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View Full Version : DVD Ripping - What are you allowed to discuss?



schweb
07-19-2007, 11:41 PM
The forum rules at Mac-Forums (linked at the top of every forum) are very clear, we respect US law and court precedence when it comes to legality of activity.

Therefore to clarify:


You may not discuss breaking DVD encryption, copying, or "ripping" commercial, copy-protected DVDs.
This includes DVDs you own. Even if you own the DVD, it is still technically illegal under the DMCA to break the encryption. While some may argue otherwise, until the law is rewritten or the US Supreme Court strikes it down, we will adhere to the current intent of the law.
You may discuss ripping or copying unprotected movies or homemade DVDs.
You may discuss ripping or copying tools in the context that they are used for legal purposes as outlined in this post.


There are many other places online where you can go if you feel you absolutely need to discuss illegal things. We'd ask that you go there to do so.

milessthomas
07-19-2007, 11:43 PM
Thank you very much for adding this, I'm sure people will be glad to know this beforehand in specifics.

schweb
07-19-2007, 11:49 PM
Thank you very much for adding this, I'm sure people will be glad to know this beforehand in specifics.

You're welcome.

iRye
07-19-2007, 11:53 PM
Thanks so much. This is very helpful to me and ever.

MacHeadCase
07-21-2007, 04:55 PM
Cool info, schweb. Your post helps us all know how to reply to uhm certain kinds of posts.

Now if only the certain-kind-of-posts-posters could read this... ;D

dtravis7
07-21-2007, 05:06 PM
Very good info Schweb. We have to look out for our forums.

scanchan
12-12-2007, 03:43 AM
Very good info Schweb. We have to look out for our forums.

Some others want to discuss topics abour DVD.

Kash
12-12-2007, 05:45 AM
Some others want to discuss topics abour DVD.

Then you're going to have to find a forum that allows you to discuss illegal behavior as you're not allowed to do so here at Mac-Forums.

MacHeadCase
12-12-2007, 09:53 AM
Some others want to discuss topics abour DVD.

We're aware the rules won't please everyone. Part of liking a forum is joining a place where the member feels comfortable so if you don't feel like you can enjoy yourself here, by all means, find a place that will suit you more. :)

Leukeh
12-13-2007, 09:19 AM
While I do feel that the rules are sometimes a little anal-retentive, as I am one who is happy to discuss such matters, I do appreciate why the rules are in place. I don't want Mac-Forums to become a haven for illegal activity, and if that means chopping a few conversation topics then so be it... Rep for you, schweb - not that it does much! =P

space_invader64
12-14-2007, 02:27 PM
This forum is run by the RIAA?

MacHeadCase
12-14-2007, 02:52 PM
This forum is run by the RIAA?

Let's repeat this once more:


We're aware the rules won't please everyone. Part of liking a forum is joining a place where the member feels comfortable so if you don't feel like you can enjoy yourself here, by all means, find a place that will suit you more. :)

louishen
12-14-2007, 03:47 PM
I think most people will be more comfortable on this forum knowing that discussion of illegal content is not allowed, it is nice to find bits of the net that are free from bullying, racism, hacking, criminal activities and pornography.

knightlie
12-17-2007, 05:34 AM
I think most people will be more comfortable on this forum knowing that discussion of illegal content is not allowed, it is nice to find bits of the net that are free from bullying, racism, hacking, criminal activities and pornography.

Me too. My solution is to just go out and buy DVDs from shops and online stores instead of stealing them. Try these:

http://www.amazon.com

http://www.play.com

Kash
12-17-2007, 06:34 AM
This forum is run by the RIAA?

If you're going to make a snide comment, at least do it right. Mentioning the MPAA would have made sense, you just look dumb by saying RIAA.


Knightlie, there are a lot of people who would like to create backups of their DVDs so that they can avoid the possibility of scratching the originals. Some people would also like to rip DVDs for devices other than their DVD players, such as iPods or even to store on their computer so that they don't have to carry around physical DVDs.

Unfortunately, doing any of these seemingly legitimate things is technically illegal under the DMCA. Making the backup or converting to a file isn't the illegal part, it's the cracking of the encryption that's been made illegal. It's kind of sadistic when you think about it. Tell people that they can do whatever they want with their movies, but then make it illegal to get to them.

schweb
12-17-2007, 10:06 AM
This forum is run by the RIAA?

