Downfall of MacOS?

JRV · Jun 8, 2005

Is this new report of MacOS's being able to go on custom built PC's going to be the downfall of the Mac OS? Isn't one of the reasons the MacOS's are so flawless because they can develop it knowing what computer components it will go on? If people will be able to build their own computers won't the MacOS encounter the same problems windows does?

Murlyn · Jun 8, 2005

It will still be the same.. you'll be able to run windows on the new mac boxes, but you will not be able to run Macs on anything but those boxes that Apple creates.

rs2sensen · Jun 8, 2005

this makes what, the 10th topic on this subject? I'm sorry, but this is getting out of hand.

to your question, which is a valid one. Although a few hackers will figure out how to run OS X on their PCs, it will not be very widespread. And if they have technical issues, thats not my problem.

I've heard that Apple will most likely put something in the motherboard that will be required for OS X. Computers without that will not be able to run OS X, so OS X stays on Apple hardware.

Windows will technically be able to run on mac hardware.

swanny338 · Jun 8, 2005

DRM is going to be built directly into the processor, basically impossible to hack unless you are willing to open you processor and do some major physical alterations to the chip.... To install Mac OS, the DRM has to be set correctly so it can link to the OS....

Avid6eek · Jun 8, 2005

DRM has to do with limiting the free use of copywrited materials, but has nothing to do with allowing only OS X to be installed on the system. When the technology is released it will be on all Intel processors...not just the Pentiums that go into the Mac systems.

And you can't exactly disect the die of a processor and do "physical alterations to the chip."

Cloudane · Jun 9, 2005

Also nothing is 'impossible to hack'. They said that about iTunes DRM, Microsoft said it about Activation etc etc but everything gets hacked... and quickly.

The only fairly safe protection I can think of is if they encrypt the entire OS and make it so that only one of their special motherboard chips (an unreadable smartchip type) can decrypt it. I can't see them going to those lengths

Brown Study · Jun 9, 2005

Apple For Sale?

Nowhere on the web can I find any speculation that the switch to Intel is to make the sale of Apple easier; the possibility seems so ugly that the Mac community is in denial. My darkest thoughts include Microsoft raiding its petty-cash box to purchase Apple on the condition that Leopard II, along with the established OS X base using Rosetta, can run on Intel chips. The notion might be laughed out of court, but the reality of Macs with Intel inside is as grotesque.

With one stroke, Microsoft's dual-boot systems would solve it's Windows-security nightmare and legacy bloat while ensuring that all the old code and apps remain as safe as houses.

As for the argument that such a purchase would run afoul of anti-competition laws, Linux would take over Apple's old role as the system most quoted as protecting Microsoft against that charge. Linux is more popular than Apple was when that contention was first mooted.

Could someone with more knowledge of the industry please shoot this down?

iLEFTOVERCRACK · Jun 9, 2005

rs2sensen said:
this makes what, the 10th topic on this subject? I'm sorry, but this is getting out of hand.

thank you

supremeoverlord · Jun 9, 2005

You guys don't seem to get it. Let's look at this realistically. Who is going to run a cracked version of OSX on a PC box? My mom? My dad? Me? Most computer users that are confused by virus emails? NO, it will only be the small part of the computer world that like to hack download illegally and stuff like that, not your average user. This is good. Because first of all they own a PC to begin with so its not like Apple lost a sale as far as this person is concerned. Secondly Apple probably feels that if anyone sits down with OSX for a while they will prefer it over windows. If they don't then they won't have ever bought a Mac, but if they do at least they aren't using Windows, plus when they talk to people they will tell them they run OSX (thats their seal of approval). And when it comes time for them to buy a new computer, do you think they will buy a PC box and then go to all the trouble of hacking osx again, installing it and all that if they already have OSX software to run on the system? Or is it more likely they will spend a small amount more for a Mac that comes with a real version of OSX, iLife, and all the other free software, PLUS the ability to load linux and windows if they want? It would make more sense to hack windows at that point... if they actually use it anymore.

