New To Mac-Forums?

Welcome to our community! Join the discussion today by registering your FREE account. If you have any problems with the registration process, please contact us!

Get your questions answered by community gurus • Advice and insight from world-class Apple enthusiasts • Exclusive access to members-only contests, giveaways and deals

Join today!

 
Start a Discussion
 

Mac-Forums Brief

Subscribe to Mac-Forums Brief to receive special offers from Mac-Forums partners and sponsors

Join the conversation RSS
Schweb's Lounge Forum for general conversation, chit chat, or most topics that don't fit in another forum.

Ballmer (and Microsoft) still doesn't get the iPad


Post Reply New Thread Subscribe

 
Thread Tools
louishen

 
louishen's Avatar
 
Member Since: Oct 22, 2007
Location: London
Posts: 8,948
louishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant future
Mac Specs: Mac Mini Core i7 2012 | White 2009 MacBook 2 Ghz | 733 Mhz G4 Quicksilver

louishen is offline
I really think its time for Balmer to step aside now. Please, please get a tech guy to head Microsoft and bang the divisional heads together before MS misses both the smartphone and tablet markets.

The most shocking bit of the story is this quote.

Quote:
Though OneNote was compelling on tablets, the remainder of the suite was not. Insiders suggest that this was deliberate; although the Windows group wanted the Office group to produce a tablet-suitable suite, the Office group saw no point, and was unwilling to go out of its way to help out the Windows group.
What is MS's new mission statement? Is it "Lets engineer failure by crapping on each others ideas"

Ballmer (and Microsoft) still doesn't get the iPad

Member of the Month September 2008 & August 2012 | Found advice useful? – use the rep system
QUOTE Thanks
1991-C4

 
1991-C4's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jun 17, 2010
Location: Missouri
Posts: 343
1991-C4 has a spectacular aura about
Mac Specs: 2 iPod Touches and iPad

1991-C4 is offline
And just who does "get it"? Jeff Bezos. I would have to say that Amazon could produce their own tablet in 6 months to a year after JB sends the memo. Amazon already makes the best selling single-purpose consumption device (well they sell it, they don't make it) and they already have a distribution system well in place with amazon.com. Marketing a "multi-purpose" tablet device is only a matter of finding someone to make the hardware and that doesn't seem like it would be too much trouble for JB.

I know it probably would never happen, but with the fact that Apple just removed the "adult" titles off of the top selling iBooks list, I suppose it is hypothetically theoretically possible that Apple could mandate that all app suppliers adhere to a certain "moral standard" at which point I am sure Jeff Bezos would wave his middle finger in the direction of One Infinite Loop and send the aforementioned memo.

I can't imagine that happening because Steve Jobs is, first and foremost, a businessman and his first allegiance is to the shareholders of AAPL. One of the reasons for the outstanding success of the iPad has to be attributed to it's ability to serve as an eReading device so it is Steve Jobs that owes Jeff Bezos a thanks. Of course there are far more people reading Kindle-formatted books than there are actual Kindle devices thanks to Apple, so this business relationship between Apple and Amazon is definitely a two-way street.

I am sure Steve and Jeff have a very healthy respect for each other, but I am sure they are also have a healthy respect for the fact that they are very much in competition with each other.
QUOTE Thanks
baggss

 
baggss's Avatar
 
Member Since: Oct 10, 2004
Location: Margaritaville
Posts: 10,309
baggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond repute
Mac Specs: 27" 3.4 Ghz i7 iMac-13" C2D Macbook-OSX 18.8.2-64Gb iPad 2-32 Gb iPhone 5-ATV 2-14Tb of Storage

baggss is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1991-CA
Steve Jobs is, first and foremost, a businessman and his first allegiance is to the shareholders of AAPL.
Steve Jobs first allegiance is to Steve Jobs. If he listened to shareholders they'd have gone under by now. Read some Apple History.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1991-CA
I am sure Steve and Jeff have a very healthy respect for each other, but I am sure they are also have a healthy respect for the fact that they are very much in competition with each other.
I don't agree with that, at least not yet. Bezzos could do it but it would mean entering a whole new market segment for Amazon and they would be up against the likes of Apple and MS. I'm not saying it wouldn't work, I'm saying it would not be the best road for Amazon go down. Right now there really is no competition between the iPad and the Kindle. If there was, Amazon wouldn't have made a Kindle App for Apples products. Amazon is trying to do what it does best, sell books, not mass market a self branded tech toy.


