knowhow to write more comprehensive or coherent language. There's educational research which shows that non standard forms of English help create cohesion and social belonging amongst those that don't use it, a proposition itself that benefits certain people to the detriment of no one else. Online communities are similar in this regard and while this may bother you and others (myself included), it's important to note the context in which you are now writing and reading

In a very different sense, you're making assumptions about "standard English," a suggestion laden with cultural expectations. The world in which I live (the academy) has a very different set of expectations when it comes to language. For example, the use of contractions is a huge no-no - you spell out your words or you get told to do it. In that sense, I could read much of what was read here as sloppy English but I won't because that's not the language community that I'm in right now.

Sorry to go all academic on this one but it was the easiest way to effectively say "language is relative" without getting too esoteric or philosophical.
 
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The problem is...what is the definition of a major or a minor English error?? What you think is minor & acceptable...others will think is major. It's really all relative.
As with many things in life, a bit of good sense will tell you where the limit is. I see it this way: complete disregard is unacceptable, but the odd typo is just part of life - we are only human after all.

The bottom line. Unless you are perfect & 100% free from whatever the criticism is in a thread like this...don't start the thread. You will almost always end up being put under the magnifying glass yourself (which isn't much fun)!;)
This I now know. I expected mature, adult interaction, e.g. yours. XJ-linux made me laugh, but the nitpicking is what makes the thread or a point of view a waste of time. It actually defeats the purpose of a general conversation forum and the purpose of the original post, which was to constructively highlight an issue.
 
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Sorry to go all academic on this one but it was the easiest way to effectively say "language is relative" without getting too esoteric or philosophical.

This forum is an English language forum and the English language is well defined, irrespective of localisation (the use of 's' instead of 'z' is British). Nothing relative about it.
 

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