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schweb
04-28-2007, 11:06 PM
Until further notice, the Mac-Forums reputation system has been disabled. When we are ready to reactivate the system, we will post here to announce when that will occur.

We have taken these steps for several reasons:

- A growing issue with rep system abuse
- An unhealthy, obsessive focus that has started to build around the rep system
- An increasing problem with people leaving inappropriate feedback with the rep points

Overall the rep system has lost the innocence and altruistic purpose for which we instituted the program to begin with. Our hope is that temporarily removing the feature, it will give everyone time to adjust and allow the system to function as it was intended.

skye
04-28-2007, 11:08 PM
yeah that happens i guess.

good bye green dots!

eric
04-28-2007, 11:12 PM
+rep to schweb!

oh, wait...

dtravis7
04-28-2007, 11:21 PM
Schweb, I think you guys did the right thing for now. It was going a bit far and way too much focus put on the system. Good decision.

PowerBookG4
04-28-2007, 11:48 PM
I agree, I think the system is good gone as it is now.

although the screen looks a little funky with out the dots... we need to put something there. ;)

skye
04-28-2007, 11:51 PM
i just hope that post count and member since dates dont become something we measure validity of posts by

MacHeadCase
04-28-2007, 11:51 PM
I agree, I think the system is good gone as it is now.

although the screen looks a little funky with out the dots... we need to put something there. ;)


Yessss! 120 x 120 avatars! Yippee! :spook:

eric
04-28-2007, 11:54 PM
or subtitles! ;)

MacHeadCase
04-29-2007, 12:15 AM
Ooh! Yeah! http://www.mac-forums.com/forums/mac_images/images/icons/icon14.gif

narf1899
04-29-2007, 12:18 AM
if/when the rep comes back, will we all start fresh or pick up where we left off?

PapaNoHair
04-29-2007, 12:21 AM
How about a faux rep system? We could just design the number of green dots we each have - that way we could impress others!! hehehe

iKitten
04-29-2007, 12:45 AM
I won't miss the dots, but I enjoyed the little 'private' commentary! (I know Mods could see)

iRye
04-29-2007, 01:04 AM
I knew this was going to happen. However, can we have the post count system back? it seems so weird without lil' green dots

baggss
04-29-2007, 01:06 AM
The pst count is still on. The green dots were rep...

iRye
04-29-2007, 01:08 AM
Yes - but before MF had the Rep System, wasn't there some type of dots for post count? or have I lost my mind/had a kernel panic and need to be restarted?

eric
04-29-2007, 01:10 AM
your rep score was what determined how many green dots you had.

post count had nothing to do with it, and it's still lodged firmly between your location and your mac's specs. ;)

iRye
04-29-2007, 01:12 AM
*restarts*


;)

cwa107
04-29-2007, 01:18 AM
It should be interesting as to how the lack of the rep system impacts attitudes. If nothing else, it kept a lot of folks in check, which is why I was fond of it. I've said it before, I know, but this has got to be one of the friendliest forums I've ever frequented - and I think a lot of that can be attributed to the rep system. People wanted to have those green dots. It might have been nothing more than psychological, but you saw very little flaming - especially of noobs, asking questions that had been asked time and again.

I know a lot of people get aggravated by that, but there's nothing more unwelcoming for a new member than to be shot down when asking your very first question - even if you unintentionally committed a faux pas by not searching first. I truly hope our normal sense of community lives on without the rep system.

Either way, I trust the mods on this forum to keep it a nice place to be - it is well moderated. I've always enjoyed my time here - even when I didn't know what the rep system was.

KoDorSean
04-29-2007, 01:23 AM
It should be interesting as to how the lack of the rep system impacts attitudes. If nothing else, it kept a lot of folks in check, which is why I was fond of it. I've said it before, I know, but this has got to be one of the friendliest forums I've ever frequented - and I think a lot of that can be attributed to the rep system. People wanted to have those green dots. It might have been nothing more than psychological, but you saw very little flaming - especially of noobs, asking questions that had been asked time and again.

I know a lot of people get aggravated by that, but there's nothing more unwelcoming for a new member than to be shot down when asking your very first question - even if you unintentionally committed a faux pas by not searching first. I truly hope our normal sense of community lives on without the rep system.

Either way, I trust the mods on this forum to keep it a nice place to be - it is well moderated. I've always enjoyed my time here - even when I didn't know what the rep system was.


you have a great point.. It will be interesting to see if that "friendly forum" attitude will last.

eric
04-29-2007, 01:25 AM
+virtual rep cwa.

brilliant as always.

Kash
04-29-2007, 01:44 AM
I totally agree with cwa. I know that I've bit my tongue on many occasions because I didn't want negative rep, and I'm sure I'm not the only one who did the same. With the system gone, now the only thing we have to worry about it violating rules as there is nothing preventing us from being anything less than nice. I personally hope it doesn't turn out that way, as then the mods will have more work on their hands (especially since there is always that one member who you can't ban but is a royal pain in the behind).