QUOTE Thanks
1991-C4

 
1991-C4's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jun 17, 2010
Location: Missouri
Posts: 343
1991-C4 has a spectacular aura about
Mac Specs: 2 iPod Touches and iPad

1991-C4 is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by baggss View Post
Steve Jobs first allegiance is to Steve Jobs. If he listened to shareholders they'd have gone under by now. Read some Apple History.
As much as you don't want to believe it, Steve Jobs works FOR the board of directors, not the other way around. Apple is a publicly traded company and his first duty is to run the company at a profit so the shareholders can be paid dividends. If he fails to do that, he can be fired.
QUOTE Thanks
louishen

 
louishen's Avatar
 
Member Since: Oct 22, 2007
Location: London
Posts: 8,948
louishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant future
Mac Specs: Mac Mini Core i7 2012 | White 2009 MacBook 2 Ghz | 733 Mhz G4 Quicksilver

louishen is offline
I think what baggss is saying is that Apple's focus is different. See an interview with Jobs and he concentrates on Apple's great software and hardware. His attitude is, we make great products and the customers will come, the money will come with them and we will make a profit. His focus is definitely not we must make more money by any means just to keep the shareholders happy.

Member of the Month September 2008 & August 2012 | Found advice useful? – use the rep system
QUOTE Thanks
1991-C4

 
1991-C4's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jun 17, 2010
Location: Missouri
Posts: 343
1991-C4 has a spectacular aura about
Mac Specs: 2 iPod Touches and iPad

1991-C4 is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by louishen View Post
I think what baggss is saying is that Apple's focus is different.
Apple's focus is EXACTLY the same as every other corporation... to make money. People invest in the stock market for one reason... to make money! Its economics 101. The employees at Apple have to be paid and Apple has to pay them benefits as well and they can only do this if the company makes a profit. Steve Jobs retains his position because he makes money for the shareholders. From a PR standpoint, he is smart enough to say that his job is to create cool stuff that people want to buy, but the bottom line (and I mean that very literally) is that if his innovative, bleeding edge ideas fail to make money, he is out of a job.
QUOTE Thanks
iggibar

 
iggibar's Avatar
 
Member Since: Apr 20, 2009
Location: C-Town
Posts: 4,067
iggibar is a splendid one to beholdiggibar is a splendid one to beholdiggibar is a splendid one to beholdiggibar is a splendid one to beholdiggibar is a splendid one to beholdiggibar is a splendid one to beholdiggibar is a splendid one to beholdiggibar is a splendid one to behold
Mac Specs: Mac Pro 4.1 15" MBP. 13" MBP. 17" PB. Power Mac G5. Galaxy Note 4 160gb*

iggibar is offline
"to make money," is too general of a term to use when describing "every other corporation!" There are different means to the same success! Selling lots of stupid things to make some money vs. selling a couple of GREAT things to make the same amount of money. The "couple of GREAT things" are geared to apeal to the buyer, unlike the "lots of stupid things" which are sold because people don't care about it's small cost, and general short life span. This model can be used on almost anything of monetary value. That's the simplest way to describe it!

