Looking for experienced opinion on switching to Mac

[xaelophorus]

Hello all,

I've always been more or less a MS fanboy, but lately I've been looking into Macs and I think it may be time to switch---but first I'd like to hear the opinions of those who know the Mac world.

I have to buy a portable computer for my education. Should it be a Vista laptop or a MacBook/MacBook Pro?

I start next month at the University of Florida in the civil engineering program. During my course of study I will have to use programs such as AutoCad which only run in Windows. I have a spare copy of Windows XP from when I upgraded my current PC to Vista. (Assuming that I can reuse the now-unused copy of XP.) Theoretically, this means I could install Windows on the MacBook and have "the best of both worlds."

I've been tinkering with the new Windows version of Safari, and I love it. In fact, I generally like the way Apple develops its products. I prefer Mac's approach to computers, too.

This brings me to my two main questions:

1) Does anyone know if the XP CDs marked "For Distribution Only With A New PC" can actually install Windows? (I intend to use that CD to install Windows on the MacBook, as I am no longer using XP on my PC.)

2) Does a normal MacBook (not Pro) run XP well, or is it sluggish? I also play games such as World of Warcraft and Lord of the Rings Online on my PC---does anyone know how well these specific titles work on a MacBook? Or should I really splurge and get a MacBook Pro?

Also, are there any drawbacks to using Boot Camp to run Windows? (Other than having to reboot the computer to switch OS.) In other words, would having a MacBook with Boot Camp and Windows installed be just as capable as a normal Windows-based laptop? If so, what would be a reason not to get a MacBook?

I apologize for such a long post, but I value hearing the views of others. Many thanks in advance for your answers!

 

[remain]

1) Not sure about the "For Distribution Only With A New PC" part but a Windows XP Service Pack 2 CD is required.

 

[D3v1L80Y]

Use the right tool for the job:

I have to buy a portable computer for my education. Should it be a Vista laptop or a MacBook/MacBook Pro?

That would depend on your school's hardware/software requirements. You need to first call and check with them before you buy anything.

I start next month at the University of Florida in the civil engineering program. During my course of study I will have to use programs such as AutoCad which only run in Windows. I have a spare copy of Windows XP from when I upgraded my current PC to Vista. (Assuming that I can reuse the now-unused copy of XP.) Theoretically, this means I could install Windows on the MacBook and have "the best of both worlds."

Theoretically, yes... but it would be far from the 'best'. Sure Windows runs fine with BootCamp, but if you need Windows primarily, then just get a Windows computer.
Look at it this way:
Sure, you could use a smaller slot-head screwdriver on a phillips-head screw... but you would be much better off just using the phillips-head screwdriver since that is what the job calls for.
In short, use the best tool for the job at all times. In this case, it is a Windows machine, not a Mac running Windows.

If so, what would be a reason not to get a MacBook?

Again, the simple fact remains: Your primary need for school requires you to run Windows. Don't get a Mac because in this case, it isn't the right tool for your job.

 

[shahvikram123]

yep XP with bootcamp runs fine on the macbook.

The question should which OS would you use more? If your going to use XP more than like 50% of the time then theres no point getting a macbook then you would be better of buying a cheaper dell laptop.

 

[Levi]

Well, if you really like the Mac hardware and you'd like to play around with OS X then there's no reason why you can't buy a Macbook and use it to run Windows half the time... but you'll probably be paying for more than you need.

As for running games on MacBook... not really advisable because of the integrated graphics. You'll have to look up the minimum specs for the game you want and match it with the computer you're looking at, and it might run fine... but it's not really a gaming machine. The MacBook Pro on the other hand should handle the latest games with ease.

 

[mongoloido]

Give a call to UF's bookstore, and have them connect you to someone who sells the hardware and software. Ask the person if they have Student Media Editions of XP/Vista. University of Cincinnati has them, and it makes XP/Vista practically free ($5 for XP, and $10 for Vista). The catch, I believe, is you must be a student at the participating school, and you can only purchase one copy of the OS every couple years... Software can be obscenely cheap for college students.

