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  1. #31
    Obama's Train Ride and Inauguration
    cheesybanana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by baggss View Post
    Soon to be "The First Brother".
    I loled.

    I mean, its not really big deal that people think so highly of him. So young black people now have somebody to look up to? Not a bad thing. And it is far from just black Americans that are celebrating. A full 80% of Americans think he is doing a good job so far.

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    I understand pessimism, but it is not just stupid people that believe he will do a good job.
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  2. #32
    Obama's Train Ride and Inauguration
    skye's Avatar
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    I am hopeful, he is no Ron Paul but he really has inspired my generation. Being that we are the ones who run things in a couple of years, I think there is hope.

    If anything I am hopeful because he will be getting rid of Gitmo and allowing stem-cell stuff.

    I think another reason there is so much hope is...well...look at the past 8 years, I read something the other day that said that Bush's approval rating at the end of his 8 years is like 22%. Now you can say that approval rating means nothing when it is 30-40% but, 22% is crazy low. Bush and his cronies messed up a lot of things that Obama has said he will fix, as a result, I am hopeful.
    Blog- My random musings as I document the spiritual changes I go through.

    "And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love." 1st Corinithians 3:13

  3. #33
    Obama's Train Ride and Inauguration
    baggss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skye View Post
    Bush and his cronies messed up a lot of things that Obama has said he will fix, as a result, I am hopeful.

    And yet somehow the guy managed to get elected, twice. These are, for the most part, the same people who put Obama in office. If you think so lowly of Bush you have to question the ability of the voters to choose anything. Why is 22% worse than 40%? To be frank, anything less that 50% should be a sign.

    Will he "fix" the problems or will he discover that the most prudent course of action lies elsewhere? Probably a mix of both. Just because you or I don't like a decision the president has made doesn't mean it's not the right one for the country in the long run. Every President makes their share of mistakes and Obama will made his too.


  4. #34
    Obama's Train Ride and Inauguration
    Kash's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skye View Post
    I am hopeful, he is no Ron Paul but he really has inspired my generation. Being that we are the ones who run things in a couple of years, I think there is hope.
    Yea, I'm really glad he won. I'm definitely considering applying for a government job after I get out of law school, something I would not have considered had McCain won. If I get the job I'll be able to say years from now that I got to work within the Obama administration.

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  5. #35
    Obama's Train Ride and Inauguration
    louishen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by techster82 View Post
    People ought to be judged by their character and credentials, not their color
    You almost paraphrased Martin Luther King there

    "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character".
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  6. #36
    Obama's Train Ride and Inauguration
    skye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by baggss View Post
    And yet somehow the guy managed to get elected, twice. These are, for the most part, the same people who put Obama in office. If you think so lowly of Bush you have to question the ability of the voters to choose anything. Why is 22% worse than 40%? To be frank, anything less that 50% should be a sign.
    I think that Bush got elected but made bad on his promises. This is obvious to me by McCain's distancing from Bush in the election and also the inevitable defeat of the GOP this election.

    22% is worse that 40% because if you figure that half of his popularity is GOP, well 22 is less than half of that! I know I am not really reading these numbers right, but a conclusion I could draw is that if 50% of america was GOP and only 22% like him now, that is less than half of his own party!

    Yeah, the people who put Bush into office and Obama into office were different people. There was a much larger group of 18-25 who voted for Obama and though I am not crediting one age group with putting him into office, it certainly was huge in him getting there, and those are not the same people.

    Look at the states that put Bush into power, many of them when to Obama...
    Blog- My random musings as I document the spiritual changes I go through.

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  7. #37
    Obama's Train Ride and Inauguration
    XJ-linux's Avatar
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    The same people elected them both: the American people. The elected position, POTUS in this case, is only as useful as the level of expectation and accountability we people place on the person in the elected position. If you think your job is over once you leave the ballot booth, you already have lost your elected official. You may as well go back to sleep for another 4 years and vote for change all over again. The President isn't as important as how closely the people hold the President responsible for doing what was promised. Just MHO.
    Never judge a man, untill you have walked a mile in his shoes...
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  8. #38
    Obama's Train Ride and Inauguration
    baggss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skye View Post
    Yeah, the people who put Bush into office and Obama into office were different people. There was a much larger group of 18-25 who voted for Obama and though I am not crediting one age group with putting him into office, it certainly was huge in him getting there, and those are not the same people.
    You missed my point. The people who put both Bush and Obama into office were overwhelmingly the same people. Demographically the 08 election had only a 17% increase in new/young voters (18-25) over the 04 election, so the impact of the "younger" vote was minimal at best. The fact is the same middle of the road group who put Bush in office twice voted for Obama this time. What does this say about the American Voter? The electorate didn't experience a demographically large change in 4 years, but it's mood certainly changed.

    Quote Originally Posted by XJ-linux View Post
    The same people elected them both: the American people. The elected position, POTUS in this case, is only as useful as the level of expectation and accountability we people place on the person in the elected position. If you think your job is over once you leave the ballot booth, you already have lost your elected official. You may as well go back to sleep for another 4 years and vote for change all over again. The President isn't as important as how closely the people hold the President responsible for doing what was promised. Just MHO.
    Excellent post!


