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Apple Desktops Discussion of Apple's desktop machines including Mac Pro, iMac, Power Mac, and mini

First time mac user (iMac G3 333)


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frail
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So I decided to venture over into the Mac world. Been wanting to for some time but couldn't really afford the hardware that I wanted. So I just decided to get something affordable off of ebay for the time being until I can afford something I really want.

So I ended up getting a Blueberry iMac G3 333. It has a 10gig hard drive and 128MB of RAM which I will be adding another 128MB to. So naturally I have a few questions. The iMac I'm getting(in a few days) comes with Tiger and OS 9.2 preinstalled. So I'm curious if it would be safe to remove OS 9.2 and how that can be done. Adding/removing programs and OSes etc is foreign to me as this is my first venture with a Mac.

Also I read somewhere that with OSX on my iMac that it has to run on an 8GB or less partition. Does that mean the other 2Gigs are useless to me?

And just a general inquiry as to how well Tiger would run on this computer with its 333mhz processor and 256MB of RAM. Thanks.
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Badger
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For info on this model you can go to www.lowendmac.com. For your specific questions: The 333 mhz model does not support Tiger - 10.4. Panther - 10.3.9 - is latest (and last) system that is compatible due to hardware limitations. Also, this model came with a 6 gb hard drive, so it appears that the HD has been replaced. You're right about the 8 gb partition being necessary but you don't lose the rest; it will appear as a second hard disk. Note that this may be a later model; from your description of 10 gb hard drive and Tiger installed it may be a 350 or 400 mhz model. You can tell very easily by the CD drive; if it has a pop-out tray it is from the original series (233 to 333 mhz). If the CD is a slot-loading version it is a later model.
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frail
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Badger
For info on this model you can go to www.lowendmac.com. For your specific questions: The 333 mhz model does not support Tiger - 10.4. Panther - 10.3.9 - is latest (and last) system that is compatible due to hardware limitations. Also, this model came with a 6 gb hard drive, so it appears that the HD has been replaced. You're right about the 8 gb partition being necessary but you don't lose the rest; it will appear as a second hard disk. Note that this may be a later model; from your description of 10 gb hard drive and Tiger installed it may be a 350 or 400 mhz model. You can tell very easily by the CD drive; if it has a pop-out tray it is from the original series (233 to 333 mhz). If the CD is a slot-loading version it is a later model.
The CD is tray loading so I imagine it's the 333 as it was advertised in the auction that I won. The description said that Tiger and OS 9.2 were loaded and the seller told me that Tiger was running fine. From other research I've done I was under the impression that Tiger could be installed using XPostFacto which I assumed the seller did if he's telling the truth. The hard drive must've been upgraded because I've seen from lowendmac.com that it comes standard with a 6gb hard drive. I was told that upgrading the RAM to meet Tiger's minimum spec of 256 should make it run okay. But I read something about one of the RAM slots being smaller than the other, which if that's the case I may have jumped the gun because I already bought the extra 128MB from macsales.com.

Assuming that everything is as stated in the auction, how would Tiger run with the added 128MB? Also, can I easily remove OS 9.2? I read something elsewhere about just deleting its folder. Thanks.

Edit: Here's the auction- http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...MEWA%3AIT&rd=1
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Padawan

 
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Well, as you stated, 256 MB is really the bare minimum to run OS X. A friend of mine purchased a G5 iMac somewhat recently, and even that machine was a bit sluggish with the standard 256 MB installed. Once it was upgraded to 768 MB, it was a night and day difference. Since this machine isn't terribly powerful to begin with, I'd recommend going with at least 512 MB total of RAM for it. As for deleting OS 9, you really don't want to do that with the machine running Tiger via XPostFacto, because XPF is an OS 9 application.

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frail
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Originally Posted by Padawan
Well, as you stated, 256 MB is really the bare minimum to run OS X. A friend of mine purchased a G5 iMac somewhat recently, and even that machine was a bit sluggish with the standard 256 MB installed. Once it was upgraded to 768 MB, it was a night and day difference. Since this machine isn't terribly powerful to begin with, I'd recommend going with at least 512 MB total of RAM for it. As for deleting OS 9, you really don't want to do that with the machine running Tiger via XPostFacto, because XPF is an OS 9 application.
Hmm...here it's stated that it's no problem to delete OS 9 after installing OSX. Not trying to be argumentative here, I just want to know who is right here. As for the RAM issue I stated previously, I guess the one I bought is a 1" low profile that should fit into either slot, so I dodged the bullet on that one. I've also read that sometimes the 333 iMacs don't recognize 256MB DIMMs correctly and only see them as 128MB. I suppose I could buy two 256MB low profile DIMMs and pop them in and see what happens.
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Why would you want to even try to get rid of os 9?

Older apps need it to run, old stickies, all sorts of stuff, its unobtrusive, not running unless you need it to, I guess I dont understand why you want to get rid of it in the first place?

Kevin, Spokane Washington USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frail
Hmm...here it's stated that it's no problem to delete OS 9 after installing OSX. Not trying to be argumentative here, I just want to know who is right here. As for the RAM issue I stated previously, I guess the one I bought is a 1" low profile that should fit into either slot, so I dodged the bullet on that one. I've also read that sometimes the 333 iMacs don't recognize 256MB DIMMs correctly and only see them as 128MB. I suppose I could buy two 256MB low profile DIMMs and pop them in and see what happens.
It's not that OS X Tiger will require OS 9 being installed in order to run, I just suggested that you keep it because I feel it's a good idea to. First, it's not very large, so it won't waste much drive space. But more importantly, as I stated above, XPostFacto is an OS 9 application. If for some reason you encounter an issue with XPF or Tiger (it's happened once or twice with my Beige G3 running Panther via XPostFacto), you'll have no way to download or run XPF to try to remedy the situation if you've deleted OS 9. Then you'll basically have a large paperweight until you get a Panther installation disk (or a Tiger disk and an OS 9 disk).

