Why should I perform a fresh install on new SSD?

cheepmeep · Apr 16, 2012

I have purchased a SSD which I would like to swap out with my current HDD. I have been reading, and everyone seems to recommend doing a fresh install of my OS and such, as opposed to copying my current HDD bit for bit using 'Carbon Copy Cloner'.

If I do perform a fresh install, how will I get just my applications back onto my Mac. Specifically those which require activation from servers and such.

OR

Seeing as I will be using both hard drives in my Mac when I recieve an optical bay adapter, is there any way to only copy my OS and apps, NOT my files to my new SSD?

I apologize if this may be confuing to read, but thank you very much!

chscag · Apr 16, 2012

SSD drives do not take well to cloning from a platter type drive and is generally not recommended by SSD manufacturers such as OWC.

It's best to install clean and use your latest Time Machine backup to restore to the new SSD. That will work and at the same time preserve your data.

cheepmeep · Apr 16, 2012

chscag said:
SSD drives do not take well to cloning from a platter type drive and is generally not recommended by SSD manufacturers such as OWC.

It's best to install clean and use your latest Time Machine backup to restore to the new SSD. That will work and at the same time preserve your data.

I have never performed a time machine backup, as I have never had an external hard drive formatted specifically for my mac

However, would you mind guiding me through certain critical steps?

Once I erase and format my SSD to Mac OS X Extended Journaled, could I then swith both drives, leaving my mac with nothing but the SSD? Then, with nothing but the SSD and the OS X cd, could I somehow install Snow Leopard to my new SSD that way?

Once that is done, would I then just take my old HDD in an enclosure, and start copying over just the .DMGs, and install each app like it was brand new?

Thanks again!

McYukon · Apr 16, 2012

Once I erase and format my SSD to Mac OS X Extended Journaled, could I then swith both drives, leaving my mac with nothing but the SSD? Then, with nothing but the SSD and the OS X cd, could I somehow install Snow Leopard to my new SSD that way?

Yep, the SL Disk will work without any OS'es preset.

Once that is done, would I then just take my old HDD in an enclosure, and start copying over just the .DMGs, and install each app like it was brand new?

Yep again

cheepmeep · Apr 17, 2012

McYukon said:
Yep, the SL Disk will work without any OS'es preset.

Yep again

I see from your description that you have both an SSD and HDD configured. What steps did you take to do this? Same as myself?

Also, I assume you also use your SSD for apps, and HDD for bulk storage?

And finally, would you recommend having a Bootcamp partition on the HDD which will be located where the optical bay is?

Thanks again!

ycl1688 · Apr 17, 2012

Does not matter what brand of ssd you have install clean osx is the sure to ensure your system stability.
I have done 1 owc 2 samsung and 1 intel ssd upgrades,
owc you got to get the install osx done, then migration assistant to get it work.
the rest of the brands, first carbon copy clone will do but the clean install is still needed.
To make life easier, except for owc, use the ssd as external drive and copy internal to external drive using ccc.
boot up external drive ssd to test if it boot up. then do external and internal drives swap,
then install the osx to your ssd, and you are in business.

cheepmeep · Apr 17, 2012

ycl1688 said:
Does not matter what brand of ssd you have install clean osx is the sure to ensure your system stability.
I have done 1 owc 2 samsung and 1 intel ssd upgrades,
owc you got to get the install osx done, then migration assistant to get it work.
the rest of the brands, first carbon copy clone will do but the clean install is still needed.
To make life easier, except for owc, use the ssd as external drive and copy internal to external drive using ccc.
boot up external drive ssd to test if it boot up. then do external and internal drives swap,
then install the osx to your ssd, and you are in business.

I am a little unclear on what you mean. I understand everything except installing OS X after copying my internal to external.

In order to boot from a drive, wouldn't I need to install the OS first? Secondly, this Migration Assistant, is this what will transfer over my files and such?

Sorry for the confusion.

Thanks again!

EDIT: After reading for a bit, here is what I have learned:

I can use the OS X and Applications CD and basically get what a brand new mac would look like, on the SSD.

Then, I boot into the SSD, and begin Migration Assistant. I then choose to transfer from another disk (old HDD), and follow the steps given.

