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Switcher Hangout The place for switchers to discuss their new machines, and how to work with OS X. General support can be had here for newbie stuff, like "How do I restart my new iMac?" :)

WIN 7 & MS Office 2010 on a MAC


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BSB2007

 
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Is it feasible to run Win 7 & Office 20100 on a Mac and what are the major issues?
Is it even worthwhile as I have only used windows PCs?
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Sawday

 
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IMHO Office for Mac is a far better product than the Windows version. Unless you have a compelling need to run other software than runs only under Windows, I'd heartily recommend that you make the switch to Mac and leave Windows behind. You won't regret it.

Happiness is not getting what you want, but wanting what you get.
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chas_m

 
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Sure you can do it. There aren't any "major" issues, apart from you choosing whether you want to run:

a) Windows and Win software on an entirely separate partition (reboot to switch OSes) using a tool from Apple called Boot Camp (free);

b) Run in a virtualization environment (such as Virtual Box, Parallels, VMWare Fusion) that allows Windows and OS X to run simultaneously ... the former runs as an "app" in the latter ... or

c) Use a program like CrossOver to run MS Office 2010 without Windows at all (using WINE, basically).

The first requires a fresh, authorized copy of Win 7 (OEM or retail, must not have been used before). The second offers the option of using any version of Windows (or Linux or whatever) you want. The third requires only that MS Office 2010 be supported (and a paid copy of CrossOver).

But if you're going to a Mac, why not just get the Mac version of Office and dispense with the viruses, security issues and general hassle?
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BSB2007

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sawday View Post
IMHO Office for Mac is a far better product than the Windows version. Unless you have a compelling need to run other software than runs only under Windows, I'd heartily recommend that you make the switch to Mac and leave Windows behind. You won't regret it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chas_m View Post
Sure you can do it. There aren't any "major" issues, apart from you choosing whether you want to run:

a) Windows and Win software on an entirely separate partition (reboot to switch OSes) using a tool from Apple called Boot Camp (free);

b) Run in a virtualization environment (such as Virtual Box, Parallels, VMWare Fusion) that allows Windows and OS X to run simultaneously ... the former runs as an "app" in the latter ... or

c) Use a program like CrossOver to run MS Office 2010 without Windows at all (using WINE, basically).

The first requires a fresh, authorized copy of Win 7 (OEM or retail, must not have been used before). The second offers the option of using any version of Windows (or Linux or whatever) you want. The third requires only that MS Office 2010 be supported (and a paid copy of CrossOver).

But if you're going to a Mac, why not just get the Mac version of Office and dispense with the viruses, security issues and general hassle?
Many thanks to chas_m & Sawday,
you have both given me a lot to think about. I use a lot of applications that are Windows only but I am sure I can manage without most. I do use several text editors, not programming text editors, but written English text, some apparently were written originally for the Mac.
can you comment on the difference between MS Office 2010 for Windows and for the Mac? Are there screen shots available? And, perhaps I should have asked this first - is there an included word processor with the Mac and how do you rate it?

grateful newbie BSB2007
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BSB2007

 
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One more thing what about disk defragging etc?
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chas_m

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BSB2007 View Post
Many thanks to chas_m & Sawday,
you have both given me a lot to think about. I use a lot of applications that are Windows only but I am sure I can manage without most. I do use several text editors, not programming text editors, but written English text, some apparently were written originally for the Mac.
Oh you're going to love it on the Mac.

Quote:
can you comment on the difference between MS Office 2010 for Windows and for the Mac?
The Mac version is known as Office 2011 since it came out a year later.

I guess the best analogy would be that it's like buying a new and different make of car -- all the same things are there, but you're not quite sure and comfortable with where it all is yet. Things will look a little different, but most of the commands are the same* and the stuff is all there.

*On the Mac, we use "command" and a keystroke where you would use "alt" and a keystroke.

Quote:
Is there an included word processor with the Mac and how do you rate it?
Yes, a basic one is provided, it has a few bells but is meant to be basic. It's called TextEdit and I find it more powerful than Notepad on the PC but a far cry from let's say MS Word.

