New To Mac-Forums?

Welcome to our community! Join the discussion today by registering your FREE account. If you have any problems with the registration process, please contact us!

Get your questions answered by community gurus Advice and insight from world-class Apple enthusiasts Exclusive access to members-only contests, giveaways and deals

Join today!

 
Start a Discussion
 

Mac-Forums Brief

Subscribe to Mac-Forums Brief to receive special offers from Mac-Forums partners and sponsors

Join the conversation RSS
Images, Graphic Design, and Digital Photography Discussion of all things graphics.

Why do people never take our advice as Graphic Designers?


Post Reply New Thread Subscribe

 
Thread Tools
may1972

 
Member Since: Dec 18, 2012
Posts: 3
may1972 is on a distinguished road

may1972 is offline
Hi,
I work as part of a team of designers for an organisation. We create a lot of design work/logos etc internally. But what frustrates us is when we give advice and artwork on a certain design or style, a lot of staff ignore us, and feel the need to criticise - telling us their ideas are better than our advice. I don't mean in a nasty way, they just see their projects as 'their baby's' and have a vision of how something should look. Yet when we follow branding guidelines but with a clever twist so our design 'works' really well - they just don't get it!

You must know what i mean.... someone sends you a poor logo attempt in Word, so we adapt it into a great design in Illustrator, targeting its audience, yet they look at it and think it's OK to tell us to change this, change that. Then a stand-off ensues when we stand up for what we've done. Why don't people realise WE ARE THE EXPERTS IN GRAPHIC DESIGN - that's what the company employed us for - but we always seem to be the ones told to stand down - or to 'meet them halfway'. I'm all for constructive criticism, but we never tell others in the company how to do their jobs - so why should we be told how to do ours!

Sorry for the outrage - but it does frustrate us as designers! We HAVE talked to hierarchy here about the problem but they don;t understand our problem either - and just want to keep company harmony... ie 'meet them halfway'.

Btw - we are good designers with many years experience - so we know exactly how a project should be handled from a design pov.

Has anyone else experienced this and can offer advice! thanks
QUOTE Thanks
IvanLasston

 
IvanLasston's Avatar
 
Member Since: Feb 26, 2010
Location: Rocky Mountain High, Colorado
Posts: 2,116
IvanLasston is a splendid one to beholdIvanLasston is a splendid one to beholdIvanLasston is a splendid one to beholdIvanLasston is a splendid one to beholdIvanLasston is a splendid one to beholdIvanLasston is a splendid one to beholdIvanLasston is a splendid one to beholdIvanLasston is a splendid one to behold
Mac Specs: 1.8 GHz i7 MBA 11" OSX 10.8.2

IvanLasston is offline
One of my favorite sentences - "People aren't against you - They are for themselves"
10 Sentences that Can Change Your Life - Lifehack

You even say it - in so many words in your post
Quote:
they just see their projects as 'their baby's' and have a vision of how something should look
Is it right? I don't know - but if you approach strife that way - then your job is to show them why what you did is better for them - not try to convince them what you did was good.
QUOTE Thanks
vansmith

 
vansmith's Avatar
 
Member Since: Oct 19, 2008
Location: Toronto
Posts: 18,354
vansmith has a reputation beyond reputevansmith has a reputation beyond reputevansmith has a reputation beyond reputevansmith has a reputation beyond reputevansmith has a reputation beyond reputevansmith has a reputation beyond reputevansmith has a reputation beyond reputevansmith has a reputation beyond reputevansmith has a reputation beyond reputevansmith has a reputation beyond reputevansmith has a reputation beyond repute
Mac Specs: 2012 13" MBP (2.5 i5, 8GB)

vansmith is offline
This is a problem endemic to, well, everything. All "experts" are criticized by someone who thinks they know better. In many ways, this is a good things - blind deference to expertise is a terrible thing. So, yes, you will always see people challenge your expertise as an expert (we all will) and the best you can do is argue your case using your knowledge to support it.