Yes...

TopDog
12-17-2007, 10:53 AM
My solution is to just go out and buy DVDs from shops and online stores instead of stealing them.
It does not necessarily have anything to do with stealing...

If you have lots of DVD's (especially TV-series) and a huge hard drive connected to your TV (like I have), ripping the DVD's can serve both as a backup of your legally bought media, a better way of accessing your legally bought media, and as a great way of reducing junk in your living room (by storing the physical media in the attic or basement).

According to Norwegian law I'm allowed to make personal copies of artwork (such as music and film) as long as I don't distribute them to others, but of course I respect that this forum wants to follow US law.

schweb
12-17-2007, 10:58 AM
Under US copyright law, you have no right to even backup unencrypted video. Devilboy seems to be the expert on this so I'm sure he can come along and share.

Therefore, in the US, there is no "right" to make backups. I'm not saying we agree with that stance, but it is the law.

knightlie
12-17-2007, 11:47 AM
Under US copyright law, you have no right to even backup unencrypted video. Devilboy seems to be the expert on this so I'm sure he can come along and share.

Therefore, in the US, there is no "right" to make backups. I'm not saying we agree with that stance, but it is the law.

That's certainly always been my understanding of it. Many people claim the "right to backup" their DVDs, but I'm not aware of it being any more legal than distributing copies.

D3v1L80Y
12-17-2007, 11:51 AM
Therefore, in the US, there is no "right" to make backups. I'm not saying we agree with that stance, but it is the law.
This is true. I am not saying that I agree with it either, but the copyright laws of the U.S. do not allow for any backing up or copying (with the intent of indefinite storage) of copyrighted broadcast video/motion picture material of any kind.

For the laws regarding copyright in the U.S., you can check out the U.S. Copyright Office's web page here:

http://www.copyright.gov/

MacFanBoy
01-06-2008, 03:21 AM
It is generally against the law to circumvent DVD Protection and NOT to copy contents.

Therefore I believe that if you made a bit for bit exact copy (including the DVD Protection) you would NOT be Breaking any laws....

This was discussed by Tom Merrit in a Buzz Out Loud podcast...
Therefore I would assume that this is also the case in USA...

So, are we allowed to talk about how to make a bit for bit copy.....:Smirk:

schweb
01-06-2008, 09:14 AM
It is generally against the law to circumvent DVD Protection and NOT to copy contents.

Therefore I believe that if you made a bit for bit exact copy (including the DVD Protection) you would NOT be Breaking any laws....

This was discussed by Tom Merrit in a Buzz Out Loud podcast...
Therefore I would assume that this is also the case in USA...

So, are we allowed to talk about how to make a bit for bit copy.....:Smirk:

Actually yes, it would still be against the law. US Copyright Law and Fair Use only cover audio, you are not allowed to make copies of video (that's why every video has that FBI warning). Devilboy is the expert on this part, but I wanted to make sure that it was clear.

cgsouthern
01-16-2008, 08:20 PM
Then why are DVR's like from satellite and cable companies legal in the US if you are not suppost to record TV shows, and movies off of showtime, hbo, etc; or is there some sort of admendment to the law about those devices?

D3v1L80Y
01-16-2008, 08:24 PM
Then why are DVR's like from satellite and cable companies legal in the US if you are not suppost to record TV shows, and movies off of showtime, hbo, etc; or is there some sort of admendment to the law about those devices?
Yes, they are referred to as "Time Shifting Devices". In other words, you are allowed to record a broadcast for the sole purpose of viewing it at a later, more convenient time (hence the "time shifting" name).
You are not legally allowed to retain those recordings indefinitely.