Is that correct? Also, what will I be missing or not on the new drive, that I did on my old one?

Why don't people just choose this method over CCC?

Thanks again!

ycl1688 · Apr 17, 2012

cheepmeep said:
I am a little unclear on what you mean. I understand everything except installing OS X after copying my internal to external.

In order to boot from a drive, wouldn't I need to install the OS first? Secondly, this Migration Assistant, is this what will transfer over my files and such?

Sorry for the confusion.

Thanks again!

what I meant is when you copied internal to external ssd drive using ccc, you are at this point getting both drives are identical twins. You have to boot up from from external drive (ssd) make sure your cloning and ssd drive is working.
step 1, I assume you are using external enclosure with ssd in it. after cloning with ccc.
step 2, boot up with chime sounds, press 'option' key. then the ssd drive image shows.
step 3 using this ssd to boot up your mac at his point make sure your external ssd is working.
step 4 swap drives out with old in with new.
step 5. boot up your mac, then install osx into your ssd drive,.
since you are using the dual drives, I have no idea what has to be done with the secondary internal drive.
the whole idea is to get your osx in your main drive ssd.
Maybe getting an extra regular drive as external drive after cloning , to get your data using Migration Assistant and not osx to your secondary internal
drive ? Hope not confusing you more. :Oops:

cheepmeep · Apr 17, 2012

ycl1688 said:
what I meant is when you copied internal to external ssd drive using ccc, you are at this point getting both drives are identical twins. You have to boot up from from external drive (ssd) make sure your cloning and ssd drive is working.
step 1, I assume you are using external enclosure with ssd in it. after cloning with ccc.
step 2, boot up with chime sounds, press 'option' key. then the ssd drive image shows.
step 3 using this ssd to boot up your mac at his point make sure your external ssd is working.
step 4 swap drives out with old in with new.
step 5. boot up your mac, then install osx into your ssd drive,.
since you are using the dual drives, I have no idea what has to be done with the secondary internal drive.
the whole idea is to get your osx in your main drive ssd.
Maybe getting an extra regular drive as external drive after cloning , to get your data using Migration Assistant and not osx to your secondary internal
drive ? Hope not confusing you more.

For simplicity, let's forget about the external drive. Let's say that for now, all I want to do is copy my current hard drive to the ssd.

What I guess I am asking is, should I use a cloning software, such as CCC, or should I find another method, such as fresh install the OS from the cd, then import my files some other way.

Since many people are saying it is better to do a clean installation on the new drive, as opposed to cloning it, I do not know which option would be best.

Thank you very much for your help so far!

ycl1688 · Apr 17, 2012

Let me put it this way, without external drive, it is messy to install osx.
other than using owc ssd drive, which requires install osx to the ssd directly.
Other ssd drive such as intel, samsung, crucial you can get by with CCC.
after cloning than using osx install should do the trick. That is all I can say.
What is so hard to get an external enclosure ?
I have been there and I have done that. My observation is if you simple clone to ssd,
the speed is missing and osx might be unstable. with the install of osx the system boots up
and runs as fast as the wind blows. That is the beauty of ssd, this is way the makers of
ssd are minting money now.

McYukon · Apr 17, 2012

I see from your description that you have both an SSD and HDD configured. What steps did you take to do this? Same as myself?

Also, I assume you also use your SSD for apps, and HDD for bulk storage?

And finally, would you recommend having a Bootcamp partition on the HDD which will be located where the optical bay is?

Thanks again!

Sure

I had ordered a 500 GB HD and a 60 GB SSD from OWC, I then took out the 250 GB HD and the optical drive.
After I had installed the data doubler & SSD in the Apple default bay (Easy Peasy BTW), I booted from the 250 GB HD opened the Lion USB installer I made from the App Store download and started the install process.
The installer copied all the required files to the SSD and then proceeded to restart to the SSD and finish the install.