At least this explains why my rep comments disappeared. For a second I thought my points had been wiped because I had said something stupid ;)

puaerotch
04-29-2007, 01:53 AM
+virtual rep cwa.

Can we disable the so called "virtual rep" too? I think that's a little more annoying than the real rep (which by my calculations was also virtual).

By the way, I'm not trying to single you out here eric, as I know you're not the only one that does it.

eric
04-29-2007, 01:56 AM
i think it's less annoying than saying huzzah!

;)

puaerotch
04-29-2007, 01:59 AM
i think it's less annoying than saying huzzah!

;)

Actually, I think that would be a great alternative. Can we have a filter that replaces "virtual rep" with "huzzah"? Huzzah to you eric for creating a better way of thanking people for their posts. :cool:

Fallooza
04-29-2007, 02:02 AM
so are we goin ta start judging people by the color of their eyes then? i also want ta say APPLE SUCKS!! in your face fanboys. go ahead and try ta neg rep me, i dare ya.

Kash
04-29-2007, 02:02 AM
I prefer Ba Zing!!

MaDDoG
04-29-2007, 02:19 AM
I liked getting rep points, but if its in the forums best interests, then I'm all for it....although now I will never quite get to 200.

dtravis7
04-29-2007, 02:38 AM
It should be interesting as to how the lack of the rep system impacts attitudes. If nothing else, it kept a lot of folks in check, which is why I was fond of it. I've said it before, I know, but this has got to be one of the friendliest forums I've ever frequented - and I think a lot of that can be attributed to the rep system. People wanted to have those green dots. It might have been nothing more than psychological, but you saw very little flaming - especially of noobs, asking questions that had been asked time and again.

I know a lot of people get aggravated by that, but there's nothing more unwelcoming for a new member than to be shot down when asking your very first question - even if you unintentionally committed a faux pas by not searching first. I truly hope our normal sense of community lives on without the rep system.

Either way, I trust the mods on this forum to keep it a nice place to be - it is well moderated. I've always enjoyed my time here - even when I didn't know what the rep system was.

Very well said as always CWA107 and my feelings exactly.

dtravis7
04-29-2007, 02:40 AM
so are we goin ta start judging people by the color of their eyes then? i also want ta say APPLE SUCKS!! in your face fanboys. go ahead and try ta neg rep me, i dare ya.

- - - - -REP100000X! Virtual of course! :spook:

Netty4mac
04-29-2007, 02:53 AM
:( I'm going to miss all my love notes.......Umm...I mean the rep system...

dtravis7
04-29-2007, 03:05 AM
:( I'm going to miss all my love notes.......Umm...I mean the rep system...

Well, people can always PM (Private Message) a few compliments from time to time! :spook:

Kash
04-29-2007, 03:05 AM
:( I'm going to miss all my love notes.......Umm...I mean the rep system...

You naughty girl you ;)

Netty4mac
04-29-2007, 03:08 AM
You naughty girl you ;)

Oh I'm not naughty... ;)


Well, people can always PM (Private Message) a few compliments from time to time! :spook:

:flower: :flower: :flower:

fleurya
04-29-2007, 03:49 AM
Wow, I didn't even notice until I read a thread mentioning it. I don't really look at the green dots.

yogi
04-29-2007, 04:50 AM
I feel naked. Lol, I think it's a good move for now, but it definitely reduces the incentive to post :-) .

Kilted1
04-29-2007, 05:28 AM
I know from being a mod on another unrelated site that Post counts and reputation systems are both used and abused by members trying to race up the post count charts by posting fluff. Or by getting mates to rep you up.
A clean system like this is much better. As for the advice you get and how good it is is up to you the advice taker to decide

Aptmunich
04-29-2007, 06:39 AM
If you really appreciate a comment or post, you can always PM that person or even just mention it in the thread to show your gratitude.

And if you notice any posts that are against forum rules you can inform the moderators by clicking the little ! button under a post.

BIG D 04
04-29-2007, 06:45 AM
I like Rep as I find it a nice little and very quick way of telling people of what you think of there post or the views they expressed.Obviously people will abuse it, but how about you keep Rep but don't display it to everyone (ie only viewable in the USER CP)

So that way members can give you Feedback on your Posts, while you remove any competition element from it.

dtravis7
04-29-2007, 06:55 AM
If you really appreciate a comment or post, you can always PM that person or even just mention it in the thread to show your gratitude.

And if you notice any posts that are against forum rules you can inform the moderators by clicking the little ! button under a post.

