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View Full Version : Old MacPro is Gone!



RavingMac
11-06-2013, 07:20 PM
Has been removed from the Apple Store. Only available is the New MacPro listed as coming in December, and no refurbs in the clearance store either.

chscag
11-06-2013, 08:16 PM
And I'm betting the used market for the older Mac Pros are going to either dry up fairly fast or inflate +++++ = $$ I don't know about you, but the new Mac Pro does nothing for me.

pigoo3
11-06-2013, 08:45 PM
Very strange & interesting at the same time!;)

- Nick

p.s. We do seem to get a little more configuration info.:)

Exodist
11-07-2013, 12:15 PM
I am very interested in seeing how the market takes to them.

On one hand I really like them, powerful and compact. The other lack of customization means that not every Mac is built to one taste.. Then again, they haven't put them up on the store website for purchase yet. I would love to see a model with one video card leaving room for a extra HDD for disk space.

What I can't phantom though, is the small hard drives. If one needs a powerful workstation, that means that person is crunching large amounts of data. 256GB SSD is to small.. Base Model should be 1TB IMHO.. Even if it has to be a 7200RPM HDD.

VAMountaineer
11-11-2013, 01:20 PM
I am very interested in seeing how the market takes to them.

On one hand I really like them, powerful and compact. The other lack of customization means that not every Mac is built to one taste.. Then again, they haven't put them up on the store website for purchase yet. I would love to see a model with one video card leaving room for a extra HDD for disk space.

What I can't phantom though, is the small hard drives. If one needs a powerful workstation, that means that person is crunching large amounts of data. 256GB SSD is to small.. Base Model should be 1TB IMHO.. Even if it has to be a 7200RPM HDD.

Buy a thunderbolt external case and put a 10k drive in it.

dtravis7
11-11-2013, 03:24 PM
Yes buy a bunch of externals. Not to sound mean but that reminds me of my maxed out Atari 8-Bit with drives all over my desk and everything plugged into the SIO Bus. A Mess of cables and cases. It's sad we seem to be coming back to that sort of mess! :D Grin

VAMountaineer
11-11-2013, 08:22 PM
Yes buy a bunch of externals. Not to sound mean but that reminds me of my maxed out Atari 8-Bit with drives all over my desk and everything plugged into the SIO Bus. A Mess of cables and cases. It's sad we seem to be coming back to that sort of mess! :D Grin


agreed.. personally I detest the addition of multiple external power supplies (ie., inbred failure points), but from Apple's perspective, this is the absolute best way to soak the faithful for their money... They get the tax on the initial item, then bump you additionally for every additional item you buy

Thunderbolt cable? $30 for a $1.19 cable)..
cute boxy thingy with apple logo and 500gb drive? $200 markup over competition...
etc etc...

I call it the apple tax - they're finding new and creative ways to separate the gullible from their money.

TattooedMac
11-11-2013, 08:40 PM
I really don't know what the hoopla haa is all about. Remember this MacPro v=can daisy chain unto 3 4K or 6 Thunderbolt monitors and that alone is some hell of a lot of pawer. There is NOTHING out there at the moment (yes even Alienware) that comes close to it, and Apple say this will last you 10yrs.
Yea the 256GB SSD isn't a lot, but honestly for the price they are asking for the base model, buy more.
I love the new Mac Pro and if i was in the market for a Desktop i would probably look at one considering that they are only 1K more than the top range iMac.
Everyone is about customisation these days, but you would be silly not to get extended warranty with it though. . .
#givemeone

Exodist
12-06-2013, 10:30 AM
Buy a thunderbolt external case and put a 10k drive in it.

Buying a 4000 dollar machine then having to buy a 500 dollar external storage solution is a slap in the face to consumers. This move all together seems contradictory to the all-in-one solutions such as the iMac we have been seeing for the past decade. Now to stop that and head back into making things modular, just seems like a step back. All this because they couldn't find room for a 2.5" HDD in the case.. Sad.. There is actually a lot of wasted space in the new Mac Pro that could have been done better.


Speaking of which.. Its now Dec 6th, isn't they supposed to start selling by now??

chscag
12-06-2013, 03:54 PM
Speaking of which.. Its now Dec 6th, isn't they supposed to start selling by now??