I then started bringing back files from the firewire 800 connected 250 GB HD to the SSD
All the apps went to the SSD, except for some larger ones/games that can reside out of /Applications.
My users folder I put on the SSD as well, because if the ~/Library files aren't on the SSD you will not see a speed improvement because all the support files the application needs are on the bottleneck HD. ( This is something I noticed, but no one on the internet mentions at all. )

Downloads, Pictures, Movies, Music, File Cabinet (My Documents folder) are all on the HD. Basically, anything that I do not need every week.

If you don't mind a speed decrease when using Bootcamp, by all means put it on the HD if possible.

For simplicity, let's forget about the external drive. Let's say that for now, all I want to do is copy my current hard drive to the SSD.

I don't have any personal experience with cloning, but from the number of posts I have read about SSD's they all recommend a clean install. Reason being, the SSD has a controller board that decides where the data is best located, on a normal HD data is written from one end to the other. Hence if you clone, you will have the HD's data arrangement which is not optimal for the SSD arrangement. Thats what I've heard anyway.

cheepmeep · Apr 17, 2012

McYukon said:
Sure

I had ordered a 500 GB HD and a 60 GB SSD from OWC, I then took out the 250 GB HD and the optical drive.
After I had installed the data doubler & SSD in the Apple default bay (Easy Peasy BTW), I booted from the 250 GB HD opened the Lion USB installer I made from the App Store download and started the install process.
The installer copied all the required files to the SSD and then proceeded to restart to the SSD and finish the install.

I then started bringing back files from the firewire 800 connected 250 GB HD to the SSD
All the apps went to the SSD, except for some larger ones/games that can reside out of /Applications.
My users folder I put on the SSD as well, because if the ~/Library files aren't on the SSD you will not see a speed improvement because all the support files the application needs are on the bottleneck HD. ( This is something I noticed, but no one on the internet mentions at all. )

Downloads, Pictures, Movies, Music, File Cabinet (My Documents folder) are all on the HD. Basically, anything that I do not need every week.

If you don't mind a speed decrease when using Bootcamp, by all means put it on the HD if possible.

I don't have any personal experience with cloning, but from the number of posts I have read about SSD's they all recommend a clean install. Reason being, the SSD has a controller board that decides where the data is best located, on a normal HD data is written from one end to the other. Hence if you clone, you will have the HD's data arrangement which is not optimal for the SSD arrangement. Thats what I've heard anyway.

Wow. This was the greatest answer I have ever recieved. One million hearts to you <3

This makes it more clear. So if I do the following, will it be fine?

1. Connect SSD via USB HDD Enclosure

2. Format, Partition, all that fancy stuff to the SSD. Basically prepare it for the installations.

3. Next, boot into the Snow Leopard Installation Disk, and install Snow Leopard onto the SSD

4. I will then update my OS to 10.6.8

This next part is what I may need help with.

5. After installing Snow Leopard onto my SSD, could I use Setup Assistant to load my User files and Applications to my SSD from my HDD? I believe Setup and Migration Assistant offer the option to only migrate certain files, correct?

Also, would you happen to know if my software licences will remain intact? Meaning I will not have to re-enter that stuff again?

If this is correct, I can get rid of my anxiousness.

Thank you very much for the help <3

cheepmeep · Apr 17, 2012

McYukon said:
Sure

I had ordered a 500 GB HD and a 60 GB SSD from OWC, I then took out the 250 GB HD and the optical drive.
After I had installed the data doubler & SSD in the Apple default bay (Easy Peasy BTW), I booted from the 250 GB HD opened the Lion USB installer I made from the App Store download and started the install process.
The installer copied all the required files to the SSD and then proceeded to restart to the SSD and finish the install.

I then started bringing back files from the firewire 800 connected 250 GB HD to the SSD
All the apps went to the SSD, except for some larger ones/games that can reside out of /Applications.
My users folder I put on the SSD as well, because if the ~/Library files aren't on the SSD you will not see a speed improvement because all the support files the application needs are on the bottleneck HD. ( This is something I noticed, but no one on the internet mentions at all. )

Downloads, Pictures, Movies, Music, File Cabinet (My Documents folder) are all on the HD. Basically, anything that I do not need every week.

If you don't mind a speed decrease when using Bootcamp, by all means put it on the HD if possible.