“If you are distressed by anything external, the pain is not due to the thing itself but to your own estimate of it; and this you have the power to revoke at any moment.” Marcus Aurelius
QUOTE Thanks
Slydude

 
Slydude's Avatar
 
Member Since: Nov 16, 2009
Location: North Louisiana, USA
Posts: 6,738
Slydude has a brilliant futureSlydude has a brilliant futureSlydude has a brilliant futureSlydude has a brilliant futureSlydude has a brilliant futureSlydude has a brilliant futureSlydude has a brilliant futureSlydude has a brilliant futureSlydude has a brilliant futureSlydude has a brilliant futureSlydude has a brilliant future
Mac Specs: 2.8 GHz MacBook Pro 10.8,3 8 GB mem, 2.66 GHz Mac Pro - Dead, iPhone 4

Slydude is online now
That's right on the money and has been used several times to describe the difference between Apple and some of the other tech companies which are long since gone. You can do as some of the bargain basement PC guys and build machines that are cheaper than Macs. You will sell a ton of them until customers find out how quickly they become useless. Until then, the problem is that there is little profit on each machine so when sales slip you are in trouble. There is also little brand loyalty here. The machine is basically a commodity and the customer may well go elsewhere next time.

Apple has chosen a different tack. Build a better mousetrap and the world will not only beat a path to your door they will eagerly await the next bigger better mousetrap. Generally Apple's profit per machine is higher than those of most of their competitors. That, coupled with brand loyalty is good for the stockholders. Anyone check Apple's stock price lately? I don't think shareholders are complaining.

Sylvester Roque Former Contributing Editor About This Particular Macintosh

"Got Time to breathe. You got time for music." Denver Pyle as Briscoe Darling
QUOTE Thanks
1991-C4

 
1991-C4's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jun 17, 2010
Location: Missouri
Posts: 343
1991-C4 has a spectacular aura about
Mac Specs: 2 iPod Touches and iPad

1991-C4 is offline
But that is precisely my point. Steve Jobs has a particular talent for being a "visionary" and coming up with ideas that will make lots of money for himself as well as the shareholders. With all due respect, you guys are looking at Apple through the eyes of a consumer and there is nothing wrong with that at all, but at the end of the day, Apple is just another corporation that just so happens to have someone who is particularly adept at marketing to lead the company.
QUOTE Thanks
1991-C4

 
1991-C4's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jun 17, 2010
Location: Missouri
Posts: 343
1991-C4 has a spectacular aura about
Mac Specs: 2 iPod Touches and iPad

1991-C4 is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by baggss View Post
I don't agree with that, at least not yet. Bezzos could do it but it would mean entering a whole new market segment for Amazon and they would be up against the likes of Apple and MS. I'm not saying it wouldn't work, I'm saying it would not be the best road for Amazon go down. Right now there really is no competition between the iPad and the Kindle. If there was, Amazon wouldn't have made a Kindle App for Apples products. Amazon is trying to do what it does best, sell books, not mass market a self branded tech toy.
And as far as Amazon goes, do you even know who they are or what they do? Amazon started out by selling printed books over the Internet, but now they sell pretty much anything you can think of. Why? Jeff Bezos is smart! He figured out how to sell stuff, tangible things and content like books and music. They are arguably the most successful dot com in history.

Why would Amazon make a Kindle app for an Apple product? In order to sell more Amazon content to people without having to buy Amazon hardware.

And speaking of that, you say that Amazon is not into selling a mass market self-branded tech toy. What do you call the Kindle?

Amazon already has a well-established distribution system in place, something Microsoft does not have, at least not in terms of delivering content. Taking all of these things into consideration, Amazon would be the perfect match for selling a multi-function consumption device.
QUOTE Thanks
baggss

 
baggss's Avatar
 
Member Since: Oct 10, 2004
Location: Margaritaville
Posts: 10,309
baggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond repute
Mac Specs: 27" 3.4 Ghz i7 iMac-13" C2D Macbook-OSX 18.8.2-64Gb iPad 2-32 Gb iPhone 5-ATV 2-14Tb of Storage