Should be soon. Apple did announce it would be released for sale in December, however, they did not give a specific date. Latest issue of MacWorld has an interesting article about the new Mac Pro on page 14 (Jan 2014 issue). The entry level Mac Pro is $2999 while the better unit will sell for $3999. Both of those prices are before you add options which are needed like a hard drive! ;P

Exodist
12-06-2013, 11:14 PM
Yea I was reading on that... The 2999 entry level workstation I guess you can call it. Would be down right perfect for me. Except it just chaps my rear end to think I would have to buy a hugely expensive ($200 or more) thunderbolt enclosure just to put a cheap *** 40 dollar 1TB hard drive when it should have been in the mac pro to start with. :( /angry birds...

chscag
12-06-2013, 11:17 PM
It's like buying a brand new Mercedes Benz for $45,000 only to find out that you have to pay extra for the engine which is not included. ;P

Thymen
12-16-2013, 05:29 AM
It's like buying a brand new Mercedes Benz for $45,000 only to find out that you have to pay extra for the engine which is not included. ;P

Engine available at twice the price of the car….but you DO get the promise that there will be lots and lots of aftermarket engines to pick from very soon…..

Yeah, right…. another Thunderbolt promise. I am still waiting for the market to be flooded with peripherals for that…

chas_m
12-16-2013, 06:22 AM
And I'm betting the used market for the older Mac Pros are going to either dry up fairly fast or inflate +++++ = $$ I don't know about you, but the new Mac Pro does nothing for me.

Since you haven't tested it in any fashion, you might just possibly be jumping to conclusions a wee bit. Why not wait and see what, for example, Tom's Hardware or Ars Technica have to say?

I'm not the target demographic for the new (or old) Mac Pro anymore, but to me it looks like a beast for the kinds of work I used to do. And cheaper than they used to be as well.

PS. "Old" Mac Pros currently on the refurb site.

Exodist
12-16-2013, 09:23 PM
My only real complaint is that while the base model looks priced really good for what your getting. Its that I then have to spend $499 USD for a stinking TB2 external RAID enclosure to have speedy and redundent drives for my photos. RAW files take up space 40-50MB each! Couple of thousand per shoot and bam, full drive!


But then again. I am thinking about getting that Western Digital TB2 8TB RAID system for my Mac Mini.. Guess that makes my point mute.. :-(

chscag
12-16-2013, 09:26 PM
It doesn't matter whether I test it or not. I will probably never buy a Mac Pro, and since I just recently purchased a new 2013 27" iMac that reenforces what I stated.


PS. "Old" Mac Pros currently on the refurb site.

Nice to know for those who are looking for a Mac Pro but not interested in buying the new model. Thanks for posting.

smb
12-18-2013, 10:54 PM
Well I guess it will be on the "shelves" tomorrow.
Sold my old Mac Pro (3.1) but went with the iMac 27" as the new MPro was more than I needed or wanted to spend.
I think that was Apple's intention though; shrink the demographic for the new Mpro.

RavingMac
12-19-2013, 09:18 AM
For the heck of it I configured a new Mac Pro as I would buy it (if I were currently in the market) and it priced out at $3899 for the base model upgraded to 16GB Ram and 1TB Flash Drive.
Not cheap, but not totally out of range either.
Still, I would be more inclined to pickup a refurb 2012 Pro and upgrade it to suit me.

smb
12-19-2013, 09:33 AM
$3899 for the base model upgraded to 16GB Ram and 1TB Flash Drive.


Is that with a display? Add another 1k.

RavingMac
12-19-2013, 10:01 AM
Is that with a display? Add another 1k.

Don't need a display, but if going for the 4K model add another $3600

smb
12-19-2013, 06:52 PM
I was just thinking about pricing it out for myself. The 27" Mac display is I believe 1k.
None the less more than I need to spent for what I do.
Some reports of delivery pushed back until Feb.

Exodist
12-20-2013, 05:26 AM
For the heck of it I configured a new Mac Pro as I would buy it (if I were currently in the market) and it priced out at $3899 for the base model upgraded to 16GB Ram and 1TB Flash Drive.
Not cheap, but not totally out of range either.
Still, I would be more inclined to pickup a refurb 2012 Pro and upgrade it to suit me.