Any questions on this can be answered by visiting the U.S. Copyright Office's website at: www.copyright.gov

ibookmobile007
01-17-2008, 08:14 AM
This forum is run by the RIAA?
Im not here to jump down your throat like some people have done.You never know who is running a forum, unless you live near that person and are friends or family.
There are several different authority figures that join forums on a daily basis.I can name off about 15 people that i personally referred to this site that are judges and police officers.Are they here to monitor this site?No they are here to seek knowledge about apple products.Would they let comments about what another member said when it came to burning illegal software,dvd's or anything of that spectrum?Depends on how they want to handle the situation(As i have been told that most of the time its a person that is just trying to learn how to do or just has learned how to do illegal burning of various products).They really look for the ones that like to "Big Ball" as i am told.Giving specific details on how to copy OS systems and major software and popular(But expensive)Games.

So for you asking is there any type of specific organization running the forum was probably a legitimate question.Who knows what is being ran, watched or even created by who on the internet anymore?
Like i said...Unless you know that person in the flesh....
Then they could be any sort of Government official.
And thats not a wild shot in the air,Thats the reality of the real world.

schweb
01-17-2008, 11:11 AM
So for you asking is there any type of specific organization running the forum was probably a legitimate question.Who knows what is being ran, watched or even created by who on the internet anymore?
Like i said...Unless you know that person in the flesh....
Then they could be any sort of Government official.
And thats not a wild shot in the air,Thats the reality of the real world.

Actually, it's no secret about who is running/owning the board. The information is in the footer of every page at Mac-Forums. :)

lancer674
03-02-2008, 02:34 PM
I am very curious about this subject, what's legal, what isn't. I have never been into ripping, etc. I'm pretty boring when it comes to this stuff. I have Netflix, buy a few Blu-ray disks here and there, listen to music on the radio to and from work. Have to work hard to get a few songs on my Nano so my wife can take it work with her because I don't use it.

So, if we have established that I can't even legally copy my own purchased DVD's for backups, here's my question. I have a Playstation 3, and I have noticed that sony has produced a DVR for it to be released first in Europe. This particular DVR records anything, DRM-free MPEG-2 and allows for transfer of media to other devices. I would think this would be illegal, but...

"We've talked to our legal department about it," said Bunting. "All we're doing is moving it out of PlayTV and to the cross-media bar as if it was any other recording. So hopefully users won't do stuff they shouldn't do with it.
"If I'm prohibited from getting the recording off and storing it somewhere else because some other dude is making money out of selling it, then I'd rather they brought the law in to catch those people," he added.

Now, this could all get scrapped, but they sure seem to think it's legal, and of course, Sony USA is looking into the possibility. What possible loop-hole could they have found to do such things?

Derek McNelly
03-19-2008, 04:05 PM
Yes, they are referred to as "Time Shifting Devices". In other words, you are allowed to record a broadcast for the sole purpose of viewing it at a later, more convenient time (hence the "time shifting" name).
You are not legally allowed to retain those recordings indefinitely.

The law is the law, and I'm not challenging it, but, technically, if you never finished watching a recorded broadcast, would it them be legal to retain until you've finished watching it?

Rambaud
03-24-2008, 07:36 AM
CD ripping is still illegal here in the UK - although that may change soon.

dauber
03-24-2008, 07:27 PM
Sorry to post to this thread so late...

As a holder of a BA in journalism who had to pass a fairly grueling media law course...to answer the question as to why it's okay to have a DVR: you are allowed to make recordings of broadcasts. HOWEVER -- and here's the part that nobody seems to know -- you're only legally allowed to have that copy for 30 days. Even the TiVo folks don't know that, as there's an option to keep the recordings "until I delete"!

BTW -- just telling the facts. I'm not saying I agree with the laws (i.e. you can't make backups for what you buy even though it's for your own use, etc.), but that's what the law is. Also makes me wonder if discussing speeding, jaywalking, etc., are also forbidden since those are illegal activities as well. :)

MaDDoG
04-12-2008, 08:36 PM
I think I'll make a bit by bit backup copy of this post for later viewing........

Nighthawk4
10-04-2008, 08:35 PM
Why is there a Google ad for software to rip from DVD to iPod at the top of this thread? :Confused:

cwa107
10-04-2008, 09:07 PM
Why is there a Google ad for software to rip from DVD to iPod at the top of this thread? :Confused:

Thanks for the head's up. We are looking into the matter.

PowerBookG4
10-04-2008, 10:40 PM
Why is there a Google ad for software to rip from DVD to iPod at the top of this thread? :Confused:

That is pretty ironic.