Very good point. That is what I used to do here before the Rep system and even since a few times. A PM (Private Message) works just fine and is even more personal.

schweb
04-29-2007, 08:33 AM
It should be interesting as to how the lack of the rep system impacts attitudes. If nothing else, it kept a lot of folks in check, which is why I was fond of it. I've said it before, I know, but this has got to be one of the friendliest forums I've ever frequented - and I think a lot of that can be attributed to the rep system. People wanted to have those green dots. It might have been nothing more than psychological, but you saw very little flaming - especially of noobs, asking questions that had been asked time and again.

I know a lot of people get aggravated by that, but there's nothing more unwelcoming for a new member than to be shot down when asking your very first question - even if you unintentionally committed a faux pas by not searching first. I truly hope our normal sense of community lives on without the rep system.

Either way, I trust the mods on this forum to keep it a nice place to be - it is well moderated. I've always enjoyed my time here - even when I didn't know what the rep system was.

Trust me, it will stay. This forum has been around much, much longer than the rep system and we have always maintained the friendly nature. I wouldn't worry about that. :)

We will continue to truly enforce all behavioral rules, if someone gets out of line, there will be consequences just as there always have been.

Long-time members here can attest that the same atmosphere existed before and after the rep system. That comfortable environment is a function of forum rules, moderation, and general membership attitude. That's why we get rid of the bad apples quickly ;)

The best thing you can do if you find someone who's not quite fitting in or is breaking the rules is to report the post so the mods can take some action.

schweb
04-29-2007, 08:38 AM
I like Rep as I find it a nice little and very quick way of telling people of what you think of there post or the views they expressed.Obviously people will abuse it, but how about you keep Rep but don't display it to everyone (ie only viewable in the USER CP)

So that way members can give you Feedback on your Posts, while you remove any competition element from it.

Are you reading our secret forum? ;)

The rep system is not necessarily gone for good. But there will most likely be some serious tweaking or changes before it is returned.

RNDdave
04-29-2007, 10:01 AM
This is the 3rd, maybe the 4th site I'm a member of that has a rep system that was abused and eventually the system has been taken away.

It's a real shame the system has had to be shelved for a while and it does seem a little strange to see the posts without the posters green dots, but I'm sure we'll get by. There are too many great people here for the lack of a few green dots to affect the friendliness of this great community.

It was nice to be able to leave a little thank you to those that have helped you and it was nice to be thanked for helping people, but to be honest I think the biggest advantage of the rep system was that for people like me that had been on sites that used rep system prior to joining Mac-Forums, you could see an answer from someone like MacHeadCase and feel fairly confident that based on the number of green pips under that user-name, they prob know their stuff and that the answer they provide is the one to try first.

BIG D 04
04-29-2007, 10:13 AM
Are you reading our secret forum? ;)

Possibly... *Evil Mr Burns Laugh*

http://images.blogthings.com/thesimpsonspersonalitytest/mr-burns.jpg

To be honest I think you are going to find it hard to moderate any element of the Site completely as there are numerous scenario's in which some one could spread messages of hate or just generally unacceptable behaviour on the site.

schweb
04-29-2007, 10:20 AM
To be honest I think you are going to find it hard to moderate any element of the Site completely as there are numerous scenario's in which some one could spread messages of hate or just generally unacceptable behaviour on the site.

Trust me, after doing this for over 4 years I know. ;)

MacHeadCase
04-29-2007, 10:22 AM
It should be interesting as to how the lack of the rep system impacts attitudes. If nothing else, it kept a lot of folks in check, which is why I was fond of it. I've said it before, I know, but this has got to be one of the friendliest forums I've ever frequented - and I think a lot of that can be attributed to the rep system. People wanted to have those green dots. It might have been nothing more than psychological, but you saw very little flaming - especially of noobs, asking questions that had been asked time and again.

I know a lot of people get aggravated by that, but there's nothing more unwelcoming for a new member than to be shot down when asking your very first question - even if you unintentionally committed a faux pas by not searching first. I truly hope our normal sense of community lives on without the rep system.

Either way, I trust the mods on this forum to keep it a nice place to be - it is well moderated. I've always enjoyed my time here - even when I didn't know what the rep system was.

How very true cwa! Another impact could be that some won't be willing to help as much do you think? Those that were rep-system oriented, I mean.

Anyway, we'll see how much (or little of) impact the abolishment of the rep system brings. But one thing is for sure, I sure as heck don't want this place to change for the worse.

Zoolook
04-29-2007, 11:33 AM
Until further notice, the Mac-Forums reputation system has been disabled. When we are ready to reactivate the system, we will post here to announce when that will occur.

We have taken these steps for several reasons:

- A growing issue with rep system abuse
- An unhealthy, obsessive focus that has started to build around the rep system
- An increasing problem with people leaving inappropriate feedback with the rep points

Overall the rep system has lost the innocence and altruistic purpose for which we instituted the program to begin with. Our hope is that temporarily removing the feature, it will give everyone time to adjust and allow the system to function as it was intended.

