New To Mac-Forums?

Welcome to our community! Join the discussion today by registering your FREE account. If you have any problems with the registration process, please contact us!

Get your questions answered by community gurus • Advice and insight from world-class Apple enthusiasts • Exclusive access to members-only contests, giveaways and deals

Join today!

 
Start a Discussion
 

Mac-Forums Brief

Subscribe to Mac-Forums Brief to receive special offers from Mac-Forums partners and sponsors

Join the conversation RSS
Schweb's Lounge Forum for general conversation, chit chat, or most topics that don't fit in another forum.

so microsoft wants my companies blood....


Post Reply New Thread Subscribe

 
Thread Tools
johnnyFIVE

 
johnnyFIVE's Avatar
 
Member Since: Dec 11, 2009
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 153
johnnyFIVE is an unknown at this point
Mac Specs: iPad & iphone 3G

johnnyFIVE is offline
thought this was interesting. my company sells used computers, and obviously many of them come with a windows XP coa. typically windows is installed on them and they are sold as used systems with legit operating systems from the COA and it is only being used on that system.

I dont know how well you track the industry I am in or if you know about it at all, but this is a big thing people in my industry do. Businesses that have been around for years and years. Even in export when we sell a few hundred machines we leave the COA on the machine but dont install anything. Just sell them as XXX qty machines with XP Pro COA and a wiped hard drive.

to the problem.

just this week we received a notice from microsoft that in summary says what we are doing is illegal. In the store we cant sell machines with OS installed unless we include the software disc that originally came with the dell for example with the coa on the machine. that counters what every used computer store has been doing for years. furthermore, selling machines in bulk with no install it is also apparently illegal if we do not pull the COA off of the machine. So I have to sell machines in qty with the COA pulled or I am breaking the law.

Ive never heard of this before and I called some companies larger than us, some that are many millions of dollars larger than us, and they have still been selling machines with XP COAs and have never heard of this. its odd we would be singled out.

also, I found it funny that this came in the week after Apple surpassing microsoft or whatever.

Perhaps they should spend money on more innovation or something else rather than chasing down a 10 year old operating system. just my theory.

QUOTE Thanks
Dragonhunter

 
Dragonhunter's Avatar
 
Member Since: Nov 13, 2009
Location: Laquey, Missouri
Posts: 44
Dragonhunter is on a distinguished road
Mac Specs: 2009 MacBook, Touch 2ndgen 16g iOS 4

Dragonhunter is offline
Interesting....what's a coa?

Dragonhunter
QUOTE Thanks
neonmac

 
neonmac's Avatar
 
Member Since: Feb 14, 2010
Posts: 118
neonmac will become famous soon enough
Mac Specs: Macbook : 2.26ghz,2gb ram and love it

neonmac is offline
Shame MS would try this. Hopefully with Apple sales way up and now google getting rid of MS systems, there may be hope that MS will someday roll over and die. Hope this gets resolved.

The only thing Microsoft could make that would not suck, would be a vacum.

www.obsessivemacdisorder.com
QUOTE Thanks
Nethfel

 
Member Since: Feb 25, 2009
Posts: 2,109
Nethfel is a glorious beacon of lightNethfel is a glorious beacon of lightNethfel is a glorious beacon of lightNethfel is a glorious beacon of lightNethfel is a glorious beacon of lightNethfel is a glorious beacon of light
Mac Specs: Late 2013 rMBP, i7, 750m gpu, OSX versions 10.9.3, 10.10

Nethfel is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragonhunter View Post
Interesting....what's a coa?
CoA = Certificate of Authority. In the case of MS - it's a little sticker that's supposed to be put on the side of any computer that has MS windows installed - it's the license key that's associated with that install (a long set of numbers and/or letters that is keyed in at time of install on non-slipstreamed versions of the OS) - and with OEM systems, it's the key that's related to an install that's usually bios locked to the given system it's installed on.

Which also makes it an interesting issue as usually a Dell key can't be used on any other machine other then a Dell, and in theory, the key is supposed to follow the machine so I'm not sure why M$ is being a pain about it.

My Macs: Late 2013 rMBP w/ 750m; Mac mini G4, 1.25 GHz, 512m ram (server); Late 2011 11" MBA, 1.8GHz i7, 4Gig Ram, 256Gig SSD, HD3000; Powerbook 12" G4 1.33GHz running Debian as a server; Apple TV (1080p version)
QUOTE Thanks
technologist

 
Member Since: Mar 30, 2004
Location: USA
Posts: 4,744
technologist has a reputation beyond reputetechnologist has a reputation beyond reputetechnologist has a reputation beyond reputetechnologist has a reputation beyond reputetechnologist has a reputation beyond reputetechnologist has a reputation beyond reputetechnologist has a reputation beyond reputetechnologist has a reputation beyond reputetechnologist has a reputation beyond reputetechnologist has a reputation beyond reputetechnologist has a reputation beyond repute
Mac Specs: 12" Apple PowerBook G4 (1.5GHz)

technologist is offline
Sounds like something to turn over to your lawyer.

