time capsule and wireless cable modem - Basics

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I have had mixed success working with Time Capsule and the wireless modems (fist DSL, and now cable), and I think I need to better understand how using these two together works.

What I don't entirely understand is the relationship between the wireless network operation that the cable modem provides, and the one TC provides.

I just want one network that has access to the internet and to my TC for backups, and have never really understood the setup for TC, particularly when asked whether I want to create a new wireless network.

If someone could point me to a clear explanation of how this works, I'd appreciate it...thanks
 

pigoo3

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What I don't entirely understand is the relationship between the wireless network operation that the cable modem provides, and the one TC provides.

If I understand your situation correctly...this is the main confusion (what I quoted above)...the cable modem you get from your cable company does not provide any sort of wireless networking abilities. That's what the Apple Time Capsule is for.

The cable modem you get from your cable company is just a interface or conduit for high speed internet access...it is not a wireless networking device.

Hope this helps,

- Nick
 

RavingMac

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I have had mixed success working with Time Capsule and the wireless modems (fist DSL, and now cable), and I think I need to better understand how using these two together works.

What I don't entirely understand is the relationship between the wireless network operation that the cable modem provides, and the one TC provides.

I just want one network that has access to the internet and to my TC for backups, and have never really understood the setup for TC, particularly when asked whether I want to create a new wireless network.

If someone could point me to a clear explanation of how this works, I'd appreciate it...thanks

I can post a link, but I think first we need a better idea of what you have and what you are trying to do.

1) Your DSL modem (which you are calling a wireless modem). A modem is a data transmission device linking you to your service provider. Some modems (but definitely not all) have a built in wireless router.
2) The TC is a wireless router (a device for broadcasting the data service to your local network) and also a directed wired router (essentially it is a switch/splitter connecting multiple devices in a network to a single source). The TC also has a built-in Hard Drive
3) The TC can be used to establish a wireless (or wired) network or extend an existing network. How you chose to use it is driven by a lot of things including the physical layout of your home.

Sorry for the lengthy post with probably basic info, but bottom line is to best help we need to know how you are getting service, do you have an existing wireless network, how is it set up, what is on the network and what you wan the TC to do for you. And, any other specifics that come to mind.

EDIT: I see Nick's response beat mine (less verbose and faster on the keyboard). ;)
 

pigoo3

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1) Your DSL modem (which you are calling a wireless modem). A modem is a data transmission device linking you to your service provider. Some modems (but definitely not all) have a built in wireless router.

It sounds like from the OP that they currently have a cable modem (cable high-speed service)...but did have DSL in the past.

Every cable modem I've had from my cable companies (in the various places I've lived) were just a cable modem with no wireless abilities. So the "gray-area" for me is...whether some cable companies are now providing cable modems with wireless networking abilities.

- Nick
 

RavingMac

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It sounds like from the OP that they currently have a cable modem (cable high-speed service)...but did have DSL in the past.

Every cable modem I've had from my cable companies (in the various places I've lived) were just a cable modem with no wireless abilities. So the "gray-area" for me is...whether some cable companies are now providing cable modems with wireless networking abilities.

- Nick
I don't know either about current cable modems. My service is DSL, but I assumed (maybe incorrectly) from the OP's post that they were trying to add the TC to an existing network, and why I asked for clarification/additional info.
 
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the cable modem from Cable One does have a wireless router and provides the current wireless network for my house, which I use every day with my laptop and with a desktop (also wirelessly connected).

I would add the TC to the mix to back up my laptop via time machine

When my wife gets a laptop later this year, she will likely want to use it in similar fashion.
 

pigoo3

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the cable modem from Cable One does have a wireless router and provides the current wireless network for my house, which I use every day with my laptop and with a desktop (also wirelessly connected).

Ok...I went to the Cable One website...and it appears that you can either use one of the Cable One's cable modem's...or purchase a cable modem of your own from Cable One's approved list.

Can you tell us the manufacturer & model number of your cable modem?

Thanks,

- Nick
 
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I can check when I get back home, but I'm using the Cable One supplied modem/router.

Does the model affect understanding the basic relationship between it and TC?
 

pigoo3

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Does the model affect understanding the basic relationship between it and TC?