Fair enough, but would just like to make two points. Firstly, why not simply remove the people who are abusing the system, or are there so many people doing it that that's a problem?

Secondly, I think the rep system is what really makes this place as helpful and community oriented as it is. Getting good feedback that makes a tangible difference to your visible reputation is a great incentive to continue to be helpful and likewise knowing that you could get negative feedback if you're rude or sarcastic to someone, not just from them but from other members, is good reason not to if you care about how others see you.

It shouldn't be that way, people should just act accordingly anyway, but we all know that in reality people often need to incentives to stay in check. I hope you bring it back, perhaps with harsher consequences for leaving negative feedback or 'farming' rep points.

DistantHoller
04-29-2007, 11:38 AM
Im a newbie on this forum and I must say it seems to me it was a wise decision to remove the rep system. It had an elite glow around it wich I felt was not healthy. People need to be able to speak up and not be afraid of negative rep. (within the forum rules of course).

People will help each other without the rep system anyway, and if they don´t well... they where not good people to start with, just green dot farmers.

ibookclamman300
04-29-2007, 11:58 AM
yea half the negative feedback I have gotten didn't have a real reason behind it. I agree with his decision.

christm
04-29-2007, 01:14 PM
gd choice. but when u switch it back on is all our rep lost from before ?

iRye
04-29-2007, 01:24 PM
Yeah, I'll want my rep back thank you.

Imagine how long it would take for DB to get his points!

;)

schweb
04-29-2007, 05:31 PM
Just to be clear, I'm not expecting the atmosphere to change here because of the removal of the system.

Those around before the system will tell you it was the same community atmosphere as it was after we turned on rep points.

So far only those newer members who weren't here before rep points seem to be concerned about a change. Trust me, all will be well :)

An IMHO, if someone leaves or stops posting b/c the rep system is gone, they weren't a true member of the community anyway.

KoDorSean
04-29-2007, 05:44 PM
maybe all those people with 6+ bars of rep that had no personality will actually act like a person now. maybe their big heads will deflate a bit.

TheCustomer99
04-29-2007, 06:01 PM
maybe all those people with 6+ bars of rep that had no personality will actually act like a person now. maybe their big heads will deflate a bit.

LOL, well my big head hasn't deflated yet. I think it's a good move. It seems a little different around here now, but it's no reason to leave.

Cassifire
04-29-2007, 08:01 PM
Yeah, I'll want my rep back thank you.

Imagine how long it would take for DB to get his points!

;)

I think the whole rep thing was not a really good idea.

Like other's have said, a lot of negitive feedback was posted that didn't have a good reason. Plus, the system didn't really let you voice your opinion. Because if you did, you would get negative rep for it! I bet if the rep system was still enabled, I would get negative rep from someone who likes the rep system for this post, just because he/she didn't like my point of view!

A lot better this way, IMO. I had a LOT of negative rep because I spoke my mind, and a lot of times I got negative rep for people who didn't agree with me.

giulio
04-29-2007, 08:18 PM
- An increasing problem with people leaving inappropriate feedback with the rep points

I agree. Someone left me negative rep with only "Jebus Christ".
Hey. if you don't like what I have to say, pick an option:
a) mind your own business
b) take someone else's lord's name in vein
c) spell his name right

dtravis7
04-29-2007, 08:20 PM
Just to be clear, I'm not expecting the atmosphere to change here because of the removal of the system.

Those around before the system will tell you it was the same community atmosphere as it was after we turned on rep points.

So far only those newer members who weren't here before rep points seem to be concerned about a change. Trust me, all will be well :)

An IMHO, if someone leaves or stops posting b/c the rep system is gone, they weren't a true member of the community anyway.

VERY well said. I was here before the Rep. Agreed completely.

And I had maybe 8 or more green dots. Makes no difference to me. Same forums, same mods, same people. The dots were never a reason I stuck around.

TheCustomer99
04-29-2007, 08:22 PM
I spoke my mind a lot, and I never received negative rep. In fact, I never had negative rep, period. But using it as a weapon because you don't agree with someone had to be a contributing factor to disabling the system. I mean, how weak do you have to be at debating that the only comeback you can think of is giving someone a little red dot without your name and saying, "haha, I got you now"?

Cassifire
04-29-2007, 09:51 PM
I spoke my mind a lot, and I never received negative rep. In fact, I never had negative rep, period. But using it as a weapon because you don't agree with someone had to be a contributing factor to disabling the system. I mean, how weak do you have to be at debating that the only comeback you can think of is giving someone a little red dot without your name and saying, "haha, I got you now"?

You'd be surprised at how many times I got that...