There's also Notes (now included) but again, more like Notepad. There are dozens of alternative options, some free some paid. I like SimpleNote (third-party, free) and Notes (built in) because they both automatically sync with my iOS devices (iPhone, iPad). For more serious word processing I like Pages ($20, available from Apple), Bean (free but no longer supported sadly) and Celtx (scriptwriting software, free) among others.

Quote:
One more thing what about disk defragging etc?
Not needed. Macs require FAR less management and maintenance than Windows PCs, but that's not to say they require none. But leave your anti-viruses, your registry cleaners and disk defraggers behind ... you're about to step into a beautiful new world where you get to focus on your own work rather than being a computer admin.
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BSB2007

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chas_m View Post
Oh you're going to love it on the Mac.



The Mac version is known as Office 2011 since it came out a year later.

I guess the best analogy would be that it's like buying a new and different make of car -- all the same things are there, but you're not quite sure and comfortable with where it all is yet. Things will look a little different, but most of the commands are the same* and the stuff is all there.

*On the Mac, we use "command" and a keystroke where you would use "alt" and a keystroke.

Yes, a basic one is provided, it has a few bells but is meant to be basic. It's called TextEdit and I find it more powerful than Notepad on the PC but a far cry from let's say MS Word.

There's also Notes (now included) but again, more like Notepad. There are dozens of alternative options, some free some paid. I like SimpleNote (third-party, free) and Notes (built in) because they both automatically sync with my iOS devices (iPhone, iPad). For more serious word processing I like Pages ($20, available from Apple), Bean (free but no longer supported sadly) and Celtx (scriptwriting software, free) among others.



Not needed. Macs require FAR less management and maintenance than Windows PCs, but that's not to say they require none. But leave your anti-viruses, your registry cleaners and disk defraggers behind ... you're about to step into a beautiful new world where you get to focus on your own work rather than being a computer admin.
Hello again, chas_m,
Just returned from a vigorous walk along the beach, whilst also mulling over this issue, and your advice. I wonder if the forthcoming new Mac will have an incorporated DVD/ BluRay drive, that is one score over the Mac by the Dell XPS 27, which I have also been mulling over but Dell have none in stock.
I need to talk to a good Apple salesman,so that means a visit to the local Mac dealer, sadly that is PCWorld. Are you a Mac salesman by any chance? You show real enthusiasm for the Mac, and have almost sold it to me.
best wishes
BSB2007
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As far as the Optical drive is concerned, it depends on which Mac you choose. Currently, desktop Macs (iMac) do not have an optical drive. Also various models of Apple notebook computers do not have an optical drive. However, external optical drives are inexpensive and work well. That includes those which are Blue Ray capable.
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BSB2007

 
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Hi chscag,
This forum is delivering more than I expected, help is coming from all angles.
I suppose I did not give sufficient information when I posted my queries in but not short of help.
My immediate recent interest in the Mac was stimulated by my equal interest in the Dell XPS 27. I have a Dell 1730 Inspiron laptop so do not want or need another laptop. Reading comparisons of Dell XPS 27 & iMac 27, it was clear I should also look at the 27inch Mac. I have been growing nearer to an all in one after some years of building my own boxed Windows machines. Let me add I am no expert but I did enjoy the several versions along the way from W95, 98, 2000, XP and now Win 7. I am not at all sure about Win 8, nor do I think touch-screens will be more than mildly useful. But, I like the idea of a large screen - I'm 75 I have a Dell Ultrasharp U2312HM so the bigger the better, the all in one kits will help in keeping my desk clutter free, for my paperwork - who was that said that computers will lead to the paperless office.?

Many thanks chscag,
BSB2007
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chas_m

 
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While most people think Apple took out the optical drives from its iMac and Mac mini because THIN, I actually think it was the most common point of failure on those machines, and that removing it in favor of cheaper external drives was a smart move that increased reliability and improved margins. While my present MacBook Pro has a functioning optical drive, I realised some years ago that I never burned discs anywhere but at home, and so I bought an external unit on the premise that if it failed, it would be easily replaced. Just my luck, it never failed.