rs2sensen · Jun 9, 2005

supremeoverlord said:
You guys don't seem to get it. Let's look at this realistically. Who is going to run a cracked version of OSX on a PC box? My mom? My dad? Me? Most computer users that are confused by virus emails? NO, it will only be the small part of the computer world that like to hack download illegally and stuff like that, not your average user. This is good. Because first of all they own a PC to begin with so its not like Apple lost a sale as far as this person is concerned. Secondly Apple probably feels that if anyone sits down with OSX for a while they will prefer it over windows. If they don't then they won't have ever bought a Mac, but if they do at least they aren't using Windows, plus when they talk to people they will tell them they run OSX (thats their seal of approval). And when it comes time for them to buy a new computer, do you think they will buy a PC box and then go to all the trouble of hacking osx again, installing it and all that if they already have OSX software to run on the system? Or is it more likely they will spend a small amount more for a Mac that comes with a real version of OSX, iLife, and all the other free software, PLUS the ability to load linux and windows if they want? It would make more sense to hack windows at that point... if they actually use it anymore.

be careful when you say "you guys don't seem to get it." its not everybody, I've been preaching that exact same thing all over this forum.

Cloudane · Jun 9, 2005

Thinking about it more and more, even if they officially allowed it to be installed on normal PCs and offered it as a box on the shelf in PC World (or wall market or whatever the US equivalent is) - I think practically nobody except geeks would install it. The masses get "a computer" and the OS is part of that - most general public computer users I know think that "Windows", "Microsoft" and "PC" all refer to the box. Some even forget about the box and think they refer to the screen.

The major part of gaining market share is obviously being the one to install your OS by default through OEMs because most people just buy "a computer" and that's that. Maybe an option for Apple if they decide on that route. But... chicken and egg... until OSX is popular, OEMs won't want it as an option because it'll cause lots of expensive support calls along the lines of "why won't setup.exe run" and angry customers.

So.... Apple need to raise awareness of what an Operating System is, what it means if someone switches (including the downsides i.e. existing software) and why they should do it. Otherwise... I don't know.

sarahsboy18 · Jun 9, 2005

I have to agree with some of the later posts here.... Most of Apple's customers IMO are proffesional types... heck, they are the only ones who can afford them.... I don't have time to sit around and figure out how to use a hack of OSX to get it onto a PC and nor will they.

I really don't expect hacking to have any real effect on Apple's marketshare. Sure they hacked the iTunes and the Xbox.... but the people that use them the most are the types that would be more likely to hack them... And truth be told the percentage of hacked Xboxes compared to how many of them sold and haven't been hacked.... I don't think Microsoft has any complaints.

Now, Dual-boot...... Eh... Virtual PC has been around for years... And although this would be a significant speed increase for XP on a Mac... I don't see it doing too much damage to Mac OS X. But then again I am a XP hater so I am certainly not objective.

As long as Apple doesn't do something stupid I think their proffesional base will stay intact... Whether they get killed in the home computing market... I guess we will see. With the introduction of the Mini I think they just might have began to awaken the 800lb gorilla.

zap2 · Jun 9, 2005

what can windows do to hurt apple, those few people who HATE window(me) will never use windows, im with apple, apple could have less then 1% but im still with em Apple

Colin Barnhorst · Jun 9, 2005

Give it some time.

sarahsboy18 said:
I have to agree with some of the later posts here.... Most of Apple's customers IMO are proffesional types... heck, they are the only ones who can afford them.... I don't have time to sit around and figure out how to use a hack of OSX to get it onto a PC and nor will they.

I really don't expect hacking to have any real effect on Apple's marketshare. Sure they hacked the iTunes and the Xbox.... but the people that use them the most are the types that would be more likely to hack them... And truth be told the percentage of hacked Xboxes compared to how many of them sold and haven't been hacked.... I don't think Microsoft has any complaints.

Now, Dual-boot...... Eh... Virtual PC has been around for years... And although this would be a significant speed increase for XP on a Mac... I don't see it doing too much damage to Mac OS X. But then again I am a XP hater so I am certainly not objective.

As long as Apple doesn't do something stupid I think their proffesional base will stay intact... Whether they get killed in the home computing market... I guess we will see. With the introduction of the Mini I think they just might have began to awaken the 800lb gorilla.