  9. #39
    Obama's Train Ride and Inauguration
    Kash's Avatar
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    Bush won by a slim margin in 2000 because there was simply no difference between him and Gore, so people picked the more personable candidate. Then he won in 2004 because a war President is almost never voted out, not to mention Kerry was possibly the worst Democratic candidate of all time.

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  10. #40
    Obama's Train Ride and Inauguration
    eric's Avatar
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    baggss, if out of 100 people, only 10 people like ice cream, and if given the choice, 5 of them like vanilla and 5 like chocolate, then if given the choice between chocolate and strawberry all the chocolate people still like chocolate, but they gain one from the old vanilla camp, making it chocolate 6, strawberry 4, then you could say generically "it's all the same people voting (all 10 of them), but technically you still have a split camp. you may have a few people falling erratically to either side, but you know as well as i that a large number of people who regularly vote fall pretty firmly on one side or the other.
    this makes the 20% vs 40% approval rating pretty significant, since skye's point about starting with about 50% is pretty close to accurate since most liberals will write jr off without even thinking about it.
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  11. #41
    Obama's Train Ride and Inauguration
    XJ-linux's Avatar
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    Huh? I thought Obama was running against McCain? He won by 53% -vs- 46% of the popular vote. Not exactly a huge swing in demographics IHMO. Certainly not as close as Gore even. I'd call it more of a vote of protest against the current administration than a vote for or against any particular candidate. I'm still trying to figure out what specific "change" is suppose to happening anyhow. Another politician has become POTUS and hopefully he will do well. I don't see how anything fundamental has culminated in American society. The same legislators are still in office for the most part, familiar players are in positions of power, and the same think tanks are still relied upon for advice. The book's cover has a different photo and short description, but I don't see a huge change in content i.e: the people who actually DO the DOING.
    Never judge a man, untill you have walked a mile in his shoes...
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  12. #42
    Obama's Train Ride and Inauguration
    baggss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kash View Post
    Bush won by a slim margin in 2000 because there was simply no difference between him and Gore, so people picked the more personable candidate. Then he won in 2004 because a war President is almost never voted out, not to mention Kerry was possibly the worst Democratic candidate of all time.
    No, that honor would go to Mike Dukakis.

    Quote Originally Posted by XJ-linux View Post
    Huh? I thought Obama was running against McCain? He won by 53% -vs- 46% of the popular vote. Not exactly a huge swing in demographics IHMO. Certainly not as close as Gore even. I'd call it more of a vote of protest against the current administration than a vote for or against any particular candidate.
    BINGO! Also not a huge "mandate for change". Nothing like what Nixon or Reagan had.

    Now that the Congress has been seated, the real power for decision making lies with the Senate. The Dems and Obama are going to have to learn to work with the Republicans if they want anything to happen for the next 2 years.

    Quote Originally Posted by eric View Post
    baggss, if out of 100 people, only 10 people like ice cream, and if given the choice, 5 of them like vanilla and 5 like chocolate, then if given the choice between chocolate and strawberry all the chocolate people still like chocolate, but they gain one from the old vanilla camp, making it chocolate 6, strawberry 4, then you could say generically "it's all the same people voting (all 10 of them), but technically you still have a split camp. you may have a few people falling erratically to either side, but you know as well as i that a large number of people who regularly vote fall pretty firmly on one side or the other.
    this makes the 20% vs 40% approval rating pretty significant, since skye's point about starting with about 50% is pretty close to accurate since most liberals will write jr off without even thinking about it.
    That was possibly the most confusing post you've ever written.


  13. #43
    Obama's Train Ride and Inauguration
    Kash's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by baggss View Post
    No, that honor would go to Mike Dukakis.
    Actually, Dukakis managed to win ten states. I'd have to say the honor goes to Mondale, who only won one state and DC.

    Now that the Congress has been seated, the real power for decision making lies with the Senate. The Dems and Obama are going to have to learn to work with the Republicans if they want anything to happen for the next 2 years.
    Democrats have 56 seats. There are two independents who caucus with the Democrats, giving the Democrats 58 votes. Once Coleman gets over himself and Franken is finally seated, that gives the Democrats 59 votes. I'd imagine that it wouldn't be too difficult to get the vote of one Republican on most issues.

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  14. #44
    Obama's Train Ride and Inauguration
    baggss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kash View Post
    Actually, Dukakis managed to win ten states. I'd have to say the honor goes to Mondale, who only won one state and DC.



    Democrats have 56 seats. There are two independents who caucus with the Democrats, giving the Democrats 58 votes. Once Coleman gets over himself and Franken is finally seated, that gives the Democrats 59 votes. I'd imagine that it wouldn't be too difficult to get the vote of one Republican on most issues.
    You might be surprised. The Franken/Coleman spat is likely to last for some time. As for pulling one Republican, it could happen. You are more likely to see Democrats from more conservative states vote against their own leadership though. Some of them can't afford to go off to the left at all lest they find themselves as one term wonders in a few years. Speaking of the Senate, I notice Joe Lieberman didn't lose anything for appearing at the Republican convention. the last thing Harry needs is Joe jumping ship now.


  15. #45
    Obama's Train Ride and Inauguration
    Kash's Avatar
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    Exactly. If the Democrats had managed 59/60 seats, they would have kicked Lieberman to the curb.

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