What Mac For Music Production

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Hi!

Coming from a G5 Dual Power PC, and about to purchase a new MAC in the next 2 days, Money is not so much a concern but at the same time i do not want to waste it if i don't need to. Put it this way i have put aside $4500 AUD Which is Australia dollars.

I have a dilemma as i recently put down a deposit on a New Mac Pro but with the Harpertower processor only to find a few days later Mac released the Nehlem processor. So i walk in the Apple store and i am told by one of the sales reps that i don't even need a Mac Pro as the New I Mac will be more then capable to run 16 to 20 Midi and Audio tracks, with AU plugins and shitload of Effects.

What do i do, do i purchase the first Mac 8 Core, the new Nehlem processor one, or just the I Mac...wow its tough!

Thanks
Antoine
:Evil:
 
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20" Imac 2.66 C2D 2gb Ram
I just got an Imac last week (new model) only got 2gb of memory and i can open more than 16 midi channels on cubase, really smooth, in protools so far i opened 13 audio tracks recording a band with eq's verbs, limiter.... and no slowdowns or anything. Im very happy with the performance on this machine.
If i had the money i got for a Mac pro, u dont know if u need more power down the road. My imac have done everything i ask her to do so far. Lets see what happen later on. And now with the max memory to 8gb, its going to be better :Evil:
 
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...What do i do, do i purchase the first Mac 8 Core, the new Nehlem processor one, or just the I Mac...wow its tough!

Thanks
Antoine
:Evil:
Hey Antoine,

In addition to vashpr's comments, you may be interested in reading what people had to say about the iMac at the thread I started here...

http://www.mac-forums.com/forums/mu...009-mac-mini-imac-audio-recording-mixing.html

I still haven't purchased my DAW computer. This will be my first audio computer, and since it's going to be a dedicated machine, I think I'm going to get one of the new iMac's.

However, my funds are limited. If I had the funds I'd probably get one of the new Mac Pro's and just be set for quite some time.

I guess some questions to consider would be... Do you already have all the outboard gear and software you need? Do you already have a nice monitor? Are you doing professional work with your DAW?

If you're doing professional production work you might want to go for the Mac Pro (I'm sure any one of them is more than sufficient). The Mac Pro is more expandable than the iMac. It's just a monster workhorse. A friend of mine does professional recording studio work with one and he doesn't have a single complaint.

The base model Mac Pro is pretty sweet right out of the box! It's got a 2.66Mhz Quad Core Xeon, plenty of ram (expandable to 8gb for a reasonable price, compared to 8gb ram for the iMac), double the amount of graphics memory (also expandable) as the iMac.

That being said, if you're a home hobbyist and not doing professional production work, I'm betting you'd be plenty happy with an iMac and pocketing the rest of your $$, (or spending it on other fun toys and/or software!).

Good luck either way! Let us know what you decide and how it goes once everything is up and running.

Best,
LB
 
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Thanks for the reply Boyz....Well i can tell you that i consider being a professional, that is not to say that i always create professional stuff! But i have spent a a nice bit of cash on my outborad gear and i guess this is the final kit that puts it all in place.

The biggest problem i have is the Guy at the Apple store is very highly recommended as knowing his stuff, and he is also a producer! It si very interesting to hear what he has to say about the Imac VS Mac Pro story below are some of the things he has said and showed me......this is how he convinced me that all i need is an Imac

So

He loaded Logic on the Mac Pro and showed the CPU usage on about 30 Tracks going at it right all loaded with effects, and pointed at the CPU usage, which was running at about 3% meaning their was room for 97% more...what he then pointed at was the ram, he said this is the only thing that really is going to matter in the end of the day...and the more of this the better!

He explained how their is a Threshold and Logic is never really going to ever ever cross that regardless of how hard you use it, again the only thing that matters is Ram.....He then did the exact same thing on an IMac, where the CPU was at about 8% going!
He then goes on to tell me that i can easy with a breez run 30 to 40 tracks in an Imac AU plugins and effects with no drama....

What i later get told is essentially the MacPro will last longer then the IMac in time, but said that by the time new applications come out in 3 years the Mac Pro will still struggle as new applications takes advantage of new technology so in the end of the day i have wasted my money on Computer i am never really going to keep for 5 years anyways.....so he said spend less and replace the IMac in 3 years time....

**** this guy made alot of sence as the other Apple guys had no idea and tried to sell me The new Mac Pro, and worse yet they had no good or reason or good explain why! They just said cause it is Pro, well big ****, that means nothing!

I liked what i learnt and regardless i am going to buy either one, but **** i still sit confused.................Thanks
 
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Thanks for the reply Boyz....
'Welcome!