 

[opus_az]

"For Distribution Only With A New PC" is OEM software (original equipment manufacturer). OEM software is every bit as complete as a retail version and will install exactly the same. OEM is priced cheaper because it is tied to hardware. Either a reseller will use OEM on their computers, or if you're building your own computer you can purchase OEM licenses. It's a bit fuzzy exactly what hardware justifies OEM but certainly a new hard drive is enough and a new Mac laptop is enough too. OEM software can not be transferred to a different computer.

If your Vista was an upgrade version then your XP license is not freed up to be used on another computer.

I don't know anything about education discounts. They sound pretty impressive though. $10 for Vista? I'm enrolling!

As mentioned elsewhere, there's no performance hit in software when using boot camp.

A few months ago I got an OEM Vista that was on 4 disks. Boot camp couldn't install a multiple disk OS. Things may be different now. Either boot camp can do multiple disk installs or Vista OEM should be on one disk.

 

[wytwolf]

"For Distribution Only With A New PC" means it's OEM. It was alot cheaper then the retail version and I would say came with your computer when you bought it. The OEM's are usually only sold to computer makers or businesses that sell computers.

The oem could cause a problem. Microsoft has records of that software is linked to what hardware. That's why if you significantly upgrade your current computer (ie more then 4-5 components) you sometimes have to phone microsoft the next time you run windows genuine advantage. You then have to explain you upgraded your computer(only works on desktop towers for obvious reasons). I don't think they will believe you upgraded you components in you desktop to turn it into a macbook/macbook pro. But if you can get xp/vista media editions for $5-$10 from your university like mongoloido said then getting another copy of windows is no problem.

 

[Ninjab3ar]

I start next month at the University of Florida in the civil engineering program. During my course of study I will have to use programs such as AutoCad which only run in Windows. I have a spare copy of Windows XP from when I upgraded my current PC to Vista. (Assuming that I can reuse the now-unused copy of XP.) Theoretically, this means I could install Windows on the MacBook and have "the best of both worlds."

Hi xaelphorus, Im currently studying architecture at Floria International University and i use programs like AutoCAD 2007 Sketchup, Rhino, 3d Studio Max, and Adobe creative suite 3 on my MacBook Pro with XP on Boot Camp.

All the programs run well on XP and dont give me problems. However, although AutoCAD will run fine on the MacBook, I recommend that you get a MacBook pro. The better video card and larger screen would come in handy, especially when playing games.

If the MacBook Pro is out of your budget, GET A PC LAPTOP. The MacBook will dissapoint you for its price.

But if you can get xp/vista media editions for $5-$10 from your university like mongoloido said then getting another copy of windows is no problem.

Media Center Editions do NOT work with bootcamp.

 

[professorjay]

I'll second what everyone said about running in Boot Camp. That will for work fine for all your school needs. It's up to you to decide if it's worth the money for Apple hardware and using OS X for your casual computer use. The Macbook may be lacking for your gaming requirements though.

And coming from a Gator alumn: GOOOO GATOOOOOOORS!!!

 

[jcrm21]

I'm a Gator Grad (2005) from the Civil Engineering program and given the information I have been reading lately with Boot Camp I will be making a switch to Mac as well. My firm is currently running AutoCAD Civil 3D 2008, Land Desktop 2008, Map 2008, etc. and I am looking forward to see the performance of Civil 3D through a Mac (Macbook Pro). Good luck at UF, you will love it, and if you have any questions feel free to contact me.

 

[Ninjab3ar]

and I am looking forward to see the performance of Civil 3D through a Mac (Macbook Pro). you have any questions feel free to contact me.

If youre doing it on XP or Vista, the performance of Civil 3D will be just like on an equally specced PC. Theres nothing "special" in a Mac that really makes it any different.

What makes the Mac experience so great is OS X. While youre not using those programs you need for work, youll notice how much better of an operating system OS X is in comparison to windows.

You wont regret it!

 

[Alexis]

"For Distribution Only With A New PC" means it's OEM. It was alot cheaper then the retail version and I would say came with your computer when you bought it. The OEM's are usually only sold to computer makers or businesses that sell computers.