Sometimes cable companies supply customers with more than one type of cable modem. Looking at the Cable One's website...it's not clear what cable modem or modems they actually supply. They do have a list of compatible cable modems you can buy...but not a list of what they supply to customers.

If we know the manufacturer & model# of your cable modem...then we can find the specifications & features that it has, possibly find a user manual/setup guide for it, and maybe see how to set it up to work with your Time Capsule.

- Nick
 
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The first thing to understand when dealing with cable modem issues is the difference between external addresses and internal addresses. The best analogy I have been able to come up with regarding the cable modem and router relationship is the standard corporate office. If you look up the phone number for XYZ Corp, you'll find a single number, say 1-800-555-1234. However, once you dial that number, a switchboard can route your call to anyone else inside the building. That's basically how your cable modem and router work. Your ISP provides a single external IP address for your cable modem. Your cable modem connects to your router, in your case your Time Capsule, and your TC serves up alternate internal IP addresses, or extensions if you will, to the rest of your network.

Occasionally, a cable modem will also serve as a router, providing it's own internal addresses. In those cases, you can choose to set the TC in Bridged mode, where it doesn't assign new internal addresses, but passes through the addresses provided by the cable modem/router box.
 
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OK - now we are starting to address my question.

What you say makes sense, but some really basic info I'm wondering is: in setting up TC, is the TC wireless networking replacing the cable modem/router network (so the latter no longer is operating), or are both supposed to operate at the same time, and I chose which to use, or something else?

This then raises questions about how security works on the network(s) that result from setting up TC (because even if the TC network is the one I'm using, I still have the whole Cable One modem security and password remaining (to access the internet), even if I'm not using it as my router (??? I think???)

Again, part of the question also goes back to the set up process of TC, in which it asks what I want to do (add a new network, operate in bridge mode?).
 

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You really have a lot of options when it comes to setting that up depending in part on what your cable modem has available. Lets assume for a moment that your cable modem can also provide a wireless network then you could:

1. Switch off the wireless networking on the Time Capsule so wireless is only provided by the modem.

2. Shut off wireless on the modem and use wireless on the Time Capsule,

3. Use the Time Capsule's wireless capabilities to extend your existing wireless network provided by the cable modem.

4. Two wireless networks at the same time. One runs on the cable modem and one on the Time Capsule. In this situation it is possible for each network to have its own security settings.

We'll know more about your specific questions when we know a bit more about your hardware.
 

BrianLachoreVPI


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This thread describes some of the considerations for what you're trying to do. http://www.mac-forums.com/forums/airport-networking-wireless/233697-extending-wireless-network.html

As has been said - you have a few choices. I chose to let my FIOS router still be the DHCP server for the network - and my second wireless router (a Linksys - but the principle holds for your AE) to be simply an Access Point (or in bridge mode on the AEs). I also set mine up to maintain a degree of separation between the two networks. 802.11g and below devices only connect to the FIOS router. All 802.11n devices can connect to the Linksys. I'd recommend something similar for your situation unless you're also trying to extend network coverage- but it doesn't sound like that from your initial post.

Read through the link I posted and since you're not trying to extend the range - you could use unique SSIDs.
 
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You really have a lot of options when it comes to setting that up depending in part on what your cable modem has available. Lets assume for a moment that your cable modem can also provide a wireless network then you could:

1. Switch off the wireless networking on the Time Capsule so wireless is only provided by the modem.

2. Shut off wireless on the modem and use wireless on the Time Capsule,

3. Use the Time Capsule's wireless capabilities to extend your existing wireless network provided by the cable modem.

4. Two wireless networks at the same time. One runs on the cable modem and one on the Time Capsule. In this situation it is possible for each network to have its own security settings.

We'll know more about your specific questions when we know a bit more about your hardware.

Thanks, that is helpful.

I will be back with some hardware specifics.

In the meantime, deciding on which of the many options available will be helped by understanding the how's and the why's behind each option (in addition to hardware constraints and opportunities)
 

RavingMac

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Thanks, that is helpful.

I will be back with some hardware specifics.