Kash
04-29-2007, 09:56 PM
I spoke my mind a lot, and I never received negative rep. In fact, I never had negative rep, period. But using it as a weapon because you don't agree with someone had to be a contributing factor to disabling the system. I mean, how weak do you have to be at debating that the only comeback you can think of is giving someone a little red dot without your name and saying, "haha, I got you now"?

That is my only qualm with the system. I remember getting one or two negative reps and couldn't figure out why because the posts in question didn't seem like they deserved the neg rep :(

I think I liked the rep system more so when I first joined because it gave me an indicator of whether I was having a positive influence here. This was especially important as I had just switched to Macs and didn't really have a clue. But now with 800+ posts in just a few months and lots of rep points (not to mention 2 MOTM nominations), I no longer need the validation provided by the rep system.

Perhaps we can adapt my experience to the overhauled system. Just have a positive aspect to it, but leave it personal. So no more green dots, but let people be able to leave short comments that can be viewed in the Profile section. So newer members, or seasoned members such as mathogre, can gauge how they're doing on the forums.

moss918
04-29-2007, 10:43 PM
For the reasons Zoolook mentioned above I'd agree it's sad the system has to go, but really can't see it having a big impact. What's even sadder though is that people have abused it in the 1st place.

cwa107
04-29-2007, 11:06 PM
Just out of curiousity - what was the primary way people were abusing the system? Negative feedback where it was unwarranted? Conspiring to rep each other to build reputation points? Or was it just all of the sigs and threads asking for rep?

skye
04-29-2007, 11:54 PM
yeah same Q here. to me it didn't have a lot of abuse, and im a guy who came in and had to earn my 3 bars that i had.

im either oblivious to something or the rep system wasn't really that bad.

Reel1
04-29-2007, 11:57 PM
I think in the original post it mentioned an unhealthy obsession over the rep system..... Maybe its time to let the topic drop...... Just a thought :)

D3v1L80Y
04-30-2007, 12:15 AM
I think in the original post it mentioned an unhealthy obsession over the rep system..... Maybe its time to let the topic drop...... Just a thought :)
Exactly. The simple fact that this thread has continued for five pages now only reinforces that idea.
It is gone. In all likelihood, it will come back.
On the other hand, with people obsessing over it like this, that likelihood diminishes.

ToddG
04-30-2007, 09:54 AM
We had a rep system?

iKitten
04-30-2007, 09:59 AM
We had a rep system?
Remarkable consistency ~ LOL

Village Idiot
04-30-2007, 10:02 AM
I received positive rep from some one with "cruel" as the comment. It was in a post about my dog's ears being cropped. I don't see how that is not abuse of the rep system and just is a personal attack because some one think's I'm "cruel" to my animal...if I was cruel, I'd be using the dog for a punching bag and would have gotten one for free from the pound instead of paying a ton of money on the dog and it's care.

Also, giving people negative rep because they don't see eye to eye with you is garbage as well. It just start a whole retaliation thing and is unwarranted.

You're right about something and some one doesn't like the fact? You get negative rep. That's not a way to demonstrate which users are more useful when they're getting negative rep for good post...

giulio
04-30-2007, 10:09 AM
We should get rid of the rep system an put a better on in place. Where, only the original thread starter is allowed to give + points to people who helped him or her.

So that someone starts a thread asking a question. People reply with solutions. The questioner awards a point for the best answer.

Or even, only a moderator can award the point!

That would cut down on the BS.

Cassifire
04-30-2007, 03:46 PM
We should get rid of the rep system an put a better on in place. Where, only the original thread starter is allowed to give + points to people who helped him or her.

So that someone starts a thread asking a question. People reply with solutions. The questioner awards a point for the best answer.


Totally a good idea. This means people will try to be more helpful, and not be total jerks to newbies.

MacHeadCase
04-30-2007, 06:44 PM
Well that wouldn't totally work either IMO. Some members rarely start threads, so that means they wouldn't be able to rep?

Zoolook
04-30-2007, 06:55 PM
Well that wouldn't totally work either IMO. Some members rarely start threads, so that means they wouldn't be able to rep?

Not only that... many come in, ask a question, get and answer and vanish forever.

I think a better system would be that at least two users have to give positive or negative rep for the same post for it to count.

narf1899
04-30-2007, 06:58 PM
yea...MHC has a good point....maybe we could make it so that two people have to give positive/negative rep on a post for it to count...therefore only the really helpful posts wud get positive rep and those annoying ppl who give negative rep for no reason wouldnt actually have any say.

narf1899
04-30-2007, 06:59 PM
Not only that... many come in, ask a question, get and answer and vanish forever.