You do have one, right?
QUOTE Thanks
Eric559

 
Eric559's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jul 18, 2007
Location: Central California
Posts: 3,185
Eric559 is a glorious beacon of lightEric559 is a glorious beacon of lightEric559 is a glorious beacon of lightEric559 is a glorious beacon of lightEric559 is a glorious beacon of lightEric559 is a glorious beacon of light
Mac Specs: 2.16GHz C2D MacBook w/ 2GB RAM & 120GB HD. HTC Droid Incredible.

Eric559 is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragonhunter View Post
Interesting....what's a coa?
Certificate of Authenticity.

Member Of The Month for December '08.
It's only the internet!
QUOTE Thanks
thomas998

 
Member Since: Jul 21, 2009
Posts: 194
thomas998 will become famous soon enough
Mac Specs: Late 2008 MBP

thomas998 is offline
Frankly I would toss the letter and keep doing what I was doing. The license that spells out what you can an cannot do with the windows software was accepted by the original purchaser of the software.... or by the original purchaser of the hardware. You are a secondary owner of the software and guess what, you never were provided the terms of the license as the original owner was.

You purchased the computers used as is and with the understanding that they had legal and transferable operating systems on them. It isn't your responsibility to determine what software is or is not legal on those machines... Bill Gates would love it if people had to buy new versions of Windows everytime they bought a machine new or used.

If Microsoft wants to go after anyone it would need to be the original owner that accepted the terms of the license agreement and then broke them by selling the machine without the original disks...

Fact is a lot of machines sold now from the factory don't have disks with them at all as the manufacturers put the recovery disks on the hard drive.... there is a very good chance that a lot of the computers you are selling have never even had the restore disks on the hard drives burned to CDs as it is such a pain that lots of people don't bother.... It isn't like Apples where they give you the OS disk as an actual disk. Come to think of it the last two windows machines I bought had the restore disks on the hard drive not as an actual disk.
QUOTE Thanks
fixcomputers007

 
Member Since: Jun 02, 2010
Posts: 1
fixcomputers007 is on a distinguished road

fixcomputers007 is offline
I can't believe this! I am a big time PC user and I repair Windows based computers all of the time! I do have to switch over to MAC soon because of reasons I'm not going to get into here but...

You are right! Many manufacturers are not even shipping original OS software discs anymore. Once the OS is activated on that machine it is totally bound to that machine regardless of who owns the machine!!!

It really is the only thing of value with PC's. That little COA is the most expensive part of an old computer that is getting surplused from a big company. No one is going to go invest in another license at $150-$250 for an old PC when you can go buy a brand spankin new PC for just a little more.

I think the only thing that will come of this is more electronic crap in the landfill and more people switching to MACs.

This kind of angers me! GRRRRRR....
QUOTE Thanks
johnnyFIVE

 
johnnyFIVE's Avatar
 
Member Since: Dec 11, 2009
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 153
johnnyFIVE is an unknown at this point
Mac Specs: iPad & iphone 3G

johnnyFIVE is offline
Well my company exports/sells unusable machines as scrap so any PCs we receive will never ever end up in a landfill. None of the electronics we receive will ever end up in a landfill. One of the reasons why you'd want to work with a company like mine through your business or personal use.

In regards to tossing the letter jail time and hefty fees were threatened. My boss took it to our lawyer and he advised him that ignoring this is not the way to go. We are currently waiting for a response from Microsoft but I will let you know how it goes when I get it back.

Right now dells and apples are the only machines I can sell because Dell discs are the only restore discs that I have. In addition to my collection of Apple restore discs.

My HPs and MPCs are just kind of hanging out until I either purchase restore discs or sell them with Linux or something or without COA. Typically you can get restore discs pretty cheap, especially since I don't need a serial since its on the machine. However now when I sell 100+ machines I have to include the stupid discs which is a margin cutter which kinda sucks.

QUOTE Thanks
cwa107

 
cwa107's Avatar
 
Member Since: Dec 20, 2006
Location: Middletown, Pennsylvania
Posts: 26,576
cwa107 has a reputation beyond reputecwa107 has a reputation beyond reputecwa107 has a reputation beyond reputecwa107 has a reputation beyond reputecwa107 has a reputation beyond reputecwa107 has a reputation beyond reputecwa107 has a reputation beyond reputecwa107 has a reputation beyond reputecwa107 has a reputation beyond reputecwa107 has a reputation beyond reputecwa107 has a reputation beyond repute
Mac Specs: 15" MBP, Core i7/2GHz, 8GB RAM, 480GB Crucial M500 SSD

cwa107 is offline
Do let us know what you find out. I too am perplexed by their complaint here. If you're using the product ID on a valid CoA that accompanied the machine originally and the OS installation matches that type, I can't see their argument. They made their money off the OEM already, why should they care if the disc is included. Quite frankly, in most cases, the discs never even existed as most OEMs include a recovery partition.

This smacks of extortion to me. They do have special licensing programs for recyclers and my guess is that they just want a pound of flesh.