I did similar as well a few hours ago. $3399.00USD, 3.7 QuadCore, 16GB RAM, 512GB FS and rest stock base model.

But then again, waiting to see what the new Mac Minis bring in about 6 months.. Mac Pro seems overkill for photography and web surfing.. LOL

RavingMac
12-20-2013, 10:28 AM
I did similar as well a few hours ago. $3399.00USD, 3.7 QuadCore, 16GB RAM, 512GB FS and rest stock base model.

But then again, waiting to see what the new Mac Minis bring in about 6 months.. Mac Pro seems overkill for photography and web surfing.. LOL

I have been wanting a Pro, but decide it didn't make sense for my applications (same as yours). My 2012 model MBP will be serving double duty as laptop and desktop.

1) Wallmounted 27 in Monitor on swing arm next to my recliner (already done)
2) Book Arc stand for MBP (planned purchase)
3) Wireless Keyboard and Trackpad (already have)
4) 1 TB M500 Crucial SSD (planned purchase)
5) 16GB RAM upgrade (planned purchase)
6) NAS (already have)
7) Mac Mini network server (already have)
8) 3TB USB 3.0 HD attached to Mini for remote storage (already have)
9) And, of course, several external HDs for backups

I figure this will take care of me for several years to come

TattooedMac
12-21-2013, 01:14 AM
Well it looks like things are getting overloaded at Apple with the new Mac Pro (Built in the US isn't it ?? From memory) Anyways, only a few hours after going on sale, the date went from Dec 30 2013 to February 2014 sometime. I think they might have underestimated the popularity of the product, and i say a **Good up yours** to all those that thought this was a deal breaker for Apple. I love it, and still say, anything that can daisy chain (3/4/5??) 4K monitors is Grunt waiting to get out. What gets me upset is, they have lanched 10.1 for FCP X to show off the Mac Pro performance (https://itunes.apple.com/au/app/final-cut-pro/id424389933?mt=12), but nothing about a new Aperture :(
Here is the story anyways . . Apple’s Mac Pro ship date quickly slips to February 2014: Smacks of the iMac fiasco of 2012 (http://macdailynews.com/2013/12/19/apples-mac-pro-ship-date-quickly-slips-to-february-2014-smacks-of-the-imac-fiasco-of-2012/)


“The Mac Pro situation smelled a bit like the iMac debacle in late 2012, when Apple announced the redesigned desktop, but then took weeks to deliver orders,” Keizer reports. “[Apple CEO] Cook ended up regretting the hasty iMac introduction, which was a major cause of a 22% decline in Mac revenue in 2012′s fourth quarter compared to the same period the year before.

Exodist
12-21-2013, 09:39 AM
I have been wanting a Pro, but decide it didn't make sense for my applications (same as yours). My 2012 model MBP will be serving double duty as laptop and desktop.
......

I figure this will take care of me for several years to come

I have been considering a 13" MBP as a dual purpose as well. Desktop use at home on a bookshelf stand, then as a mobile solution when on the go. I have a iPad Mini currently as my mobile solution, which does what I want. But also depend on the futures on Mac Minis. So many options.

Exodist
12-21-2013, 09:43 AM
W........ but nothing about a new Aperture :(
..........

I am not sure why Apple hasn't updated Aperture, it needs a major overhaul and update. This sadly is why I am using Lightroom.

chas_m
12-22-2013, 01:57 AM
They'll get to Aperture. You don't really need a Mac Pro if your primary app is Aperture. You might need one if your moneymaker is Photoshop. :)

As for the February date, I'm always amazed at what short memories Mac people seem to have. The iPhone 5s got hit with a wave of popularity, few to be had on launch and delivery pushed back (in October) to December and then just (no date) ... ie they weren't sure they could make December!

Come December oh look they're everywhere.

Same thing will happen with the Mac Pro ... wait a couple of weeks and you'll see the ship times drop back down in stages ... guaranteed.

Exodist
12-22-2013, 03:29 AM
They'll get to Aperture. You don't really need a Mac Pro if your primary app is Aperture. You might need one if your moneymaker is Photoshop. :)

I wouldn't even go that far to say Photoshop. Although it will utilize your systems video card, still not all the functions in PS do and the ones that do are still don't use it to the fullest. I would be more inclined to say a good iMac with a top of the line mobile video chipset.

