DRM-free music - admission it *doesn't work* - now how about DVD region codes now..?

lifeisabeach said:

go DRM-free is a HUGE and long-desired acknowledgement by the music cartel that DRM sucks... it's overly restrictive... it does NOT deter piracy....

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Now, when is the MPAA going to see the same thing when it comes to region coding - I keep thinking this must *really* tick off the Québecois Canadians as Canada is Region 1 while France is Region 2 - and I'm quite sure there are French movies that are *not* realeased in Region 1..

Yeah, there are region-free/region-settable players.. But having an acknoledgement that it simply does not work would be nice and save us a bit of hassle.. Are there any that will automatically detect which region a disc is set for, and set themselves without any intervention - so they will work correctly with RPC2 discs? Or have the geo-pricing projectionists come out with RPC3 or something even more heinous and annoying?)

Similarly, why the *bleep* does Amazon and (I think) almost everyone else run a racket on import CDs? If I buy a Sissel (Norwegian singer) CD from Amazon, it's an import and costs about $25-$30 (compared to $18-19 for a US produced CD). if I buy it "used" from a zShop, it costs anywhere from$10-18 (and that's including shipping) And the strange thing is, these "used" CDs look **** new to me! Just without that annoying cellophane that usually takes about 10 minutes to try to get off the cd..

Annoying, A FEW of Sissel's CDs (and other foreign artists) are produced/distributed in the US, but most are not.. Hello? We DO have transatlantic OC-3 cables people.. Get a clue!

I wonder - would it be possible to make some kind of a reusuable plastic master CD? I'm thinking a Wal-mart style kiosk where you would select songs or an album, select either standard cover art or your own.. Then it would download the songs from where-ever, burn a "temporary" master and then make an actual metal-foil CD (not a CD-R), inkjet print it or something else. Maybe even color lightscribe using a four-arm CD burner, and some new light-sensitive dye that would respond to 4 different wavelengths of laser light for full CMYK capability? Anybody know someone at HP? And a patent attorney for me?

Then it would stick it in a jewel case (or SACD/European-type Super Jewel Case), gift box it, whatever. You pick your songs, go shop, then come back 30 minutes later and your CD is done..

The big question would be - can you make a re-usuable plastic master CD that would re required to do the foil pressing - or could you use some other method to do the same thing)

The whole reigon coding thig was invented to stop piracy. So many many cheap and inferior copies could not flood your local market and put local businessmen out of a job. And secondly if you want the imported item new instead of used then you have t pay the premium for it. There's no bones about it.

There is a reigon zero for dvds. That zero works on any player. I have a few music dvds that are region zero. They could jsut make every dvd regiom zero. But that'd not stop the piracy issue.

And about your idea. Forget Walmart, just go to your local CD printer/distributer. And they can take a master dvd and print off copies for you in any region you want. Complete with a fancy picture on the disc and a nice printed cover and case. I know soemone in this buisness and they can do it so easily. So just get them to do it. It'd take a few days to get your order made and shipped to you but it work.

But I think you're talling about a vending machine. Where they have the data on the computer in the vending machine. No need for a plastic master cd these days. And the machine is like a disco juke box. But instead of playing the song you want, it burns the album to cd prints on the cisc and blank cover and spits you out a copy of the album. I think stores would love this as there would be no dead stock of dead albums. As there'd only be blanks that can be used for any album.

So a CD or DVD vending machine. That is a novel idea. Heck if they can have ice cream vending machines that actually make the ice cream to order for each person, I think your idea could just work.

I'm not quite sure how the jump from DRM to region codes in terms of preventing piracy. Region codes are the LEAST of anyones problems when it comes to preventing piracy as it provides no form of copy protection - where DRM does.

DRM is more to the encryption included on a DVD then it is to region codes. Region codes are more for release control and price control - you can take a region coded disc and play it on a region free player. It's not the same as copy protection that prevents you from making a backup or copy of a DVD (or in the case of piracy, copy a dvd to give to someone else, or attempt to copy a DRM item (I say item as music and videos can have DRM attached) to give to someone else).

It'd take some serious evidence to convince me that region codes were designed to work as a form of piracy protection.

I never said reigon work as a piracy prevention. That failed. And drm was more sussessful. But that was one of it's (the reigon code) original purposes. And it'd take some serious evidence to convince me otherwise.

Well, you're saying that region codes original purpose was piracy prevention - can you show some reference material that relates to that?

Don't know that I could find any reference material (and don't really want to go looking), but as I understood it at the time, it was one of the secondary reasons for region coding. Of course it didn't work all that well for that. I believe the primary reason was to enable the studios control over the release dates in different countries. They just didn't want to spend the money that would have been necessary to print enough copies of the film for simultaneous world wide release and of course didn't want the DVD competing in countries where it was still first run in the theaters.

According to my senile memory, it did take a couple of years before there were hacks available for computer optical drives and 3-4 years before companies like Oppo started putting out region free players.

AFAIK the region code purposes was to set (as bobtomay mentioned) different release dates and potentially different price regions - and also to help prevent people that are in NTSC countries from attempting to use PAL DVDs (and vise versa). Honestly, until today, I had never read anyone mentioning the use of region codes as a form of piracy protection as from everything I understood about DVDs, that was the purpose of using CSS and CPPM.

I think the studios came out with an arm's length list of why it was beneficial to them, uh, the consumer I mean.

I don't care about region codes, I want to see the DMCA repealed so that we actually get Fair-use when it comes to DVDs like we do for CDs. Contradicting laws FTL.