Important Links: Community Guidelines : Use the reputation system if you've been helped.
M-F Blog :: Write for the blog
Writing a Quality Post
QUOTE Thanks
CrimsonRequiem

 
CrimsonRequiem's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jul 24, 2008
Posts: 6,006
CrimsonRequiem is a name known to allCrimsonRequiem is a name known to allCrimsonRequiem is a name known to allCrimsonRequiem is a name known to allCrimsonRequiem is a name known to allCrimsonRequiem is a name known to allCrimsonRequiem is a name known to all
Mac Specs: MBP 2.3 Ghz 4GB RAM 860 GB SSD, iMac 3.4 GHz Intel Core i7 32GB RAM, Fusion Drive 1TB

CrimsonRequiem is offline
As a designer it's your job to tell them what they need.

死神はリンゴしか食べない。
QUOTE Thanks
XJ-linux

 
XJ-linux's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jul 02, 2007
Location: Going Galt...
Posts: 3,363
XJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond reputeXJ-linux has a reputation beyond repute
Mac Specs: MacBookAir5,2:10.9.5-MacMini3,1:10.9.5-iPhone6,1:8.1

XJ-linux is offline
I think every trade or "job" has this in it to a degree. We have all been on the delivery and receiving end of it as well, whether we realize it or not. I know I've experienced the same thing in landscaping, in IT and in law enforcement. That's just how humans play together in general. Don't let it get to you, and you'll be a happier person.
QUOTE Thanks
pep9454

 
Member Since: Jan 28, 2013
Posts: 2
pep9454 is on a distinguished road

pep9454 is offline
I've been a professional photographer for 36 yrs. and with digital cameras getting pretty good, everybody's now a professional photographer. Same for the graphic design world.

I would say to make your client feel he's in charge and instead of confrontational, make your comments and suggestion using the words 'you, yours, them' and not 'I'.

No different than when I shoot a commercial job and there's an art director there that thinks he knows it all. If you don't make them feel you're on their side, they'll take over. A good phrase is 'You must have a reason for wanting to change XXXX, may I ask why YOU feel that way?'

Good luck!

Phil
QUOTE Thanks
may1972

 
Member Since: Dec 18, 2012
Posts: 3
may1972 is on a distinguished road

may1972 is offline
Thanks everyone - some really positive and supportive replies. I like the idea of turning the tables to emphasise 'you' and not 'we'.

Thans again!
QUOTE Thanks
chas_m

 
chas_m's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jan 22, 2010
Location: Victoria, BC
Posts: 17,570
chas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond repute
Mac Specs: Mid-2012 MBP (16GB, 1TB HD), BenQ second monitor, iPhone 5s 32GB, iPad Air 2 64GB

chas_m is online now
On the one end of this, I used to work for a designer that had his degree in graphic design on his wall. When someone would ask for a change, he would point to it and say "do you have one of these? No? Then shut up and go away. Come back when you have one." (to be fair, if the suggestion/change/idea was a good one he would not do that, and instead thank them).

On the other end was my father in law, who was the MASTER of the "you not I' concept above. He would listen to the dumb idea in full, then say "have you considered ..." and then explain why he did what he did, and why the dumb idea was dumb. They generally agreed, though occasionally he would have to carry out their suggestion and show them visually why it was a dumb idea.
QUOTE Thanks
CrimsonRequiem

 
CrimsonRequiem's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jul 24, 2008
Posts: 6,006
CrimsonRequiem is a name known to allCrimsonRequiem is a name known to allCrimsonRequiem is a name known to allCrimsonRequiem is a name known to allCrimsonRequiem is a name known to allCrimsonRequiem is a name known to allCrimsonRequiem is a name known to all
Mac Specs: MBP 2.3 Ghz 4GB RAM 860 GB SSD, iMac 3.4 GHz Intel Core i7 32GB RAM, Fusion Drive 1TB

CrimsonRequiem is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by chas_m View Post
On the one end of this, I used to work for a designer that had his degree in graphic design on his wall. When someone would ask for a change, he would point to it and say "do you have one of these? No? Then shut up and go away. Come back when you have one." (to be fair, if the suggestion/change/idea was a good one he would not do that, and instead thank them).