Well i can tell you that i consider being a professional, that is not to say that i always create professional stuff! But i have spent a a nice bit of cash on my outborad gear and i guess this is the final kit that puts it all in place.
That's cool. It's awesome that you have a bunch of outboard gear and that you're doing professional audio work!

...What i later get told is essentially the MacPro will last longer then the IMac in time, but said that by the time new applications come out in 3 years the Mac Pro will still struggle as new applications takes advantage of new technology...
Wow! It's crazy to think that the beastly Mac Pro machines will be obsolete in 3 years. But he's probably right, and probably not far off the mark.

...so in the end of the day i have wasted my money on Computer i am never really going to keep for 5 years anyways.....so he said spend less and replace the IMac in 3 years time...
This is a very interesting argument, and one that I had not considered. He's got a good point. No matter what you get, it's going to become out-dated in a few years time. It will need to be upgraded or just plain replaced. The point the sales guy made makes me feel even better about getting an iMac as a dedicated DAW machine!

Please keep us updated regarding your final decision. I'm interested in hearing what you choose and how everything works out.
 
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Absolutley i will keep you updated i have made my mind up and picking up the IMac tommorrow morning, i will let you all know how i go....

Yes well it seems he is not the only Apple sales rep that recently told me the same thing, its funny i went into another Apple store and this shop is very very big its huge.....let me tell you that on diplay they have about 100 or so Apple laptops, about 50 Imacs, and guess what in the lonely corener all on its own their is one Mac Pro, and i was like what is going on here! The Apple guys all said the same thing "No one wants them any more man, now that the Laptops and IMacs have so much power and are 30% cheaper!

They did tell me that the serious serious hardcore Video and Graphics design guys need them but no one else really, oh and the Film and TV Guys!

Thats it its final im getting the Top end Imac its easy now!
 
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2.66Ghz Penryn C2D iMac
My iMac handles everything I throw at it. Back in the days of PPC processors the Pro level machine was the way to go if you were serious but now even the lowly Mini has a multicore CPU that can handle more work than an old PPC dual G5 could. Mac Pros are great if you are A) independently wealthy, B)make money off of doing music and can use it as a tax write-off, C) also run alot of video editing services. Other than that, an iMac is a pretty good deal for what you can do with it.

It's funny he used Logic, I use Logic and there are some functions it does that don't even take advantage of multi-core CPUs. Take a look at CPU usage in the transport bar when you are bouncing tracks down, it only uses one core, which is probably the most processor intensive thing that a DAW does.
 
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Absolutley i will keep you updated i have made my mind up and picking up the IMac tommorrow morning, i will let you all know how i go....
Awesome! Thanks for the update, Antoine! Definitely keep us posted. Are you getting the 20" or the 24"?

I attended the GarageBand workshop last night. It was a blast! It's a fun, and very user-friendly program.

Turns out, there's actually an Apple store about 20minutes from my office, and I didn't even realize. So... I submitted my resume and a job application this morning. I don't know if they're actually hiring with this crummy economy. But I figured it'd be worth a shot just for part-time. I'm sure it's a fun place to work, and the employee discounts would be nice too!

If I don't get a p/t job with the Apple store, I'll probably get the 20" iMac and Logic. If I do get a p/t job with them, I'll probably hold out for something more beastly. I'll let ya's know.
 
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Yes well i am here to let you know that i purchased the IMac 24 inch with 8GB of ram, and wow!

After installing Logic which is always a pain in the asse, i was up and running, i finished my first track on ther machine which i wish i could up load. I had 22 tracks all midi and 1 audio track.....i guess i was running at least 40 Logic effects au plugins and guess what it was simple for I Mac, the little cpu thing on Logic was moving a little to the high end but hey at that amount of tracks and effects its good! I bounced my track and it took less then 45 secs to bounce! After that i loaded it in Itunes and it tool less then 30 secs to transfer to a 4.3mb MP3 File.

The 24 inch glossy gigantic screen is a bonus, and dont believe what anyone says this monster does not get hot, i ran it for 12 hours and it was cool and importantly very very very silent! What can i say, apart from my Virus this is one of my best purchases for my studio! Final words, Logic is Smooth operating, and the next 2 years will be a breeze until the next IMAC Release anyways!

Peace
 
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Yes well i am here to let you know that i purchased the IMac 24 inch with 8GB of ram, and wow!
Wow indeed, that's awesome! Congrats on your new iMac! Which processor did you choose, if you don't mind me asking?

The 24 inch glossy gigantic screen is a bonus...
I'll bet! Seeing the 24" iMacs in person was quite a treat.

...and dont believe what anyone says this monster does not get hot, i ran it for 12 hours and it was cool and importantly very very very silent!...
This is great news!

...this is one of my best purchases for my studio! Final words, Logic is Smooth operating, and the next 2 years will be a breeze until the next IMAC Release anyways!
Awesome! Sounds like you made the right choice for your setup. Have a blast!