I don't have any personal experience with cloning, but from the number of posts I have read about SSD's they all recommend a clean install. Reason being, the SSD has a controller board that decides where the data is best located, on a normal HD data is written from one end to the other. Hence if you clone, you will have the HD's data arrangement which is not optimal for the SSD arrangement. Thats what I've heard anyway.

One final thing. Do you have OS X installed on your 500 GB HDD?

Thanks again!

ycl1688 · Apr 18, 2012

McYukon said:
Sure

I had ordered a 500 GB HD and a 60 GB SSD from OWC, I then took out the 250 GB HD and the optical drive.
After I had installed the data doubler & SSD in the Apple default bay (Easy Peasy BTW), I booted from the 250 GB HD opened the Lion USB installer I made from the App Store download and started the install process.
The installer copied all the required files to the SSD and then proceeded to restart to the SSD and finish the install.

I then started bringing back files from the firewire 800 connected 250 GB HD to the SSD
All the apps went to the SSD, except for some larger ones/games that can reside out of /Applications.
My users folder I put on the SSD as well, because if the ~/Library files aren't on the SSD you will not see a speed improvement because all the support files the application needs are on the bottleneck HD. ( This is something I noticed, but no one on the internet mentions at all. )

Downloads, Pictures, Movies, Music, File Cabinet (My Documents folder) are all on the HD. Basically, anything that I do not need every week.

If you don't mind a speed decrease when using Bootcamp, by all means put it on the HD if possible.

I don't have any personal experience with cloning, but from the number of posts I have read about SSD's they all recommend a clean install. Reason being, the SSD has a controller board that decides where the data is best located, on a normal HD data is written from one end to the other. Hence if you clone, you will have the HD's data arrangement which is not optimal for the SSD arrangement. Thats what I've heard anyway.

Here is what intel trying to do with their installation of ssd. You have the owc obviously you have to install according to their instruction. intel specifies CCC,
crucial specifies Super duper. Cloning with clean install goes hand in hand other than OWC is a fact.
http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Detail_Desc.aspx?agr=Y&DwnldID=19324

cheepmeep · Apr 18, 2012

Considering I have an OCZ, you are recomending I clone my current drive? Again, I fear this as many have mentioned stability or performance issues.

No problem then?

ycl1688 · Apr 18, 2012

it does not hurt to clone, it is not going to blow up in your macbook not a chance, then make sure you
boot up from external drive. then install osx in your ssd after installing in your macbook.
How To Install an SSD in a Unibody MacBook Pro | Mac|Life

cheepmeep · Apr 19, 2012

ycl1688 said:
it does not hurt to clone, it is not going to blow up in your macbook not a chance, then make sure you
boot up from external drive. then install osx in your ssd after installing in your macbook.
How To Install an SSD in a Unibody MacBook Pro | Mac|Life

Last question. Although it won't "blow up", how much performance and stability decrease are we talking? I understand it isn't a hefty bunch, but considering I got an SSD to maximize my speed and performance, it would be a shame to take the easy way out and lose that.

Have your personally cloned any of your drives? How did they perform in comparison to what was expected?

I apologize, but thanks again!

ycl1688 · Apr 19, 2012

consider the owc, intel and samsung ssd I installed in my macbook pro.
owc way of installing osx first and then migrate the data to ssd, does not beat the other ssd with cloning. same stability and speed.
life is matter of making choices and there is always a first time.

northrnchimp · Apr 20, 2012

I cloned my SL install from the original HD onto an OWC SSD (SATAII) over a year ago, and have had no stability problems or performance degradation - it still benchmarks at 270MB/sec read, 250MB/sec write and boots to the login window in 14 seconds.

Cloning is easier - try that first, if it doesn't work, then do a fresh install.

ycl1688 · Apr 20, 2012

northrnchimp said:
I cloned my SL install from the original HD onto an OWC SSD (SATAII) over a year ago, and have had no stability problems or performance degradation - it still benchmarks at 270MB/sec read, 250MB/sec write and boots to the login window in 14 seconds.

Cloning is easier - try that first, if it doesn't work, then do a fresh install.

Which cloning software did you use super duper or ccc ? thanks.

Why should I perform a fresh install on new SSD?

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