As for RAM, you shouldn't have an issue using two 256 MB sticks for a total of 512 MB.

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Badger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frail
Hmm...here it's stated that it's no problem to delete OS 9 after installing OSX. Not trying to be argumentative here, I just want to know who is right here. As for the RAM issue I stated previously, I guess the one I bought is a 1" low profile that should fit into either slot, so I dodged the bullet on that one. I've also read that sometimes the 333 iMacs don't recognize 256MB DIMMs correctly and only see them as 128MB. I suppose I could buy two 256MB low profile DIMMs and pop them in and see what happens.
If it's not using XPF and there are no OS 9 programs you want to use you can drag the OS 9 system and applications folders to the trash and erase them. However, if you're not getting the CDs with the computer you may not want to trash something you can't restore.
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I have a Grape 333 Imac I bought just to mess with. Panther 10.3.9 works great on it. Tiger does need a machine with Firewire which the older IMacs did not have. If XPF is there that probably is why Tiger installed on it.

As far as the RAM, it's not that the bottom RAM slot under the CPU is Smaller Length wise, The room for the ram from top to bottom is smaller than the TOP slot. Mine came with 128 in the Top and 64 in the bottom. I took it apart and was able to fit a standard PC100 SoDimm from my Thinkpad in the bottom slot for 256 and it worked fine. As long as the SoDimm is not real tall all should be fine.

If my memory serves me correctly, XPF does need OS9 on the system to run. I think the others are correct. With 10GB you should be fine. And the boot partation has to be in the first 8GB of the drive. Whatever is left over is made another partition and will be a separate drive under OSX.

Good luck. If I can help in any way let me know as I do have the same machine right here.
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frail
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dtravis7
I have a Grape 333 Imac I bought just to mess with. Panther 10.3.9 works great on it. Tiger does need a machine with Firewire which the older IMacs did not have. If XPF is there that probably is why Tiger installed on it.

As far as the RAM, it's not that the bottom RAM slot under the CPU is Smaller Length wise, The room for the ram from top to bottom is smaller than the TOP slot. Mine came with 128 in the Top and 64 in the bottom. I took it apart and was able to fit a standard PC100 SoDimm from my Thinkpad in the bottom slot for 256 and it worked fine. As long as the SoDimm is not real tall all should be fine.

If my memory serves me correctly, XPF does need OS9 on the system to run. I think the others are correct. With 10GB you should be fine. And the boot partation has to be in the first 8GB of the drive. Whatever is left over is made another partition and will be a separate drive under OSX.

Good luck. If I can help in any way let me know as I do have the same machine right here.
I appreciate your help. Do you think I'd be better off just buying a Panther CD and installing it clean? Seems Panther would probably be a better fit for my iMac. With Panther would I still need an 8GB partition?
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frail
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Badger
If it's not using XPF and there are no OS 9 programs you want to use you can drag the OS 9 system and applications folders to the trash and erase them. However, if you're not getting the CDs with the computer you may not want to trash something you can't restore.
Thanks for the help. I'll take this into account.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frail
I appreciate your help. Do you think I'd be better off just buying a Panther CD and installing it clean? Seems Panther would probably be a better fit for my iMac. With Panther would I still need an 8GB partition?
Panther is a great OS, and I would definitely suggest buying the installation disks for whatever OS you plan on running, so that you're legally using the software and are also able to format and reinstall whenever you need or want to. For your usage (not very familiar with Macs and not really interested in having OS 9 installed) I think Panther would be your best bet. As far as the 8 GB partition, you'll need to do this regardless of which version of OS X you install. However, it'snot a big issue and you really aren't losing any storage space or functionality of the drive.

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frail
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Originally Posted by Padawan
Panther is a great OS, and I would definitely suggest buying the installation disks for whatever OS you plan on running, so that you're legally using the software and are also able to format and reinstall whenever you need or want to. For your usage (not very familiar with Macs and not really interested in having OS 9 installed) I think Panther would be your best bet. As far as the 8 GB partition, you'll need to do this regardless of which version of OS X you install. However, it'snot a big issue and you really aren't losing any storage space or functionality of the drive.
Thanks. You've been a big help. I should get my iMac next Wednesday and in the meantime I'll try to get the install disks for Panther.

Update: I went ahead and bought the Panther full install CD set from macsales.com. I'll just use those to wipe the drive and do a fresh install of Panther and then update it over the internet to 10.3.9. As for another poster's question as to why I wouldn't want OS9; it's simply because OS X will do everything I did with Windows XP and I'd prefer not to waste my limited hard drive space on something I won't use.
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frail
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One last question: Will the following memory work for my iMac?

http://www.compusa.com/products/prod...71907&pfp=cat3

I also saw a 256MB with the same manufacturer with PC133 but they said it's not backwards compatible with PC100. Would it still work?

http://www.compusa.com/products/prod...173&pfp=BROWSE

Or do they have to low profile? I already have one low profile 128mb module, just wondering if either of the two above will work.

Thanks.
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Badger
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The PNY 128 module should work; the 256 may but may not. Since OS X is more demanding about memory specs it's better to get something you are sure of. OS X is known to reject memory that works fine under OS 9. With any memory be sure you can return/exchange it if there is a problem.
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