Should I Wait?

soccaman005 said:

Do you think it is worth waiting for the 2nd or 3rd generation of iPads?

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I am going to wait because first, I don't really need it so I can wait. An Apple employee put the idea in my head that the next generation might have the retina display like on IP4. That display is brilliant.

I suspect you will be waiting quite a while -- at least a year.

are u serious?!

at least a year!??!?!

Yes, I'm serious.

The people I know who still work for Apple (I used to work there) indicate strongly that we will not see any changes in the iPad this year, or well into next. So that puts us at about this point next year. Maybe as early as spring or as late as fall.

This is the exact same pattern they used with the iPhone, the iPod Touch and the AppleTV, so I'm not sure why this shocks people.

The iPad is, as it is, right now, a stunningly marvellous product that Apple can't make fast enough to meet demand. Why in the name of common sense would you bring out a new model anytime soon?

chas_m said:

The iPad is, as it is, right now, a stunningly marvellous product that Apple can't make fast enough to meet demand. Why in the name of common sense would you bring out a new model anytime soon?

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Because of the performance hit of multitasking when 4.1 hits having only 256mb of RAM vs the 512mb of RAM that even the iPhone 4 has?

That's why.

I could be wrong in the end, but only time will tell. Apple often throws in stealth upgrades on system components without necessarily launching a "new version". Happens all the time with Macbook's etc.

schweb said:

Because of the performance hit of multitasking when 4.1 hits having only 256mb of RAM vs the 512mb of RAM that even the iPhone 4 has?

That's why.

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I don't think that's a strong argument.

Reasons:

1. Most iDevices have 256MB or less. My original iPhone still runs nearly every app on the App store. iOS 3.x is still going to be running on literally millions of devices for at least a couple of years to come, so compatibility is important.

2. You've provided zero evidence that multitasking (which is actually chip controlled and CONSERVES ram, not uses more of it) takes any hit AT ALL in 256MB versus 512MB for the iOS.

3. The iPod Touch, all models of iPhone except the 4 and the iPad all work GREAT in 256MB of RAM. Indeed, Apple made a big deal about how the A4 was *specifically designed* to be stingy on RAM and other resources yet still give great performance. I certainly haven't heard anyone complain that their iPad is out of RAM ...

4. Apple wouldn't revise those models just to add 256MB of RAM to them, nor would they risk losing that much backward compatibility by allowing developers to "ghettoize" hardware that doesn't have 512MB of RAM anytime soon. Those other devices will jump up to 512MB of RAM as part of their *normal* upgrade cycles, which is about a year off for most of them.

5. While the added cost is not that significant, it IS an added cost -- at a time when Apple is trying very hard to bring DOWN the prices on these items, and as already shown it just won't make much difference in performance for most iDevices for another year or so.

6. As referred to in the other thread, the iPad isn't going to get a revision this year, so no 512MB for it either. Devs must continue to write as though all iOS devices have 256MB maximum -- indeed, as I mentioned, many iDevices still have LESS than 256MB and most apps are still written to THAT standard.

soccaman005 said:

Do you think it is worth waiting for the 2nd or 3rd generation of iPads?

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No. That's why I have one now.

chas_m said:

1. Most iDevices have 256MB or less. My original iPhone still runs nearly every app on the App store. iOS 3.x is still going to be running on literally millions of devices for at least a couple of years to come, so compatibility is important.

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Most? The iPhone 3GS, the current Touch, and the iPad have 256, the iPhone 4, has 512. Apple obviously felt that was an important change to run iOS 4 at maximum potential, or why would they have bothered to upgrade it? All Apple's new devices are including more RAM.

So sure, most older iDevices are running with 256mb.

2. You've provided zero evidence that multitasking (which is actually chip controlled and CONSERVES ram, not uses more of it) takes any hit AT ALL in 256MB versus 512MB for the iOS.

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Other than the fact that Apple felt it was important enough to bump the RAM to 512mb on the iPhone 4 to better support iOS 4? And anecdotally, I noticed a difference in multitasking performance between my iPhone 3GS and iPhone 4.

3. The iPod Touch, all models of iPhone except the 4 and the iPad all work GREAT in 256MB of RAM. Indeed, Apple made a big deal about how the A4 was *specifically designed* to be stingy on RAM and other resources yet still give great performance. I certainly haven't heard anyone complain that their iPad is out of RAM ...

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You're comparing performance of an iPad on 256mb of RAM on the current OS 3.2 without multitasking to what that iPad would run like using iOS 4.1 with multitasking which can't even be measuered yet?

That's a pretty weak argument.

