Should I (Me) Purchase applecare?

Doug b said:

Your actions are obviously a direct result of your experiences. And while that's great for you, not everyone has had the same good luck. That's really all it is... is luck of the draw. If you only ever have two or three Macs in your life, then there's a good chance you'll have good luck. But up that number past 5, and statistics say that eventually you'll run into bad luck.

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In that case, I'd be able to take the money I would have spent on warranties, replace the one I finally got bitten on, and have change to spare. Statistically, extended warranties aren't worth the money in the long run, and no amount of anecdotal experiences will change that.

Hey man, you can spread as much of your logic around as you'd like, it makes no difference to me. We obviously have very different opinions and prerogatives on this subject matter so... I'd say there's really no point in you trying to convince anybody that they're wrong for doing what they feel is right.

What I do take a bit of offense to, is you calling people paranoid and asserting that the only reason someone would ever purchase an extended warranty for an computer that can cost a couple thousand dollars, is that they've fallen prey to a disease and are gullible.

I also like how you tried covering your bases by stating that it's okay to purchase a warranty for a car, simply because of the cost of out of pocket repair to warranty ratio. But this doesn't stand up IMO, simply because everyone has a different idea of what cost effectiveness means.

Also, you make a poor point above. All it takes is one bout of bad luck. This whole premise is based upon luck of the draw. As I said before, I'm really glad (sincerely) that you've never had an issue which caused you to have to fork over about a thousand dollars for a new logic board after a year... but if you did have to, you'd then be sorry for not having spent a couple hundred instead of a grand.

Anyway.... enjoy.

Doug

lifeisabeach said:

In that case, I'd be able to take the money I would have spent on warranties, replace the one I finally got bitten on, and have change to spare. Statistically, extended warranties aren't worth the money in the long run, and no amount of anecdotal experiences will change that.

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Really? So that $200 for the price of Applecae for a Mac will magically buy you a new Mac when the repairs themselves cost $1000? How exactly does that math work?

I hope your fortunate luck continues. Really.

Doug b said:

Also, you make a poor point above. All it takes is one bout of bad luck. This whole premise is based upon luck of the draw. As I said before, I'm really glad (sincerely) that you've never had an issue which caused you to have to fork over about a thousand dollars for a new logic board after a year... but if you did have to, you'd then be sorry for not having spent a couple hundred instead of a grand.

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No, actually I wouldn't be sorry. Again… statistically, in the long run, I know full well that I'd spend more on extended warranties than for out-of-pocket repairs. I've never seen a single article suggesting differently. Yes, that's of little consolation to someone who gets burned early on, but the numbers don't lie. I'm OK with new car warranties because the repair costs can be significantly high; the cost of that extended warranty is a trivial fraction of the cost of the vehicle; extended downtime means significant issues in getting to work, to make money, to make the repair; and making car payments on a non-functioning vehicle isn't an option. Computer extended warranties (and actually extended warranties on most anything else), in contrast, are a rather significant percentage of the product's purchase price; downtime will have no impact on my ability to go to work to make money; even if financed, it's paid for before the warranty expires so worst case scenario, in the event of a catastrophe, I'd just get a new one. It'd still cost me less than buying warranties on every device over the long run.

I accept and acknowledge that some people have a legitimate need for one. And bad experiences severely handicaps one's ability to maintain "faith" in the statistics. But "peace of mind" is an emotional response, not a logical one.

Doug b said:

I'm really glad (sincerely) that you've never had an issue which caused you to have to fork over about a thousand dollars for a new logic board after a year…

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Oh, and a thousand dollars for a new logic board? That's outrageous. You are either spreading more FUD, or failed to shop around.

iMac, Macbook Pro and Macbook Logic Board Repair

Edit: Ok, that's for a repair, not a replacement… looks like an outright replacement can be around a grand. I stand corrected.

I would rather have it and not need it than the opposite same on the auto and TV.