Now what would use a Mac Pro to the fullest is say CAD programs like Solidworks, or software used for number crunching for SETI or Medical Platforms. And let me not forget the mass of the market for the new Mac Pro would be video editors without a doubt.

Then again, it depends on how patient the user is and if its a business were does productivity and development cost meet.

My personal stand point based on todays current Mac desktop models:


Mac Mini - Photography, Moderate graphics design and occasional video editing.

iMac - Commercial Photography, commercial graphics design, moderate video editing.

Mac Pro - Commercial Video Editing and Production, 3D Modeling/CAD and model simulation, Number Crunching for Medical and Stellar Research.


EDIT:
After posting this I realized. Apple doesn't have any "real" servers. They sell the Mac Mini as a server platform, but it isn't. Although it doesn't take much of a CPU these days to be a server, it lacks the ability to hot swap disk drives and it doesn't offer the data integrity(error bit checking)that a Xeon based server system would. This was a nich that the Mac Pro was covering. But no one wants dual video cards in a modern server. So were does apple go from here with a server platform. Could they offer a Xeon based Mini without disk drives allowing one to purchase a RAID system separately? Or could they sell a Mac Pro in the futures with a low end video card and internal Flash storage running in RAID mirroring?

infocusinc
12-24-2013, 11:18 AM
I

iMac - Commercial Photography, commercial graphics design, moderate video editing.



While the iMac is a great machine, the monitor leaves a lot to be desired for anyone using it for critical color work like Commercial Photography. It can't hold a candle to the standards for critical color, like NEC and Eizo.

For that reason alone I eliminate any Imac as a production machine for photography where critical color is important.

dtravis7
12-24-2013, 11:30 AM
Um, you should read Anandtech's review on the new 21.5" iMacs display. DEAD ON with no calibration needed. Superb in fact. Both Anand and his partner were knocked out.

infocusinc
12-24-2013, 12:08 PM
Um, you should read Anandtech's review on the new 21.5" iMacs display. DEAD ON with no calibration needed. Superb in fact. Both Anand and his partner were knocked out.

Uh, I have.

Dead on to WHAT exactly?

Calibration changes over time and needed to be redone on a regular schedule. In addition, critical color requires different calibration points for different needs. For example a pre-press calibration is different than a web delivery calibration which is also different from a print matching calibration. Finally proper calibration needs to be done at the monitor lever rather than done with the graphic card LUT's. This is not possible with the iMac.

And calibration is not simply color but its properly controlled luminance as well, yet another iMac weakness.

The iMac is a nice machine, but its not even close when it comes to critical color.

dtravis7
12-24-2013, 12:15 PM
Use whatever makes you happy. The review covers more than just one test on the display. I just did not want people thinking it was not an accurate display and not purchasing due to that.

infocusinc
12-24-2013, 12:57 PM
Sorry you disagree with the review. Anand knows his stuff. Few disagree but I guess you do. Use whatever makes you happy.


You really failed to read and comprehend my reply. Oh well. Anand showed you ONE point of calibration to ONE standard. I don't disagree with this other than it's totally useless in the world of critical color, which was and still is my point.

If your color needs are pedestrian, then perhaps an iMac will suit you.

pigoo3
12-24-2013, 01:12 PM
If your color needs are pedestrian, then perhaps an iMac will suit you.

This is probably taking things a bit too far. To say that the color calibration on newer iMac displays is "pedestrian" might be a bit harsh. If we were talking about some sort of "el cheapo"...$150...off-brand display from Walmart...I would agree.:)

Maybe the color calibration on newer iMac's isn't up to the standards you need (which is perfectly fine and understandable)...but to say that the color calibration is pedestrian might be over-stating things a bit.. I'm sure that the Anandtech's review "dtravis7" referred to has some truths to it...since those reviews are always very technical, well written, and objectively assessed.

- Nick

infocusinc
12-24-2013, 01:26 PM
This is probably taking things a bit too far. To say that the color calibration on newer iMac displays is "pedestrian" might be a bit harsh. If we were talking about some sort of "el cheapo"...$150...off-brand display from Walmart...I would agree.:)

Maybe the color calibration on newer iMac's isn't up to the standards you need (which is perfectly fine and understandable)...but to say that the color calibration is pedestrian might be over-stating things a bit.. I'm sure that the Anandtech's review "dtravis7" referred to has some truths to it...since those reviews are always very technical, well written, and objectively assessed.