On the other end was my father in law, who was the MASTER of the "you not I' concept above. He would listen to the dumb idea in full, then say "have you considered ..." and then explain why he did what he did, and why the dumb idea was dumb. They generally agreed, though occasionally he would have to carry out their suggestion and show them visually why it was a dumb idea.
I hope he charges by the hour. Cause he would make a killing do that.

死神はリンゴしか食べない。
QUOTE Thanks
Vipor

 
Vipor's Avatar
 
Member Since: Feb 26, 2009
Posts: 68
Vipor will become famous soon enough

Vipor is offline
hahaha... I know, I know... resurrecting an old thread...

Ran across this thread while doing searches for Graphic Design and it brought back memories..

My story... I work at a PC company (eeek!) in R&D and have been for many years. Am currently in the server side of the biz but two years ago I was spending a short stint in the notebook side. I was in the software dev group managing some app development. I recall working with my developers to ensure the apps in dev were functional per the required specs. Working with these guys day by day, I got to know how tough their job was trying to get the requested functionality out of the app knowing the programing tools do have certain limitations. Part of the spec for the app included the GUI of course. Well, guess where the input for the GUI comes from? Yes, the Graphic Designers up in the ID department. When having meetings with these ID guys to "negotiate" the GUI due to issues with "what they want" vs "what we can do", naturally they would insist on what they wanted. My point is... sometimes the issue is more "feasibility and/or tool limitations" rather than just what each group wants.

Anywho, just made me laugh when I ran across the thread cause those were good times for me. Learned a ton working with those folks.

2008 Alum MacBook: 13", 2.4GHz, 4GB, 750GB, Snow Leopard
2011 iMac: 27", 2.7Ghz QC, 4GB, 1TB, Mtn Lion
QUOTE Thanks
chas_m

 
chas_m's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jan 22, 2010
Location: Victoria, BC
Posts: 17,570
chas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond reputechas_m has a reputation beyond repute
Mac Specs: Mid-2012 MBP (16GB, 1TB HD), BenQ second monitor, iPhone 5s 32GB, iPad Air 2 64GB

chas_m is online now
One thing I learned in my graphic design days is that sometimes, the non-designer is right. Even good designers can get stuck in a rut or married to a particular idea. Steve Jobs, among others, have proven that sometimes a non-designer can hit it on the head. You have to be willing to listen and honestly consider the idea -- even if it seems bad at first -- so that you will be able to better defend your view later. I've also noticed that when clients think you are taking them seriously, they will respond better to the eventual mutual decision to go in a different way.
QUOTE Thanks

Post Reply New Thread Subscribe


« Problem: Photoshop CS5 & Epson Stylus 3800 | Trying to shoot photos tethered to OS 10.8 »
Thread Tools

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Need advice on iMac configuration for graphic design MacFlurrie Apple Desktops 3 07-16-2011 10:15 PM
What is the big deal people!!! Bresine Switcher Hangout 14 09-23-2008 04:41 AM
Programmer to designer...career advice please, please!! UnhndldExcptn Images, Graphic Design, and Digital Photography 17 08-15-2008 01:15 AM
Any Graphic Designers Here? guirigales Apple Desktops 2 09-25-2006 05:49 PM
To All Graphic Designers With Font Problems shoude77 Images, Graphic Design, and Digital Photography 1 04-03-2006 11:33 PM

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:56 AM.

Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
X

Welcome to Mac-Forums.com

Create your username to jump into the discussion!

New members like you have made this community the ultimate source for your Mac since 2003!


(4 digit year)

Already a member?