I think a better system would be that at least two users have to give positive or negative rep for the same post for it to count.

i swear that post wasn't there when i was typing mine...well hey, great minds think alike i guess :black:

Flic
04-30-2007, 07:54 PM
Just thought I'd chip in with my opinion as a bit of a newbie on the scene! I liked the rep system, not for the 'points' as it were, but it was nice just to get a little note from a member saying they appreciated your post or thanking you for something. It's one of the reasons I felt so welcome here so fast and got to know some of the members! I know it's easy to send a PM, but the lil pop up box was much quicker for a small note like that.

moss918
05-01-2007, 05:17 AM
Just to add another (Probably unwanted...) suggestion: As Flic said it's nice to get a bit of feedback so why not forget the rep system and have a feedback system - Exactly the same as the rep system but without the rep, just a way to tell someone what you thought of their post.

giulio
05-01-2007, 12:53 PM
A feedback only system would be cool. But then imagine if you were to add point-values to the feed back. HOW COOL!

iKitten
05-01-2007, 01:12 PM
I'll jump on the feedback-only wagon! I miss giving/receiving the commentary (not the rep points).

ToddG
05-01-2007, 01:41 PM
The feedback-only option, if it's possible, would certainly be nice. However, it is going to be subject to the same abuse that seems to have killed the rep system in the first place. Eventually, someone is going to "send feedback" that hurts a poster's feelings or uses a bad word or otherwise violates one of the many strict behavioral controls that exist here.

BIG D 04
05-01-2007, 02:07 PM
I posted this Idea, two pages back and did anyone say what a Great Idea....Noooo. Only got a smart remark from schweb. Now I'm not one to jump to conclusions but is it because I eat Ham Sandwich in Mosque with my Shoes on, facing the wrong way and reading a BNP Leaflet about Immigration Controls?

See now this would be the perfect time to give Bad Feedback, because my jokes suck.

Aptmunich
05-01-2007, 02:08 PM
The feedback-only option, if it's possible, would certainly be nice. However, it is going to be subject to the same abuse that seems to have killed the rep system in the first place. Eventually, someone is going to "send feedback" that hurts a poster's feelings or uses a bad word or otherwise violates one of the many strict behavioral controls that exist here.


Strict behavioral controls? Don't you think that's a bit misleading?

Sure this forum has rules and they are actively enforced, but as long as a discussion is conducted in a respectful manner, we can talk about anything!

Flic
05-01-2007, 02:14 PM
I posted this Idea, two pages back and did anyone say what a Great Idea....Noooo. Only got a smart remark from schweb. Now I'm not one to jump to conclusions but is it because I eat Ham Sandwich in Mosque with my Shoes on, facing the wrong way and reading a BNP Leaflet about Immigration Controls?

See now this would be the perfect time to give Bad Feedback, because my jokes suck.

I'm sorry. In retrospect i should have quoted you! I saw your idea and was merely giving my opinion and seconding yours at the same time :confused:

However, your jokes do suck ;) -Huzzah!

iKitten
05-01-2007, 03:31 PM
I like Rep as I find it a nice little and very quick way of telling people of what you think of there post or the views they expressed.Obviously people will abuse it, but how about you keep Rep but don't display it to everyone (ie only viewable in the USER CP)

So that way members can give you Feedback on your Posts, while you remove any competition element from it.

WOW - What a terrific idea!!! :flower: :o :black:


I posted this Idea, two pages back and did anyone say what a Great Idea....Noooo. Only got a smart remark from schweb.

Sorry, Big D. When I read "keep Rep but don't display" for some reason it did not translate into "feedback only!" LOL

ToddG
05-01-2007, 04:09 PM
Strict behavioral controls? Don't you think that's a bit misleading?

Nope, wouldn't have said it if I thought it was misleading. I'm happy to discuss it with you by PM, as there is probably little benefit to getting into a debate about it here.

And in the end, it's your sandbox, not mine. :batman:

PapaNoHair
05-01-2007, 04:42 PM
I wonder what will come first: a new, revised Rep system......or new, revised smilies?? :dive:

giulio
05-01-2007, 05:02 PM
I hate the smilies here. And you zeleots cannot give me neg rep for saying so. HAHA =)

Kash
05-01-2007, 05:05 PM
I totally agree. No neg rep, instead: huzzah!!

We need some more smilies. How is there no smilie for this: :P

schweb
05-01-2007, 06:15 PM
I totally agree. No neg rep, instead: huzzah!!

We need some more smilies. How is there no smilie for this: :P

They're coming.... ;)

iKitten
05-01-2007, 06:16 PM
There was talk of new smilies...
http://www.mac-forums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=55024&page=4&highlight=smilies

edit: too slow again! *snaps fingers*

Kash
05-01-2007, 06:19 PM
It's sad, I'm feeling the lack of a reputation system already. Looks like removing the threat of public reprimanding has gotten some members to really cut loose, which isn't exactly a good thing...

KoDorSean
05-01-2007, 06:20 PM
It's sad, I'm feeling the lack of a reputation system already. Looks like removing the threat of public reprimanding has gotten some members to really cut loose, which isn't exactly a good thing...