As for Blu-Ray, Steve Jobs correctly called the rights management "a bag of hurt" -- for a long time it was quite difficult to get Blu-ray drives that could both display AND BURN Blu-ray movies, though as a storage device it was pretty handy (if expensive). Today things aren't actually much better thanks to idiotic DRM, but that's probably not what kept the drives off Macs as much as Apple sees (correctly, in my view) a future more about greater bandwidth and downloading than about discs and storage.

Bottom line: you can get a cheap external Blu-ray drive if you need it, and it will work fine. I've found that I actually burn very few DVDs anymore personally.

As for the monitor part of the comparison, I think the Mac's screen is better color-balanced and higher-quality than the XPS 27, but that's not to say the Dell machine is junk or anything. I'm used to the way Mac screens "look" and that my be influencing my view. On the whole, I find all-in-ones to be way more reliable than elitists give them credit for.
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Many thanks to you all, chas_m, Sawday and chscag. I have a family funeral ahead of me and will be out of contact for several days.
I have been impressed and encouraged by the support and advice from this website and will now think about what kit I will need,its layout and its cost. But first other matters have to be attended to.

Best wishes
to you all.
from BSB2007
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If you are very used to Word..... get Word! If you want to use Pages, there will be a considerate amount of re-learning to do. I have both, and although I obtained Word first, Pages is not too expensive not to give it a try. So I got that as well.

For instance, I rely heavily on styles to format an number my documents. And I prefer to have my applications maximized (NOT: full screen). So when in Pages for the first time, I chose 'Show Styles Drawer' to begin setting up my paragraph styles, but nothing came up. Took me ages, and I finally found that the drawer is located OUTSIDE the Pages window itself.... not visible when that window is maximised to fill the display.

And heading numbering is achieved differently from Word. Tables of Contents...... could'n figure out how to do that, until I search the Internetz and found a Pages TOC only looks FORWARD. Meaning, put your TOC on page one, not on the last page, for then it will be empty!

There are may Pages-specific quirks that you need to learn and get used to. People that started to use Pages before Word will have learned these from the beginning, but re-learning/switching is not easy and might take more time then you would like.

However, if you have more then one Mac, then a single Pages license, cheap as it is already, can be installed on all of your systems without additional cost. Compare that to Word, which is not only five times more expensive, but requires a license for each and every computer you want to have it installed on...
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Many thanks Thymen,
I have used Word for several years having tried Open Office and also Scribus. I will look for internet pages on Pages to see whay it looks like.
I visited the Apple Shop in town yesterday, a more disinterested salesman I have yet to find. After asking several questions about the larger iMacs he raised his head once but remianed seated and uninterested. I will not return there that leaves me with only PCWorld.
Best wishes

BSB2007
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Compare that to Word, which is not only five times more expensive, but requires a license for each and every computer you want to have it installed on...
Perhaps where you are the above might be true, but here in the States.....

Note that when Pages is purchased from the Mac App store it can be installed on as many Macs as you personally own. If you purchased the iWork package that includes Pages, the license restriction is one install.

And Word while certainly more expensive than Pages (since Word also includes Powerpoint and Excel as part of MS Office) it is not 5 times as expensive. You can purchase a single install of Mac Office 2011 for as little as $90.00. And there is also the 3 install licensed package for $110.00. (Home and Student version.)
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Indeed in the States it might be quite cheaper...

Here, in the Netherlands, a single license of Word for Mac, version 2011 costs €139 (via Microsoft store), while Pages costs €17.99 (via App Store).

The Home- and Student edition, including Excel and PowerPoint, costs €139, the version for Home and Self-employed is €269; a full version of Office costs €539. All single licences.

At a current conversion rate of €1.00 = US$1.35....you do the math.....

All Dutch prices are including 21% VAT.
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