The oem could cause a problem. Microsoft has records of that software is linked to what hardware. That's why if you significantly upgrade your current computer (ie more then 4-5 components) you sometimes have to phone microsoft the next time you run windows genuine advantage.

Try ringing Microsoft if your Mac complains, but don't worry - there is an easy way to bypass the hilariously smugly named 'Genuine Advantage'.

 

[Village Idiot]

Try ringing Microsoft if your Mac complains, but don't worry - there is an easy way to bypass the hilariously smugly named 'Genuine Advantage'.

How's that?

OP - If you're going to be doing anything that involves CAD work, I would reccomend skipping the MB and going with atleast the 15"MBP and investing in a seperate monitor ((Doesn't have to be apple if you want to save some cash...you can find 22" widescreens for under $300 now)).

the Macbook only comes with integrated graphics, where as the MBP now comes with the Nvidia m 8600 gt...Go for the 2.4 ghz processor version as it also has the 256mb version of that gpu. More 3d power never hurts when CADing...so to say...

The 17" would be even better as it has the larger screen size and 1920x1200 resolution, but then you're getting out of the world of portable..

You can bootcamp into XP and run whatever cad programs you need.

But if you're not planning on utilizing OS X, do as DB says and save youre money on a windows notebook.

 

[xaelophorus]

Wow, thanks for all of the great responses!

I've basically decided that if I go the Mac route, I will get a MBP. It's really not much more than the Windows-based machines I've priced, anyway.

But if you're not planning on utilizing OS X, do as DB says and save youre money on a windows notebook.

I am actually unsure about OS X, as I've never really used it a lot. I need to go to an Apple store and see if I can test drive a MBP. (The only issue is that the nearest Apple store is an hour and a half from here!) The main things I do on a computer daily are checking email, surfing the web, and chatting on IM programs. If OS X is as efficient or more so than Windows in these areas, then I would use OS X whenever possible, since I like its appearance and layout much more. Obviously, I've never used Mac a lot so I don't know how versatile it is for everyday computing.

As I've mentioned, I will dual-boot the machine. I already have Office 2007 for Windows with 2 unused licenses, so running XP through Boot Camp should allow me to handle any school assignments requiring Office.

That being said, is there any real reason any of you prefer OS X over Windows for general usage?

Thanks again!

 

[D3v1L80Y]

Wow, thanks for all of the great responses!

I've basically decided that if I go the Mac route, I will get a MBP. It's really not much more than the Windows-based machines I've priced, anyway.

I am actually unsure about OS X, as I've never really used it a lot. I need to go to an Apple store and see if I can test drive a MBP. (The only issue is that the nearest Apple store is an hour and a half from here!) The main things I do on a computer daily are checking email, surfing the web, and chatting on IM programs. If OS X is as efficient or more so than Windows in these areas, then I would use OS X whenever possible, since I like its appearance and layout much more. Obviously, I've never used Mac a lot so I don't know how versatile it is for everyday computing.

As I've mentioned, I will dual-boot the machine. I already have Office 2007 for Windows with 2 unused licenses, so running XP through Boot Camp should allow me to handle any school assignments requiring Office.

That being said, is there any real reason any of you prefer OS X over Windows for general usage?

Thanks again!

For your basic uses, it wouldn't make much of a difference what platform you use. It comes down to one's preference.

On the notion of buying an Apple computer to run Windows 50% of the time or more... well, based on my vast (two decades) experience using Macs, that is a waste in my opinion.
While the topic is debatable, pure looks alone do not make a Mac what it is.
Hardware specs are not what makes a Mac what it is.
Hardware-wise, it is no different from any other machine on the market.

What makes a Mac a Mac is the operating system. So, to spend the money on a Mac to only run Windows the majority of the time is a waste of the computer.
The Mac OS should not be a viewed as an afterthought or used as a secondary OS. The Mac OS should be the main reason and drive for buying a Mac.

 

[walkerj]

That being said, is there any real reason any of you prefer OS X over Windows for general usage?

Thanks again!

It's nicer to look at than Windows all day. I know, because I have to stare at Windows all day, but when I want a little break I swing over to my Macbook.