You hit the nail on the head.. this place is changing and NOT for the better.

ToddG
05-01-2007, 06:27 PM
OK, OK, stop complaining. I'll put my pants back on.

schweb
05-01-2007, 06:28 PM
You hit the nail on the head.. this place is changing and NOT for the better.

This has nothing to do with the rep system. This behavior existed before the system was taken away.

You are all being a little too sensitive to this and are placing a focus where the focus should not be. Trust me, cycles of rudeness have always flared up, rep system or no rep system.

Again...the long-term members can validate that for you, I'm sure we can think of several times in the past where there was a good deal of rudeness.

Simply report the posts and let the mods get things back under control. :tusks:

ToddG
05-01-2007, 06:30 PM
FWIW, I've only been here six months but except for the "rep system is gone" jokes, I don't see anything different.

KoDorSean
05-01-2007, 06:33 PM
This has nothing to do with the rep system. This behavior existed before the system was taken away.

You are all being a little too sensitive to this and are placing a focus where the focus should not be. Trust me, cycles of rudeness have always flared up, rep system or no rep system.

Again...the long-term members can validate that for you, I'm sure we can think of several times in the past where there was a good deal of rudeness.

Simply report the posts and let the mods get things back under control. :tusks:

It could very well just be a fluke.. It just seems weird to me that one day after the rep system goes bye bye a few users start acting like children.

schweb
05-01-2007, 06:35 PM
It could very well just be a fluke.. It just seems weird to me that one day after the rep system goes bye bye a few users start acting like children.

Personally I just think you are WAAAAAY overreacting to every little thing now that the rep system is gone. Rather than complain every time you see someone being rude and saying it's because the rep system is gone, report the post and wait over the long-term to see if it truly does change.

But proclaiming, after only one day, that "things are changing and not for the better" is a little pre-mature and shows a lack of analysis and foresight.

Flic
05-01-2007, 06:41 PM
It's like when you eat something and pull a face, it's going to taste bad! So my mother says anyways.... If you think the rep system being disabled is going to cause massive repercussions then it will make you pick at every situation and blame the green blobbies!

Sooo, smile and sprouts will taste better and don't place so much blame on the Rep system for members acting up. Or something like that.

Hmm... the (tenuous) link there made much more sense in my head! Forgive me I am sleep deprived.

iRye
05-01-2007, 06:44 PM
Personally I just think you are WAAAAAY overreacting to every little thing now that the rep system is gone. Rather than complain every time you see someone being rude and saying it's because the rep system is gone, report the post and wait over the long-term to see if it truly does change.

But proclaiming, after only one day, that "things are changing and not for the better" is a little pre-mature and shows a lack of analysis and foresight.

+Rep


You rock Schweb!

surfwax95
05-01-2007, 06:46 PM
We had a rep system?

KoDorSean
05-01-2007, 06:55 PM
Personally I just think you are WAAAAAY overreacting to every little thing now that the rep system is gone. Rather than complain every time you see someone being rude and saying it's because the rep system is gone, report the post and wait over the long-term to see if it truly does change.

But proclaiming, after only one day, that "things are changing and not for the better" is a little pre-mature and shows a lack of analysis and foresight.

I have seen users in the last few days bend/break more rules than I ever have in the few months I have been around. Is it it possible its just a fluke? of course it is.. I just think its ironic that after it leaves everyone starts acting up.. I am not trying to offend you or upset you.. My comment was out of line. The main "change" that I saw was delt with.

Kash
05-01-2007, 07:20 PM
I definitely realize that sites have flare ups every couple of months, so I'm hoping this one is just that. I absolutely love this site, so I wouldn't want myself or others to be deterred because of some bad apples (is that a pun? ;))

schweb
05-01-2007, 07:28 PM
I can probably guarantee you all those who you think were breaking the rules because the rep system was gone, would have done so anyway. As a matter of fact, I can probably find some posts from them demonstrating the same behavior from before the rep system was turned off.

I guess my main point is don't proclaim the doom of Mac-Forums after one day of the system being taken away. It will be fine...trust us. :)

Cassifire
05-01-2007, 07:37 PM
I can probably guarantee you all those who you think were breaking the rules because the rep system was gone, would have done so anyway. As a matter of fact, I can probably find some posts from them demonstrating the same behavior from before the rep system was turned off.

I guess my main point is don't proclaim the doom of Mac-Forums after one day of the system being taken away. It will be fine...trust us. :)

One more reason to get new smilies....I don't trust that red one. :p

ToddG
05-01-2007, 07:48 PM
We had a rep system?

That's what I said!

ToddG
05-01-2007, 07:50 PM
I guess my main point is don't proclaim the doom of Mac-Forums after one day of the system being taken away.