Doug b said:

What I do take a bit of offense to, is you calling people paranoid and asserting that the only reason someone would ever purchase an extended warranty for an computer that can cost a couple thousand dollars, is that they've fallen prey to a disease and are gullible.

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Ok ok… I was being a bit harsh with that. My apologies. Just to be clear, my contention has been that "peace of mind" alone is a poor reason to recommend extended warranties. Not that there aren't good ones, but that in itself is really lousy. I'll just leave it at that.

lifeisabeach said:

Ok ok… I was being a bit harsh with that. My apologies. Just to be clear, my contention has been that "peace of mind" alone is a poor reason to recommend extended warranties. Not that there aren't good ones, but that in itself is really lousy. I'll just leave it at that.

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No worries. I wasn't REALLY offended.. I mean, it was a silly comment, and can definitely see how others might actually be offended if they thought about it, but it takes more than that to snark my delicate sensibilities

Two more points for you:

I'm OK with new car warranties because the repair costs can be significantly high; the cost of that extended warranty is a trivial fraction of the cost of the vehicle; extended downtime means significant issues in getting to work, to make money, to make the repair; and making car payments on a non-functioning vehicle isn't an option.

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You're not thinking about anyone or much of anything other than yourself. This doesn't boil down to a singular experience for you alone... Lest you forget, for a LOT of people, a computer IS their car. It's the main tool used for the job which pays their bills !

Downtime on a computer for some people, means a loss of time and revenue. Perhaps a loss of clients and future failings. Not having to deal with that headache means everything. That "peace of mind" alone.. certainly IS worth the extra couple bills and is not at all lousy, sir. Also, it's harder to remain logical, if your peace of mind has been disturbed, especially after you realize that the problem could have been avoided.

Last point and question for you: How many Computers do you purchase per year? My current MacBook Pro has been serving me for 3 years now. I've used Apple Care once and will perhaps need to call upon it once more this week. It has already more than paid for its self. Back to the point... If you purchase one computer for yourself *not for your wife or kids, just you* do you have need for more than that computer? Yes, you might have a laptop and desktop or perhaps a tower. Which ever suits you... Here's my point though: If that computer serves you well for let's say.. 5-6 years or until you get the itch to get a newer model.. that extra couple hundred you spent would have no impact other than a positive one in case you needed it.

Of course, that's given that any problems which have occurred, did so towards the beginning of its life span, likely meaning a defective part etc.. Hard drives fail... mostly all of us have seen this happen. They're easy to replace and cheap. Same goes for RAM. But a naturally occurring failure to a component such as the logic board, GPU, CPU, or LCD will usually happen far more rapidly than those other parts. I kind of wish that Apple Care extended for 3 full years, rather than the extra 2, but I guess that they've done the proper research and figured out the best time frame according to the rate of failure in each component.

That's it for me here. I'll just agree to disagree. BTW, my wife neglected to purchase Apple Care for her MacBook Pro. She lost track of the time... I really hope we have the same luck as you have had with your stuff!

Doug

Doug b said:

No worries. I wasn't REALLY offended.. I mean, it was a silly comment, and can definitely see how others might actually be offended if they thought about it, but it takes more than that to snark my delicate sensibilities

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Yeah, but I still felt like I was being a prick the more I thought of it, and I don't like feeling like a prick.

Two more points for you: You're not thinking about anyone or much of anything other than yourself. This doesn't boil down to a singular experience for you alone... Lest you forget, for a LOT of people, a computer IS their car. It's the main tool used for the job which pays their bills !

Downtime on a computer for some people, means a loss of time and revenue. Perhaps a loss of clients and future failings. Not having to deal with that headache means everything. That "peace of mind" alone.. certainly IS worth the extra couple bills and is not at all lousy, sir. Also, it's harder to remain logical, if your peace of mind has been disturbed, especially after you realize that the problem could have been avoided.

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I've also stated earlier that if I relied on my computer for work, I'd have to rethink my stance. I've also acknowledged that bad prior experiences doesn't help one keep an open mind.