Underlying OS is UNIX, and I reeeeeaaaaaaally know UNIX very well, and can do some incredible things on the command line with shell scripts. I can kick the GUI out of the way when it's appropriate, while with Windows I can only halfwit with cygwin.

Exposé. Not enough can be said about Exposé. I constantly finding myself on my Dell wishing I could fling all the windows out and select a different app, but of course it can't.

It's these little things. Stick in a USB drive, and it mounts it. It doesn't get all chatty about new hardware. Airport doesn't throw up a balloon telling me that I'm connected to my wireless network. The one I connect to every day. THE ONLY ONE IN RANGE. I GOT IT already MS! There's more, but they all add up.

Oh, it's not all sunshine and lollypops, and there are a couple of annoying bugs that I wish Apple would fix, and it doesn't always play nice with my Palm PDA, but since getting a portable computer, my reliance on my PDA has been greatly reduced. I wish iChat would video conference with people equipped on regular old AIM or whatever chat program everyone else uses. I recently had to buy my parents a webcam to hook up to the old Mac Mini I gave them (it works, I can video chat with them instead of calling now.) Epson seems bent on refusing to release a Universal binary version of their CD printing program, but that's more Epson's thing. Apple's made their deal with the devil (media companies) and dis-allow certain things, like making screen caps of playing DVD's, but that has been gotten around. I just wish they told the media companies to frak off, but what can you do. Also sometimes Safari doesn't like to quit occasionally making me force quit it. Finder can be a little retarded when it comes to network drives that aren't there anymore, or external drives that think they've ejected themselves. It also sometimes is pretty random and mysterious as to how it's going to arrange icons when looking for things, and the 'clean up' is a little erratic about what it considers a window 'cleaned up'.

That may sound like a lot, but those other little things I mentioned earlier overwhelmingly make up for all those negatives I mentioned in the previous paragraph. I'm just stating them here so you can go in with open eyes, as experienced by someone who used Windows/Linux for years before getting a Mac, and still does use Windows/Linux to put food on the table. It took Apple quite a while, a lot of risks, and timing to bring together all of the things that would attract someone like me to their products. But bring me to their products they did. I will never switch back to Windows for my own personal computer, and neither will my wife or my brother-in-law who bought a Macbook the day after we showed him what ours can do. Even bought an Apple TV a couple of weeks ago.

 

[Phoenix Scanner]

As a mechanical engineer who uses ACAD quite a bit, I can tell you that you need the MBP to do anything serious on cad. The MB doesn't have the video card for the job. I have done some testing and with really intense drawings it just doesn't cut it. Sorry apple. For the same money as an MBP you could also probably have a windows laptop for cad and a MB for the rest of your life away from work/school, and that way you wouldn't have to corrupt a mac with evil microsoft products (he he). Seriously though, two computers probably isn't practical, so I guess the MBP is the way to go.

I still believe apples aren't the strongest choices for cad or gaming, but can do both set up correctly. OSX to me, is about having a hassle free computer experience. No BS. It just works. I don't have time to deal with lockups, errors, viruses, spyware, and all of that nonsense. I use a windows machine all day, and it locks up on average a few times a day, whether it be printing, running an app, or just trying to open a website. Sometimes you have to restart the machine (takes several minutes), because you can't shut down an app. I really love macs because even when things go wrong and something hangs, you can force quit. Even if you did have to restart, my MB takes around 20 seconds to do so. Love it to death.

 

[ki99]

and if you really like os x, the odd time if you download neooffice (freeware) you can work on ms office docs on your mac.

and on a side note** world of warcraft is also for mac so you can use windows even less!

 

[Ninjab3ar]

I use a windows machine all day, and it locks up on average a few times a day, whether it be printing, running an app, or just trying to open a website. Sometimes you have to restart the machine (takes several minutes), because you can't shut down an app. I really love macs because even when things go wrong and something hangs, you can force quit. Even if you did have to restart, my MB takes around 20 seconds to do so. Love it to death.

If you go to the task manager and right click on the program that locked up, then select 'go to process', and quit the process, it will work exactly like in OS X. The program will simply quit.