baggss is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1991-C4 View Post
As much as you don't want to believe it, Steve Jobs works FOR the board of directors, not the other way around. Apple is a publicly traded company and his first duty is to run the company at a profit so the shareholders can be paid dividends. If he fails to do that, he can be fired.
Contrary to what you may believe, you are incorrect. Sure it works that way on paper but reality is far different with Apple. As I recommended before, you should read some Apple history and learn more about Steve Jobs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by loushen
I think what baggss is saying is that Apple's focus is different. See an interview with Jobs and he concentrates on Apple's great software and hardware. His attitude is, we make great products and the customers will come, the money will come with them and we will make a profit. His focus is definitely not we must make more money by any means just to keep the shareholders happy.
That too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1991-C4
Apple's focus is EXACTLY the same as every other corporation... to make money. People invest in the stock market for one reason... to make money! Its economics 101. The employees at Apple have to be paid and Apple has to pay them benefits as well and they can only do this if the company makes a profit. Steve Jobs retains his position because he makes money for the shareholders. From a PR standpoint, he is smart enough to say that his job is to create cool stuff that people want to buy, but the bottom line (and I mean that very literally) is that if his innovative, bleeding edge ideas fail to make money, he is out of a job.
Again, you need to read up on Apple in general and Jobs in specific. He doesn't just run that company, he IS that company. You may choose to believe Apple is just another company out to make a buck, and in some respects they are, but Jobs has always been different and Apple has always been different. There's a reason it's often referred to as a cult. Knowledge is power, get some.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1991-C4 View Post
And as far as Amazon goes, do you even know who they are or what they do? Amazon started out by selling printed books over the Internet, but now they sell pretty much anything you can think of. Why? Jeff Bezos is smart! He figured out how to sell stuff, tangible things and content like books and music. They are arguably the most successful dot com in history.

Why would Amazon make a Kindle app for an Apple product? In order to sell more Amazon content to people without having to buy Amazon hardware.

And speaking of that, you say that Amazon is not into selling a mass market self-branded tech toy. What do you call the Kindle?

Amazon already has a well-established distribution system in place, something Microsoft does not have, at least not in terms of delivering content. Taking all of these things into consideration, Amazon would be the perfect match for selling a multi-function consumption device.
Again, Amazon and Apple are not really in competition. If anything they compliment each other, particularly where the Kindle is concerned. If Amazon wanted to compete with Apple they would, head on. Amazon is out to sell products in any way they can. If the Kindle was really meant to be competition for Apple they would make it do so much more and they wouldn't make content readily available for use on Apples devices. As it stands it's a win-win for both companies. Amazon is in direct competition with folks like B&N and Borders and other on-line folks, not Apple. Sure Amazon could sell a device, they could sell the heck out of it, they just couldn't really build it. Sure the Kindle is a nice gadget, but it's more simple than a basic iPod ever was (well, maybe not the Shuffle). That's just my opinion though.

Speaking of opinions, you might want to realize that your opinion is neither fact nor law (nor is mine), it is not the only opinion out there, others ARE allowed to disagree and have a discussion and a difference of opinion. No need to get snippy or rude when folks disagree with you. I'm not attacking you or denigrating you personally in any way. Chill.


QUOTE Thanks
louishen

 
louishen's Avatar
 
Member Since: Oct 22, 2007
Location: London
Posts: 8,948
louishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant futurelouishen has a brilliant future
Mac Specs: Mac Mini Core i7 2012 | White 2009 MacBook 2 Ghz | 733 Mhz G4 Quicksilver

louishen is offline
Does anybody have any opinions on Balmer and MS's plans for a tablet OS?

Member of the Month September 2008 & August 2012 | Found advice useful? – use the rep system
QUOTE Thanks
baggss

 
baggss's Avatar
 
Member Since: Oct 10, 2004
Location: Margaritaville
Posts: 10,309
baggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond reputebaggss has a reputation beyond repute
Mac Specs: 27" 3.4 Ghz i7 iMac-13" C2D Macbook-OSX 18.8.2-64Gb iPad 2-32 Gb iPhone 5-ATV 2-14Tb of Storage

baggss is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by louishen View Post
Does anybody have any opinions on Balmer and MS's plans for a tablet OS?
I predict market crushing success, but what do I know...?


