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  1. #16
    Say goodbye to 15in Non-retina MBP
    dtravis7's Avatar
    Member Since
    Jan 04, 2005
    Location
    Modesto, Ca.
    Posts
    28,477
    Specs:
    iMac late 2007 10.11.b4, iMac 2008 10.10.5, Macbook2007 10.7.5, Mac Mini 10.7.5, iPhone 3GS Note 8!!
    With so many here going back to the PC Hardware, I wonder what will become of Mac Forums!

    I love the new iPads as far as Tablets go, but most of the new Macs just don't move me at all.

  2. #17
    Say goodbye to 15in Non-retina MBP
    MacDude121's Avatar
    Member Since
    Sep 22, 2010
    Posts
    1,426
    Specs:
    Black MacBook 2.2GHz C2D, 4GB Ram - iMac G4 700MHz, 512MB Ram
    Agree with most of what has been said here, I can't help but feel as though Apple is moving in a direction that I'm just not willing to follow. The word "Pro" should not be a label to any of their computers at this point.

    My friends call it a "$1000 Facebook Machine" and honestly, I don't disagree with them anymore.


    Sorry Apple, I've been saying you needed to clean up your act since the Airs came out and you killed off the White MacBook, I saw this coming from miles away and you know what, I was right. Time to move on.
    -Evan

  3. #18
    Say goodbye to 15in Non-retina MBP

    Member Since
    Nov 09, 2011
    Posts
    251
    Specs:
    15" rMBP Mid-2014 ~ iPad 4 16GB ~ iPhone 6 Plus 16GB
    I tend to disagree with you guys.

    1. Iris is not what discrete used to be, Google for benchmarks and tests, you'll be surprised. Processor speeds have also come down - is this a bad thing? No, sometimes "less" is actually more.
    2. A Retina display is the way of the future. Like it or not, your 52" home TV will also eventually be Retina. For those who prefer CRT, I'm sure you'll still find one somewhere.
    3. Max. out RAM from the start. Okay, it costs a little more, but...so does anything else from Apple.
    4. SSD. Also the way of the future. Apple Care will cover anything that fails and as the rMBPs become more popular, more alternatives will become available. I'm guessing compatibility between rMBPs will be good. When I look at the 13" MBP listed with it's HDD, I for one can't help thinking that I'm looking at a relic.
    5. Pricing has come down, this is a good thing. If I compare what I paid for a mid-2012 MBP with hi-res screen, 8GB RAM and 750GB HDD, I think the stock rMBP at $1,999 is very well-priced, considering the display and SSD.
    6. Unfortunately, change is part of the world, particularly in sectors like these. The traditional PC as we know it, be it desktop or portable is changing. Cue the iPad with a 64-bit processor and we can expect to see a merge of the two sooner rather than later.
    7. I think a Pro user is defined by someone who requires performance, rather than someone who likes to get under the hood. For someone with a non-Pro requirement, but likes to tinker, the 13" MBP remains for now. And for the true Pro, there's the new Mac Pro, which at the size and form factor is actually quite portable.


    Personally, I'd go out and get one now, just difficult to justify with a one-year old MBP15 sitting in my rucksack.

    Anyway, that's my 5 cents'...

  4. #19
    Say goodbye to 15in Non-retina MBP
    dtravis7's Avatar
    Member Since
    Jan 04, 2005
    Location
    Modesto, Ca.
    Posts
    28,477
    Specs:
    iMac late 2007 10.11.b4, iMac 2008 10.10.5, Macbook2007 10.7.5, Mac Mini 10.7.5, iPhone 3GS Note 8!!
    Ok I will bite. What is the RAM that is SOLDERED in dies? You say Ram never dies? I am a computer tech and can show you RAM dying. What if it happens right after Apple care is gone? You have a paperweight! Not everyone can afford Apples prices every 2 years. SSD is the future but this is not a true SSD, small card that is not sold most places. GLUED in battery. Have fun fixing it.

  5. #20
    Say goodbye to 15in Non-retina MBP

    Member Since
    Nov 09, 2011
    Posts
    251
    Specs:
    15" rMBP Mid-2014 ~ iPad 4 16GB ~ iPhone 6 Plus 16GB
    Dennis,

    it's not a matter of biting, I'm putting forward a reasonable argument.

    With Apple Care (which I think is a good idea on products of this type), I would say all parts will be covered for the reasonable part of the product's life.