Liquid and computers don't mix. It might seem simple, but we see an incredible amount of people post here about spills. Keep drinks and other liquids away from your expensive electronics!
QUOTE Thanks
johnnyFIVE

 
johnnyFIVE's Avatar
 
Member Since: Dec 11, 2009
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 153
johnnyFIVE is an unknown at this point
Mac Specs: iPad & iphone 3G

johnnyFIVE is offline
Yah. We have been stumped as well. Especially since this is such a staple of our industry. Us and most of my competitors aren't bob selling on craigs list from his garage living in an illegal or gray area of the law. For the volume we do we have to stay 100% legal.

QUOTE Thanks
thomas998

 
Member Since: Jul 21, 2009
Posts: 194
thomas998 will become famous soon enough
Mac Specs: Late 2008 MBP

thomas998 is offline
I'm sorry but I think your lawyer is an idiot. You don't get jail time to breaking a contractual agreement, which is what a software license is... it would be a civil matter and all that one could hope to get from the other would be monetary damages. IF you were making illegal copies of software, then that could be a criminal matter, but what you'e described is at best a civil matter.

In my past I wrote license agreements for some software companies and even then the companies knew upfront that everything was more of a thing to make people that are generally honest do the right thing. There was never any expectation that it would be worth it to chase anyone down unless it was found that they were installing the software on multiple machines.

If it were me I would toss the letter and continue business as usual.
QUOTE Thanks
dtravis7

 
dtravis7's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jan 04, 2005
Location: Modesto, Ca.
Posts: 27,761
dtravis7 has a reputation beyond reputedtravis7 has a reputation beyond reputedtravis7 has a reputation beyond reputedtravis7 has a reputation beyond reputedtravis7 has a reputation beyond reputedtravis7 has a reputation beyond reputedtravis7 has a reputation beyond reputedtravis7 has a reputation beyond reputedtravis7 has a reputation beyond reputedtravis7 has a reputation beyond reputedtravis7 has a reputation beyond repute
Mac Specs: iMac 2.4 C2D 10.10, iMac 2.16 C2d 10.6.8, Macbook2007 10.8.4, Mac Mini 10.8.4, iPhone 3GS Note 8!!

dtravis7 is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nethfel View Post
CoA = Certificate of Authority. In the case of MS - it's a little sticker that's supposed to be put on the side of any computer that has MS windows installed - it's the license key that's associated with that install (a long set of numbers and/or letters that is keyed in at time of install on non-slipstreamed versions of the OS) - and with OEM systems, it's the key that's related to an install that's usually bios locked to the given system it's installed on.

Which also makes it an interesting issue as usually a Dell key can't be used on any other machine other then a Dell, and in theory, the key is supposed to follow the machine so I'm not sure why M$ is being a pain about it.
I totally agree. I have a friend who works for MS in a big position and he told me the same thing many times.

That COA is the Key Tied to that machine just like Nethfel said.
QUOTE Thanks
Nethfel

 
Member Since: Feb 25, 2009
Posts: 2,109
Nethfel is a glorious beacon of lightNethfel is a glorious beacon of lightNethfel is a glorious beacon of lightNethfel is a glorious beacon of lightNethfel is a glorious beacon of lightNethfel is a glorious beacon of light
Mac Specs: Late 2013 rMBP, i7, 750m gpu, OSX versions 10.9.3, 10.10

Nethfel is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric559 View Post
Certificate of Authenticity.
Oops haha, you're right - I was dealing with a couple of different things at the time I was posting and I flipped the words of two different things - I had to send a corrected email too roflmao.

My Macs: Late 2013 rMBP w/ 750m; Mac mini G4, 1.25 GHz, 512m ram (server); Late 2011 11" MBA, 1.8GHz i7, 4Gig Ram, 256Gig SSD, HD3000; Powerbook 12" G4 1.33GHz running Debian as a server; Apple TV (1080p version)
QUOTE Thanks
XJ-linux

 
XJ-linux's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jul 02, 2007
Location: Going Galt...
Posts: 3,357
XJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond repute
Mac Specs: MacBookAir5,2:10.9.4-MacMini3,1:10.9.4-iPhone6,1:7.1.2

XJ-linux is offline
I don't know much, but I have been told "Don't post anything online that you don't want read in court." That said, you might wish to examine what you post about your situation lest the weasels, I mean lawyers smell it and charge you $1000 a word to debate it in count. Just a thought.

"Those who don't understand Unix are condemned to reinvent it, poorly." – Henry Spencer
QUOTE Thanks

Post Reply New Thread Subscribe


« I know im nobody | Mac's #1 Fan's Birthday »
Thread Tools

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Wine - dotnet30 littlboz OS X - Development and Darwin 4 05-26-2010 03:33 PM
Microsoft confirms Office SP2 can't read Win-created files Colonel Panic OS X - Apps and Games 3 07-31-2009 03:20 PM
Im So Mad: mac haters. Chris3801 Switcher Hangout 131 07-20-2009 11:22 PM
The Secret Failures of Microsoft baggss Schweb's Lounge 16 01-26-2007 12:49 PM

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:16 AM.

Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
X

Welcome to Mac-Forums.com

Create your username to jump into the discussion!

New members like you have made this community the ultimate source for your Mac since 2003!


(4 digit year)

Already a member?