Give this thing some time. I know it is hard to do because the folks who post here are sincerely worried about the future of their emotional and financial investments in the Mac culture.

But what else can you do?

I don't know how Apple is going to control the "Osborne" effect for the next year, but I hope they can. I also hope Apple keeps the cost to develpers to a minimum as well.

As a Microsoft MVP for Windows - Virtual Machine, I offer my best wishes to all of the Mac community as it goes through what's has to be an uncomfortable and expensive transition (once again).

Murlyn · Jun 10, 2005

I've heard several people say they are going to purchase now, so that they can get a PPC processor, which will still run everything put out for years to come, and take them through the switchover and by the time they need another computer all the bugs will be worked out with the Mactel boxes. Im of the same mind.. and when I need to make some purchases at the end of this year.. Im definitely doing it

And I will buy the new PPC systems that Apple comes out with later this year.

sarahsboy18 · Jun 10, 2005

Murlyn said:
I've heard several people say they are going to purchase now, so that they can get a PPC processor, which will still run everything put out for years to come, and take them through the switchover and by the time they need another computer all the bugs will be worked out with the Mactel boxes. Im of the same mind.. and when I need to make some purchases at the end of this year.. Im definitely doing it And I will buy the new PPC systems that Apple comes out with later this year.

Me too... It's gonna be awhile before they work the kinks out of this transition. During the 9 to OSX transition I actually just took a couple years off from using Mac and went back to my PC roots... just until everything settled down. But this time it's nice because the transition from a software standpoint will allow me not to have to do that.

Cloudane · Jun 10, 2005

I've heard several people say they are going to purchase now, so that they can get a PPC processor, which will still run everything put out for years to come

I like that way of thinking

I wonder if the number of people thinking that way is far off the number of people waiting for Intel chips. I certainly wouldn't want to be one of the first after a switchover... been there done that *shudder* (not with Apple, but with other things)

As for people buying Macs just to run Windows, I find that even more absurd than the people who buy Macs just to install Linux. Why use those half-assed operating systems when you've already got and paid for the real thing? It'll make switching easier though - if people can play their win32 games and use things like Access and AutoCAD at a comfortable speed when they need to, more will switch.

Brown Study · Jun 10, 2005

Apple For Sale?

Check out I, Cringely. He bolsters my argument on the previous page of this thread that Apple is up for sale.

Cloudane · Jun 10, 2005

Heh, I read that....

I think our iCringely has been eating too many brightly coloured iMacs. Then again, I would've said the same if he'd said Apple would switch to Intel...

TTheInfamous1 · Jun 10, 2005

I'm sorry, I have to ask.....

I really do not want to open up the can of worms anymore then it has already been, and I hate rumors. IMHO, this kind of worries me a bit. (So Im not going to even get into the reason why I made the switch to Apple [IBM PowerPC chips] from Intel, AMD, etc chip based computers that run Windows)

Anyway....

I hate to ask, but I dont 'really know what this all means. This switch to Intel... Is this going to be a bad thing? I know we all have opinions, which is all good, so I'm not taking sides here. Will Apple still be using this Unix based operating and programming even though it will use Intel? I mean, how will this affect Apple's stability and all that as it is now? Will Apple have the problems that Windows based Intel and other chips that non-Apple PC's use?

I hope this makes some sense in what Im asking. Like I said, I really do not know what this means or what it could mean. IMHO, its a pretty valid question.

Thanks for the insite. And please don't kill me for these questions.

I found this link that seems a bit disturbing.... http://www.macworld.co.uk/news/index.cfm?NewsID=11809&Page=1&pagePos=6

Downfall of MacOS?

JRV

Murlyn

rs2sensen

swanny338

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Avid6eek

Cloudane

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Brown Study

iLEFTOVERCRACK

supremeoverlord

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rs2sensen

Cloudane

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sarahsboy18

zap2

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Colin Barnhorst

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Murlyn

sarahsboy18

Cloudane

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Brown Study

Cloudane

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TTheInfamous1

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