Thanks very much for updating us and for providing your feedback! Much appreciated.

Best,
LB
 
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MacBook Pro , 2.4ghz, 200gb HD, 4GB RAM; PowerBook G4 12".
you've got to think about longevity too. the mac pro will be faster.
 
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Sooper Fast!
I was using a 2.13 c2d MBP with Logic. Logic pro 7 had some real issues, but Logic studio is great.

I do all live and no midi and I was running something like 50 some tracks on a song without having problems.
 
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The Stillview on MySpace Music - Free Streaming MP3s, Pictures & Music Downloads


Done with:

Hardware: an iMac 2.66GHZ C2D Penryn with 4G of memory, Line 6 KB37 interface and midi keyboard, Yamaha DTXpress drum kit, and turtle beach Midi-USB cable.

Software: Garageband 09, Line 6 Gearbox, Line 6 PODfarm, GuitarRig 3.1, Superior Drummer 2.0 w/Drumkit from H3LL plugin, and ALL the Jam-packs.

People on it, me and Cliff my guitarist. I played drums and keys, he played guitars and basses. Amount of tracks, lots! Usually 1 for the drums (bless midi), 7-8 for the guitars, and all kinds of other midi instruments on top. Does the iMac ever have hard time with this? No way! It chugs away without a complaint. I don't think a Mac Pro is necessary for anything but running a full song PCI-bus driven interface like a Pro-Tools HD, Appogee or top dog MOTU. I am running quite a bit of effects and tracks and haven't had any issues, I think an iMac is great solution for amateurs.
 
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Well here's an arrogant opinion to throw into the mix... ('scuse the pun)

I think in many ways, high CPU power results in poor workflow practices, especially where Logic and Live are concerned. I attend the Mac Audio Trainer meetups in NYC, and see a lot of people who insist on having multi-track, multi-soft synth "live" mixes... simply because they have the CPU horsepower to do it. Just because you CAN do something, doesn't necessarily mean you should. So, don't reply right now, I already hear you say "but it's better to have the flexibility... I might NEED 7 space designers on each of my drum instruments...". Er... no you don't. I've seen orbital so a live set with two Nord Leads and two Macbook Pros, without so much as a glitch.

The reason doing this is poor practice, even if you can, is that people tend to rush their workflow to get "instant" results, and then never actually spend any time/effort or thinking on the mixing. As anyone on the pro or semi pro side know, the mixing is the next most important factor, after the composition. In my experience, people who consistently crave more CPU power, are poor mixers.

There are people who insist their photography is not as good as it could be, because they "only" have a Rebel XT rather than a 1D - it's the same issue, IMO.

Any new Mac will run Logic just fine, and you should be able to mix to any professional quality, even with the lowliest MacBook. My 3 year old MacBook runs Logic 8 Studio just fine, without any hint of struggling, and if like me you'e been doing this since the Atari ST days, you'll have more power than you'll ever know what to do with.

Evilgenious - great purchase. ;D
 
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Thanks Zoolook i couldnt agree with you more, i think alot of Producers and creative peeps be it digital or Video suffer from the i need more gear or Computer power syndrome. The reason for this is simple, Technology and its creative advertising is always at our head telling us to make that great next purchase which is going to improve our creative prowness, when in actual fact it never really does.

I learnt this very quickly as i have spent over $40k on my studio, i am very proud of it, but does it help me with my music creativity the answer is no, but does it give me an orgasim, yes! Especially when i pull the rug of which keeps the dust away and see all that great gear smiling at me! For the record i dont have that much gear! Have an MPC 2500, Nord Rack x 2. Virus TI, Foc Liquid Mix, Korg Triton, Roland Juno G and the original Mini Moog, i mean the Actual Dr Moog Original all still working! All this connects via a Foc Audio interface, i run a very simple SL Novation Midi and all powers to IMac! I have other bits of gear, LCD Screens and a shitload of Dj Gear and so on!

Is it special, very much so, but my point is this.... the kid down the street is operating his Laptop with Reason 3 on a pentium 4 and is pulling great mixes in his do it in all one Box setup and has not spent a sent as his friend lent him a craked copy....What it is...is that as a producer in your mind you are always being critical and may think your music sounds like junk, and the remedy to this is to buy another bit of kit thinking this will improve your skills! It may improve a hole in your POCKET but not your skills B. Anyways enjoy making beats and live it up! I am and will still continue to buy the next bit of gear because i can!

Do i need to NO, sometimes i dont even use it, i swear that i have had my Nord Rack for 1 year and have not even heard its presets.....LOL
 
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Hi pleased to meet you all. I'm a Windows man who's moving to Mac as a trial to see how much fun I can have (in the Amiga days I loved computing, I'm hoping Mac can feel similar)

Just out of interest - I've just ordered a Mac Mini - the basic one with upgrade to 2gb ram - to have some fun with Mac OSX basically - I'll see if I like the Apple way of doing things. I have an Edirol outboard USB sound card - is there any point using it for Cubase? If there is then maybe it would be fun to have a tiny machine to gig with - an earlier poster said the sound was awful, but with an external Edirol sound it should be ok surely?