4. Apple wouldn't revise those models just to add 256MB of RAM to them, nor would they risk losing that much backward compatibility by allowing developers to "ghettoize" hardware that doesn't have 512MB of RAM anytime soon. Those other devices will jump up to 512MB of RAM as part of their *normal* upgrade cycles, which is about a year off for most of them.

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iPhone 4 already uses 512mb of RAM and hasn't broken backwards compatibility so your argument doesn't hold water.

5. While the added cost is not that significant, it IS an added cost -- at a time when Apple is trying very hard to bring DOWN the prices on these items, and as already shown it just won't make much difference in performance for most iDevices for another year or so.

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The minor cost would be insignificant to the profit margin of the device. I would also assume that Apple has a pretty sweet deal on 512mb modules given that's the same one used in the iPhone 4.

Given the impending release of Android tablets this fall, I'm pretty sure Apple would be exploring all options.

6. As referred to in the other thread, the iPad isn't going to get a revision this year, so no 512MB for it either. Devs must continue to write as though all iOS devices have 256MB maximum -- indeed, as I mentioned, many iDevices still have LESS than 256MB and most apps are still written to THAT standard.

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As I've already stated, that argument is uber weak. The iPhone 4 already has 512 so your argument falls apart based on that alone.

As for what you said in the other thread about no revision this year, that statement is just as much your own opinion as repeating it here.

No one but some inside Apple know what will or will not happen this year.

schweb said:

Other than the fact that Apple felt it was important enough to bump the RAM to 512mb on the iPhone 4 to better support iOS 4? And anecdotally, I noticed a difference in multitasking performance between my iPhone 3GS and iPhone 4.

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Agreed, iOS4 is best suited for the iPhone4,A friend and I did a side by side with the 3G,3GS and iPhone4 all running 4.0 there is a difference in performance between all 3. Personally I would rather 3.1.3 on my 3GS than 4.0 and especially on a 3G when compared next to a iPhone4.

Schweb,

You are making a lot of assumptions. Let's wait and see how iOS 4 works on the iPad before making any declarations regarding performance. For all we know, it may run fantastic on the first gen iPad.

J.Fo said:

Schweb,

You are making a lot of assumptions. Let's wait and see how iOS 4 works on the iPad before making any declarations regarding performance. For all we know, it may run fantastic on the first gen iPad.

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I'm not making any assumptions, it's well known hardware. It's almost pretty much the difference between an iPhone 3GS with 256mb and an iPhone 4 with 512mb. The hardware, other than the larger screen is not all that terribly different.

bargsbeer said:

If history has taught us anything about Apple. It's not to expect any major changes in the first revision.

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And IMO why fix something that isnt broken.  have broken a lot of records with this iPad, and i cant see in the near future of a 2nd Gen just yet as they are still selling a heck of a lot of this product.
So to the OP Buy NOW as you will be upset when you are waiting 18mnths + for the 2nd Gen

soccaman005 said:

How much could i sell the 1st gen for when the 2nd gen comes out? Like 400 dollars or would it be lower?

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Ummm How long is a piece of string ??? Really That is a silly question.
I have a mate that could sell ice to eskimos so i would say sell it for what you bought it for. There will be someone silly enough to pay full price for a 2nd hand machine

Cheers

schweb said:

I'm not making any assumptions, it's well known hardware. It's almost pretty much the difference between an iPhone 3GS with 256mb and an iPhone 4 with 512mb. The hardware, other than the larger screen is not all that terribly different.

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You're making assumptions regarding the performance of iOS 4 on the iPad. I don't know what differences you are seeing between the 3GS and the iPhone 4, but when I do a quick side-by-side comparison of my new phone with my wife's 3GS, I don't see anything remotely resembling a performance hit on the older model, even with half as much RAM. Maybe a some apps load faster on the iPhone 4, but who wouldn't expect some performance improvement on a newer model?

This is what I see when I read this long line of arguments here:

All statements are based off of the iDevice RAM.

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What everyone involved in the debate is completely forgetting about?

The speed of the processor.

The second gen iPod touch and iPhone 3GS both can run iOS 4 because the MHz of the CPU is over 500 MHz. The RAM of the second generation iPod touch is the same as the first: 128 MB.

The iPhone 3G and iPod touch 1st generation have the same processor speed: under 500 MHz.

The point that I'm trying to make here is that RAM does not determine what iOS 4 can run on!

Chris H. said:

The point that I'm trying to make here is that RAM does not determine what iOS 4 can run on!

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No one is even saying that. What the argument is over is how true multitasking will be affected by having more or less RAM. You're missing the gist of the entire argument if you think we're talking about whether the current iPad can run iOS 4.