QUOTE Thanks
TattooedMac

 
TattooedMac's Avatar
 
Member Since: May 19, 2009
Location: Waiting for a mate . . .
Posts: 7,861
TattooedMac has a brilliant futureTattooedMac has a brilliant futureTattooedMac has a brilliant futureTattooedMac has a brilliant futureTattooedMac has a brilliant futureTattooedMac has a brilliant futureTattooedMac has a brilliant futureTattooedMac has a brilliant futureTattooedMac has a brilliant futureTattooedMac has a brilliant futureTattooedMac has a brilliant future
Mac Specs: 21" iMac 2.9Ghz 10.9.4 13"MBP 2.9Ghz i7 Yosemite 10.10 ~ iPhone5 iOS 8 ~ iPad Mini iOS 8 ~ ATV3 6.1

TattooedMac is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by louishen View Post
Does anybody have any opinions on Balmer and MS's plans for a tablet OS?
I think he is worrying too much about how far Apple are ahead of his MS

Have a read of this article and Video ...
Steve Ballmers iPad envy ......
Ballmer worry about your own company, come out with a good device then you wont have ENVY HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

CogFrog Studio's ~ Photography, Apps and Web Development
Dont forget to use the Reputation System if someone has helped you out !!!
Arguing with a zealot is only slightly easier than tunneling through a mountain with your forehead!!!!!
QUOTE Thanks
1991-C4

 
1991-C4's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jun 17, 2010
Location: Missouri
Posts: 343
1991-C4 has a spectacular aura about
Mac Specs: 2 iPod Touches and iPad

1991-C4 is offline
OK, maybe I went a little overboard. I apologize.

I meant no disrespect for Apple or Steve Jobs. Clearly, he is the driving force that has put Apple where it is today. He is certainly a unique individual with a particular talent (gift?) for knowing what people want. Maybe it was his conversion to Buddhism or his "experiments" with LSD in the 70's which he calls. "one of the two or three most important things [he had] done in [his] life".

I guess my point was that there are over 30,000 people who rely on a paycheck from Apple to support their families and while there might be a "cult" atmosphere at One Infinite Loop, it is Steve's job to make sure they get paid, as well as holders of the millions of shares of AAPL. All I am saying is that he has the exact same responsibility as every other CEO... to make money. The thing that makes him different is his methodology.

Make no mistake. There are very few people in his league. I get that. But I think he has been given a very wide latitude in terms of running the company because he has a proven track record and it appears that he has complete control of the company because of his successes. Wall Street, however, is very much a, "What have you done for me lately?" situation. Look at Tony Hayward. Damage our company and you are out of a job, pure and simple. No one is immune from that. As long as Steve's health holds out and as long as these latest iDevices keep flying off the shelves, his position is secure... for now.

You know, it really is OK to think of Apple as a multi-billion dollar international mega-corporation. Apple is not in the business of curing cancer or AIDS or ending the conflict between Israel and the Palestinians or hunting down Osama bin Laden. They are just a business. A very unique business with a sometimes quirky but brilliant man at the helm, but it is just a business.
QUOTE Thanks

Post Reply New Thread Subscribe


« MobileMe | A very nice switching story »
Thread Tools

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Steve Ballmer - We are hardcore about tablets TattooedMac Schweb's Lounge 21 07-15-2010 01:23 AM
What happens when Apple passes Microsoft in market value? the8thark Apple Rumors and Reports 17 04-02-2010 04:01 PM
So... what laptop does Microsoft CEO, Steve Ballmer use for presentations? cwa107 Schweb's Lounge 19 04-29-2008 04:05 PM
Dont take this the wrong way... powerbook Switcher Hangout 21 11-08-2007 08:20 AM
Have You Longed To See Bill Gates As Morpheus & Steve Ballmer As Neo Murlyn Schweb's Lounge 2 11-19-2003 06:17 PM

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:59 PM.

Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
X

Welcome to Mac-Forums.com

Create your username to jump into the discussion!

New members like you have made this community the ultimate source for your Mac since 2003!


(4 digit year)

Already a member?