Thanks guys :) Be nice to me, I've almost no idea about Mac :)
 
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Hi pleased to meet you all. I'm a Windows man who's moving to Mac as a trial to see how much fun I can have (in the Amiga days I loved computing, I'm hoping Mac can feel similar)

Just out of interest - I've just ordered a Mac Mini - the basic one with upgrade to 2gb ram - to have some fun with Mac OSX basically - I'll see if I like the Apple way of doing things. I have an Edirol outboard USB sound card - is there any point using it for Cubase? If there is then maybe it would be fun to have a tiny machine to gig with - an earlier poster said the sound was awful, but with an external Edirol sound it should be ok surely?

Thanks guys :) Be nice to me, I've almost no idea about Mac :)

I am not sure of the specs of your Edirol sound card, but broadly speaking, the Mac does not benefit from external sound cards or even internal ones, other than having additional audio inputs/outputs.

It's actually worth understanding exactly how and why the soundcard became so important on Windows machines. It all goes back to the days when PCs barely had enough horsepower to draw lines on the screen, much less playback multi-track samples or add effects like reverb. Even when CPUs were powerful enough to do this, Microsoft's poor APIs meant that the PC always struggled with latency and stability issues. If the system's attention was diverted to, say, an anti-virus scan or even some unexpected call to the HDD, everything stalled and your mix/jam or whatever stuttered.

This lead to a huge market in both soundcards (everything from Turtlebeach to Soundlaster) and the growth of alternative APIs, such as ASIO, to basically remove the whole audio loop from whatever else the OS was doing.

Ironically enough, MS actually wiped all of this away with Vista. There is now virtually no advantage to having a $300 sound card in Vista over a generic, integrated VIA chip on the motherboard, in terms of internal sound quality. Again, the only real advantage is the number and quality of audio inputs/outputs. This is probably the one and only great feature of Vista (although they messed it up in the original version, it was fixed in SP1).

Macs use Core Audio, which puts all the work on the CPU - in theory, a Mac Mini is more than capable of entirely creating, mixing and mastering a track of commercial quality for either music, or even film.

I am exceptionally biased, but I would say Logic or Ableton Live are better suited to the Mac than Cubase, which IMO suffers from poor workflow. I started on Cubase on the Atari, went as far as Cubase VST 4 on the PC, and then switched to Mac and went straight to Logic. Logic Studio is also far better value for money, considering the massive sample library you get with it (more than 40GBs) and the instruments that come for free.

Having said that, your Mini will handle Cubase with no trouble at all.
 
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Hello,

I recently purchased Logic Studio, and am getting ready to install it onto my ~2006 Macbook. I know it has the minimum requirements, but I figure I'll be in the market for a new computer in the next six months or so, depending on what deals come by. I'm a music student and my professors highly recommended that I become familiar with professional grade software. Now I know an iMac would suit me more than fine... but I'll be going on tour and my life will need to be quite mobile. Would a modern Macbook Pro be worth the investment? I know it's not as much for the money but I'm worried I'd never be in a room for long enough to use a desktop.

Do any of you have mobile solutions? I'm trying to learn about how to, say, upgrade RAM in a macbook (or macbook pro.) I can either buy a new battery, upgrade my RAM from 1gb (still researching if this is possible on an older macbook black) to 2gb, or save my money for a new setup entirely (perhaps an iMac if I can stay put, but probably a macbook.) What are some good options?

Thanks guys! And I'm glad your iMac is working out well. Who knows? Maybe I'll upgrade my old macbook black's RAM and buy a decent iMac for home, that might turn out cheaper than an entirely new macbook pro.

EDIT: Forgot to mention. I was messing around and found a relatively cheap PowerMac G5 with 4gb of RAM and a 200gb hard drive for roughly $600. Only problem is (it's old) and it only has a 1.8ghz processor. Will this power Logic sufficiently? Perhaps a bad thought and I should really consider a new iMac if I was going desktop (this also doesn't include a screen, mouse, keyboard, etc...)
 
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Hey Pojoty,

Unfortunately, I'm a total noob so I'm not able to be of much assistance. Hopefully some of the more experienced members will weigh in for you.

...Do any of you have mobile solutions?...
I saw that they're selling carrying bags for 20" & 24" iMacs now. If you're considering an iMac maybe this would help with portability?...

iMac G5 Carrying Cases Upgrades at OtherWorldComputing.com

Good luck and let us know what you decide!

Regards,
- LB
 

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