EDIT: worth mentioning… if I had frequent issues with any product, I'd be reconsidering who I buy from rather than forking over extra money for a warranty. Which brings up something else. The cost of a new logic board for a Mac is absolutely obscene. They shouldn't run more than $300 or so. I think I get it now. Apple marks them up to obscenely expensive levels to make the AppleCare warranty seem like a bargain.

Last point and question for you: How many Computers do you purchase per year? My current MacBook Pro has been serving me for 3 years now. I've used Apple Care once and will perhaps need to call upon it once more this week. It has already more than paid for its self. Back to the point... If you purchase one computer for yourself *not for your wife or kids, just you* do you have need for more than that computer? Yes, you might have a laptop and desktop or perhaps a tower. Which ever suits you... Here's my point though: If that computer serves you well for let's say.. 5-6 years or until you get the itch to get a newer model.. that extra couple hundred you spent would have no impact other than a positive one in case you needed it.

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Well when I built my PCs, I'd do perhaps minor component upgrades once a year, perhaps a full rebuild every 3 years. Some components I'd re-use or give to others. One PC I gave to my sister after doing a full rebuild. Overall lifespan was well in excess of 5 years without an issue. I don't even know what its ultimate fate was. My last PC build is still in use at my in-law's office. Going on... lessee… 7 years?

As for Macs… my first was a PowerBook I had for about 5 years. Sole issue was a broken hinge somewhere around the 4-year mark. Next Mac was a PowerMac.. had for about 3 years without an issue, sold to get a Mac Pro. Had that from shortly after their introduction until last August. So 5 years? No problems short of a Superdrive needing replacement shortly before I sold it. Also had a MacBook Pro to replace the PowerBook for 1.5-2 years or so before selling that to get an iPad. The extent of computer issues I've ever had were a couple CRT monitors (one went up in smoke, the other a bad button), and that Superdrive. I've never had so much as a hard drive crash. I can't think of anything else.

Here's perhaps some irony. Remember how I said that it looks like I might have to use my Apple Care again this week? My MacBook Pro just totally crashed... just a hard crash, and here's what's been leading up to it, I guess:

I have no real idea as to how long the problem has been dwelling, since the only indication of the issue occurs when I click on the battery status in the main menu bar. The battery indicator status tells me that it is in need of "service". The battery isn't that old, and the logic board was replaced last year. Anyway, I was running the Mac on battery power only, status showed about an hours worth of juice left, give or take a few minutes.

I was flipping through photos in Flickr and then all of a sudden, with no warning whatsoever.. .the MBP just died! I rebooted, and then saw something I had never seen before. Freaked me out a bit... I saw a globe, (of the earth) followed by a folder icon with a question mark on it, flashing, and finally, the spinning wheel. Didn't last very long, and finally booted normally but still... I treat my machines extremely well and see no reason for this to be happening. I'll be making an appointment to visit the Genius bar perhaps tomorrow.

Doug

Doug b said:

Here's perhaps some irony. Remember how I said that it looks like I might have to use my Apple Care again this week? My MacBook Pro just totally crashed... just a hard crash, and here's what's been leading up to it, I guess:

I have no real idea as to how long the problem has been dwelling, since the only indication of the issue occurs when I click on the battery status in the main menu bar. The battery indicator status tells me that it is in need of "service". The battery isn't that old, and the logic board was replaced last year. Anyway, I was running the Mac on battery power only, status showed about an hours worth of juice left, give or take a few minutes.

I was flipping through photos in Flickr and then all of a sudden, with no warning whatsoever.. .the MBP just died! I rebooted, and then saw something I had never seen before. Freaked me out a bit... I saw a globe, (of the earth) followed by a folder icon with a question mark on it, flashing, and finally, the spinning wheel. Didn't last very long, and finally booted normally but still... I treat my machines extremely well and see no reason for this to be happening. I'll be making an appointment to visit the Genius bar perhaps tomorrow.