But it's been three days!

DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM!

The Mods nerfed Rep!

DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM!!!!1!!!!eleven!!11!

cjay
05-01-2007, 11:13 PM
For a long time I didn't even know what the green dots were.

skye
05-01-2007, 11:39 PM
The smiles are awesomely uniquely pointless though!

coach_z
05-01-2007, 11:39 PM
ITS THE END OF THE WORLD!!!!!!!!!

-chris

ToddG
05-02-2007, 12:20 AM
I feel fine.

dtravis7
05-02-2007, 02:17 AM
This has nothing to do with the rep system. This behavior existed before the system was taken away.

You are all being a little too sensitive to this and are placing a focus where the focus should not be. Trust me, cycles of rudeness have always flared up, rep system or no rep system.

Again...the long-term members can validate that for you, I'm sure we can think of several times in the past where there was a good deal of rudeness.

Simply report the posts and let the mods get things back under control. :tusks:

Agreed totally. As one fairly long timer here Schweb is correct. For one thing the Rep system never stopped the Trolls and that is what I have seen that I think you are talking about. Only reporting bad posts to a MOD can help stop that. Bad people come and go on any forum and not just here. It comes in cycles like Schweb is saying. Just report any offensive, Troll, bashing and arguing posts to a MOD and it will be taken care of.

moss918
05-02-2007, 05:23 AM
The feedback-only option, if it's possible, would certainly be nice. However, it is going to be subject to the same abuse that seems to have killed the rep system in the first place. Eventually, someone is going to "send feedback" that hurts a poster's feelings or uses a bad word or otherwise violates one of the many strict behavioral controls that exist here.

I'm pretty sure that unwelcome comments would be sent at some point but these can simply be treated in the same manner as if they were posted in a thread or PM. At least with a feedback system we can keep the positives of the rep system without the competition and "farming".

Cassifire
05-02-2007, 06:51 PM
Hey, I see green bars again.... and the rep button.

Stretch
05-02-2007, 06:53 PM
Yep, and rep is back up in the user profile.

schweb
05-02-2007, 06:55 PM
Yep, and rep is back up in the user profile.

Call it a test ;)

MinaMACMan
05-02-2007, 06:55 PM
Sweet, welcome back to Virtual reps :D

Cassifire
05-02-2007, 07:01 PM
Now let's all go rep-crazy. (I'm in desperate need of some :p)

baggss
05-02-2007, 07:15 PM
oooohhhhh, I see they opted to use the term "suspended". NICE! Makes things much more clear that way. Props schweb.

schweb
05-02-2007, 07:17 PM
oooohhhhh, I see they opted to use the term "suspended". NICE! Makes things much more clear that way. Props schweb.

See...it was your constant pester...um I mean perseverance that got us to change ;).

baggss
05-02-2007, 07:18 PM
Proof that the system works or that I am a PITA? You decide!

iKitten
05-02-2007, 07:23 PM
It felt really weird without rep. Like having someone take away your coat on a windy day!

mikeyman
05-03-2007, 11:58 AM
I quite liked the no rep
Although its good to see what people think of your posts

schweb
05-05-2007, 08:31 AM
Just to point out, without using names, there are a few members who continue to focus on the rep system, even if it is tongue-in-cheek.

Please realize that those posts could bring us back to the point of needing to remove the system as they could easily be a catalyst to take us down the path that ruined it the first time.

If you're one of these people, please stop.

ToddG
05-05-2007, 12:45 PM
Is this why my post in the MOTM poll thread was deleted?

You put a rep system in, want people to use it, but we cannot speak of it. Because talking about it makes it bad.

Dear Aptmunich: this is what I meant by strict behavioral controls. (http://www.mac-forums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=384281&postcount=80)

You guys have fun, I think I'm going to switch back to Windows. :Angry-Tongue:

Carol247
05-05-2007, 01:05 PM
Well, it looks like I chose a good time to go on vacation! Rep system left and returned while I was gone.

Just read all the comments. I'm surprised how important green dots and feedback can be. Wow!!

Way to go Schweb! Nice test. ;D

schweb
05-05-2007, 01:45 PM
You put a rep system in, want people to use it, but we cannot speak of it. Because talking about it makes it bad.

No, that's not at all what I'm saying. If you honestly cannot understand the difference between normal conversation about the rep system and continued, unhealthy focus, then there's not much I can do for you. While you may think it's all a joke, newer members won't realize that and will simply begin the bad habits the ruined the system the first time.

And to answer your question, yes, that's why your post was removed. Unfortunately, it can take only a few people to ruin it for the many. If you find the way we handle things as "strict behavioral control" there are many other forums out there that my be better suited to you.

We are careful about the way things run here, and because of that, we are able to create a unique environment that is enjoyed by over 14,000 members. However, that type of community won't be right for everyone.