In the meantime, deciding on which of the many options available will be helped by understanding the how's and the why's behind each option (in addition to hardware constraints and opportunities)

Here you are. Below is a link to Apple support on networking. From it you can access articles and video tutorials. A lot of good stuff here.
Apple - Support - AirPort + Time Capsule

EDIT: The reason we have been going the direction we have in trying to help is not because there is a lack of information available, but that there honestly is too much unless you have some experience. It is extrememly easy to get lost in the trees without some help . . . and I am far from the expert here, but have done enough of this on my own to appreciate the difficulties of wading in unaided for the first time.
Hope this all helps.
 

pigoo3

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In the meantime, deciding on which of the many options available will be helped by understanding the how's and the why's behind each option (in addition to hardware constraints and opportunities)

**Fair warning**...you're opening a can of worms you may not want to open!;) Computer networking & network security can be a very complex & frustrating topic for many a user.

I would suggest deciding what you want your networking hardware to do (cable modem and Time Capsule)...and then we can try to help you set it up to work that way.

My humble suggestion would be...turn off the wireless networking features of your cable modem...and use the wireless networking capabilities of the Apple Time Capsule. The Time Capsule already has a dual-band router built-in...and that's more than plenty for almost all home networks.

Of course if you want to learn more about the details of computer networking & wireless network security...go for it...but you've been warned in case you start getting headaches, your eyes get blurry, and your hair starts falling out!;)

- Nick
 
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pigoo and razonmac - thanks, and point taken, and I appreciate that I'm just dipping my toes in some very deep and murky water. I'm not looking for expertise, I just am trying to get past avoiding using my TC because I don't entirely get what is going on. I made it work when I had DSL, but really don't understand how/why, and when there were problems, I was not very good at fixing them.

So let's head in the direction of pigoo's recommendation and look at setting up TC to replace the network provided by my cable one modem/router. I wouldn't mind hearing some further explanation of why this is a good idea, if that won't get me over my head.

BTW, the modem/router is an ARRIS, model: WTM662G
 

BrianLachoreVPI


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Click on the link I posted - don't be misled by its title - it has everything you're looking to do including options. Once you read that you should be well positioned to come back here with specific tailoring questions.
 

pigoo3

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So let's head in the direction of pigoo's recommendation and look at setting up TC to replace the network provided by my cable one modem/router. I wouldn't mind hearing some further explanation of why this is a good idea, if that won't get me over my head.

Here are my reasons why I think turning off your cable modems wireless networking abilities...and just use your Time Capsules wireless features is the way to go:

1. The time capsule has a dual-band wireless router built into it. This gives you two simultaneous network signals to log into vs. one for the cable modem.
2. The Time Capsule has a hard drive built into it...for backing up your computers apps. & files.
3. You probably paid a heck of a lot of money for the Time Capsule...so why not use it.
4. The setup I recommended is the setup I have in my home...and it works great!:)

Of course this is just my opinion...some other folks may have equally persuasive reasons for just using the cable modem (and not using the TC).

- Nick
 
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TC won't connect to internet if directly connected to cable modem

I am curious as to what pigoo's set-up is and if I can do the same. I just purchased a TC and was unable to get it to connect to the internet (error was that it had an invalid IP) when I plugged it into my cable modem (Motorola Surfboard SB5101). I have a PhonePower adapter for my VOIP and if I use that as an intermediary, then my TC successfully connects to the internet and I can use the TC as both wireless network and TM back-up. I have been in contact with both Apple and my ISP, Wave Broadband, and both indicate it is not a problem with their product. Obviously both the cable modem and TC work, but for some reason they don't communicate if connected directly to one another. I have reset/rebooted all devices and still it won't work if the TC and modem are connected directly to one another.

I thought about buying a new cable modem to see if that would fix the problem, but I'm really trying to make what I have work, since each device does work. It just doesn't work when set-up the way I think it should be set-up.

I asked my ISP to release my MAC address of my old router and they said by resetting the modem on their end it does that. Apple said it sounds like a provisioning issue with the modem, but I don't understand what that means.

Any tips, input, advice would be greatly appreciated.

Also, if you think it is a problem with the cable modem, which brand do you suggest I get. What has been known to work seamlessly with TC.
 

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