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Odd. I did a little digging and it sounds like the Network Startup option was engaged. If not due to a failing hard drive (which seems the least likely culprit), the suggested causes are a corrupt .plist (most likely culprit imo) or permissions need repairing.

lifeisabeach said:

Odd. I did a little digging and it sounds like the Network Startup option was engaged. If not due to a failing hard drive (which seems the least likely culprit), the suggested causes are a corrupt .plist (most likely culprit imo) or permissions need repairing.

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Interestingly enough, I had run the full automation script with Onyx before this happened. Spotlight was fully indexed and things seemed to be running just fine up until that happened.

Doug

I just bought an early 2011 MBP, 15 inch, and did not opt to get the Apple Care extended warranty. I have used Dell and HP laptops since late 1998/1998 and not once did I have an issue with any of those within the first 3 years. This experience includes my Dad's laptops as well.

Now Consumer Reports rates Apple as BETTER reliability than Dell and almost all the others. One exception is Toshiba.

Reading this thread makes me think that Apple has a poor reliability rating. So poor that you wonder why you buy their product.

My plan is to not get the extended warranty and if an expensive repair happens, I will just head back to a PC laptop for the cost of the repair. $1000 for a repair is just insane.

Not really... people don't usually visit forums to say "Hi all! My computer is working perfectly, and I'm living a wonderful life with money pouring out my pockets and gorgeous women at every turn." Folks come here because they've experienced a problem, for which they have no ready solution, and call on the experience of others to help them solve it. It's like visiting a hospital and making the assumption that the whole world must be sick. The vast majority of Mac users will use their computers for years without experiencing a major hardware failure.

EvenStranger said:

Not really... people don't usually visit forums to say "Hi all! My computer is working perfectly, and I'm living a wonderful life with money pouring out my pockets and gorgeous women at every turn."

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Actually that pretty much describes my situation, except for the money part and its only one woman . . . but that's fine by me."

I don't know how it is in the US, but in the UK when you buy a Mac as a student, you get a student discount .. plus Apple Care for free.
So my final discount including AC was something about 27% ..

.. btw: I switched from PC last August and I don't want to look back.
If I really need Win7 I use Parallels or Bootcamp .. which means once a week or so.

<< Join The Dark Side .. We Have Cookies >>

buy it. either now or later, as it's almost a requirement. Just wait till u got the cash

lifeisabeach said:

The cost of a new logic board for a Mac is absolutely obscene. They shouldn't run more than $300 or so. I think I get it now. Apple marks them up to obscenely expensive levels to make the AppleCare warranty seem like a bargain.

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Maybe, but I doubt it.

What I think you're forgetting is that every Apple motherboard is *custom-designed* (and often in non-standard shapes, meaning they are quite expensive to make) and uses components that, while most are available elsewhere, are uniquely designed to work in harmony. So that is certainly part of the higher cost.

chas_m said:

Maybe, but I doubt it.

What I think you're forgetting is that every Apple motherboard is *custom-designed* (and often in non-standard shapes, meaning they are quite expensive to make) and uses components that, while most are available elsewhere, are uniquely designed to work in harmony. So that is certainly part of the higher cost.

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At triple the cost? Sorry man, that's just nuts. I dunno about the "uniquely designed to work in harmony" bit either. I used to build my Windows boxes, and I followed sites like Anandtech and Tom's Hardware to see who was making the most stable hardware. I can assure you… my hardware worked quite well in harmony. I actually rarely had issues with Windows, certainly far less than most people, and I can easily attribute that to solid hardware that didn't run me anywhere close to a grand for a motherboard.

Well here's a bit of bad news. According to the one Genius I saw, Apple Care doesn't cover the battery after the first year. He determined that my battery was at half life, which to me seemed not so great since it was replaced last year. But I'm told that replacement batteries are never new... they're services parts. And if it's a replacement part, Apple Care won't cover that, either.

I'm going to try bringing it to a different Apple Store for a second opinion, and hope for the best. I'll buy a replacement battery only when it's absolutely necessary, otherwise.

Doug