- Nick

No I hit the nail directly on the head in the CONTEXT of my original post.

BTW I did not call the the calibration of the monitor "pedestian". Lets review:
"If your color needs are pedestrian, then perhaps an iMac will suit you."

pigoo3
12-24-2013, 01:32 PM
BTW I did not call the the calibration of the monitor "pedestian". Lets review:
"If your color needs are pedestrian, then perhaps an iMac will suit you."

What I'm REALLY trying to say is...please dial-down the "snarkiness". We like to keep things friendly.:)

Thanks,

- Nick

infocusinc
12-24-2013, 01:42 PM
What I'm REALLY trying to say is...please dial-down the "snarkiness". We like to keep things friendly.:)

Thanks,

- Nick

Do you like to keep things fact and context based?

pigoo3
12-24-2013, 01:53 PM
Do you like to keep things fact and context based?

If you're a photography professional (which it appears you are)...you probably know a lot more about color calibration than most of us...and color calibration is probably much more important to you.

All opinons are appreciated. We at Mac-Forums like to keep things friendly and respectful.:)

Thank you,

- Nick

p.s. We are certainly off-topic. If there are any further comments regarding posting style...please send me a PM. Thanks.

dtravis7
12-24-2013, 02:34 PM
I just don't want users here thinking the iMacs display is not accurate as the review shows it is and not just one test either. Some of the displays that we are talking about here earlier cost as much as the iMac. I would HOPE they are accurate! :D Grin

chscag
12-24-2013, 03:42 PM
I can understand where Craig is coming from. As a professional he probably knows more about color correction than most people and since he earns his living that way, he would want the very best in color monitors.

My iMac is great for what I use it for. I can't tell the difference between a monitor which has been color corrected and one that hasn't been anyway. Solitaire looks pretty good on this iMac monitor! :P

Have a Merry Xmas and remember the reason for the season!

pigoo3
12-24-2013, 05:07 PM
Solitaire looks pretty good on this iMac monitor! :P

Ha ha. I remember when you were thinking about (or seriously considering) getting $999 27" Thunderbolt display. Hey...nothings too good or too expensive to play a free solitaire app on!;)

And hey...entertainment is entertainment. Solitaire or the latest first person shooter...both look great on a great display!:)

- Nick

TattooedMac
12-24-2013, 09:38 PM
Colour Calibration = Data Color Spyder . . . Full Stop ;P

Exodist
12-25-2013, 06:14 AM
Wow this debate over something I said.. :-p
Its true the iMacs are not the best displays, then again the NECs cost about 1400 USD. However even ASUS makes a great pre calibrated 27" IPS LED monitor calibrated to 99% of Adobe RGB and 100% sRGB with full CYMK control for 899 USD.
But my post was geared more to the computers hardware side and I wasn't fully thinking about the monitor. That said, most professional photographers that I know of and follow do use iMacs and Mac Pros both for their post processing. So they can't be that bad. They may however lack on the graphics side for professional printing. As that if I am not mistaken requires a separate preset for the monitor. Which is why the Mac Pro was my choice for commercial graphics design (i.e Magazines and such). But for web graphics and general photography. The iMac displays are fine.

Mickyfin
04-20-2014, 03:17 PM
I was just looking on Apples page to buy a new 17" MacBook Pro to replace my dying 2009 17" MBP but Apple no longer sell the 17"??

chscag
04-20-2014, 03:24 PM
That's right, the 17" MacBook Pro was discontinued. However, if you're lucky you may be able to find one in the Apple refurbished store. Also third party resellers still have some in stock that they're advertising. Do some searching and you may be able to find one at a reasonable price.

Mickyfin
04-20-2014, 03:26 PM
That's right, the 17" MacBook Pro was discontinued. However, if you're lucky you may be able to find one in the Apple refurbished store. Also third party resellers still have some in stock that they're advertising. Do some searching and you may be able to find one at a reasonable price.

Thanks, thats exactly what I will do, whats the last 17" MacBook Pro? 2013?

Sod it, will go for an iMac on a desk arm.