    Considering electronics, for sure any component can fail. Let's look at it: so can the CPU, GPU, jeez, even a single cap can fail on the board - and I'm not sure that RAM will be more susceptible to failure. Looking at electronics, you typically expect to see a bathtub failure curve, which means that you will be covered for the initial high "infant-mortality" phase and well into the "flat" part of the curve. On the contrary, with a factory-controlled specification, you have less chance of failure. I'm pretty sure Apple studies these statistics quite carefully.

    We design and manufacture electronic systems (using ARM, Microchip) at our company and our most reliable systems by a long way are those designed to be purpose-specific, with no removable components.

    I think that we're used to an old way of doing things and we need to adapt our view (I'm relatively new to Macs, but have been tinkering with PCs since the early '90s).

  6. #21
    Say goodbye to 15in Non-retina MBP
    dtravis7's Avatar
    Member Since
    Jan 04, 2005
    Location
    Modesto, Ca.
    Posts
    28,477
    Specs:
    iMac late 2007 10.11.b4, iMac 2008 10.10.5, Macbook2007 10.7.5, Mac Mini 10.7.5, iPhone 3GS Note 8!!
    Also I make my living fixing computers. Fun stuff when that stops. Oh well.

  7. #22
    Say goodbye to 15in Non-retina MBP

    Member Since
    Nov 09, 2011
    Posts
    251
    Specs:
    15" rMBP Mid-2014 ~ iPad 4 16GB ~ iPhone 6 Plus 16GB
    Hopefully it'll change rather than stop! Repair of boards that do fail out of Apple Care (or due to user fault) may provide opportunity. The chips are smaller and the soldering tools change, but the job can be done. I see local guys repairing phones that I would've thought were fit for retirement.

    Other things like the glued-in battery should also create opportunity...

  8. #23
    Say goodbye to 15in Non-retina MBP

    Member Since
    Oct 19, 2012
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    162
    Specs:
    2012 MBP 15" 2.6 i7 with GT 650M, 16gb ram
    So where can you still get them? I really wanted the glossy hi-res display...

  9. #24
    Say goodbye to 15in Non-retina MBP
    cwa107's Avatar
    Member Since
    Dec 20, 2006
    Location
    Lake Mary, Florida
    Posts
    26,758
    Specs:
    15" MBP, Core i7/2GHz, 8GB RAM, 480GB Crucial M500 SSD
    Quote Originally Posted by Checco View Post
    Dennis,

    it's not a matter of biting, I'm putting forward a reasonable argument.

    With Apple Care (which I think is a good idea on products of this type), I would say all parts will be covered for the reasonable part of the product's life.

    Considering electronics, for sure any component can fail. Let's look at it: so can the CPU, GPU, jeez, even a single cap can fail on the board - and I'm not sure that RAM will be more susceptible to failure. Looking at electronics, you typically expect to see a bathtub failure curve, which means that you will be covered for the initial high "infant-mortality" phase and well into the "flat" part of the curve. On the contrary, with a factory-controlled specification, you have less chance of failure. I'm pretty sure Apple studies these statistics quite carefully.

    We design and manufacture electronic systems (using ARM, Microchip) at our company and our most reliable systems by a long way are those designed to be purpose-specific, with no removable components.

    I think that we're used to an old way of doing things and we need to adapt our view (I'm relatively new to Macs, but have been tinkering with PCs since the early '90s).
    I agree with most of your arguments but not your overall premise, consider this....

    All of these compromises are made to achieve a hair thinner form-factor, which I can guarantee you that few true professionals care about. That is the only net benefit - well, that and ensuring a shorter overall service life, which pads Apple's already fat bottom line.

    I object to paying more money for a less serviceable machine. Period.
    Liquid and computers don't mix. It might seem simple, but we see an incredible amount of people post here about spills. Keep drinks and other liquids away from your expensive electronics!

    https://youtu.be/KHZ8ek-6ccc

  10. #25
    Say goodbye to 15in Non-retina MBP
    V6Pony's Avatar
    Member Since
    Oct 30, 2010
    Location
    Southern Illinois
    Posts
    273
    Specs:
    MBP 15" I7 first one and loving it.
    I think I could change hardware with no problem. I certainly like to tinker with everything and don't go along with the new Apple MBP. But God I love OS X it's just the best. Not sure it can be replaced. I would go with some form of linux or bsd I guess. Just not sure what would make me happy in a OS. I have a 2010 MBP I7 core. So I'm good for a bit. Perhaps some option will show up in the next year or so. As it stands now I just can't see tossing down $2700 to replace my MBP that has a limited life.

    I'm very sad about the options Apple has left me.

  11. #26
    Say goodbye to 15in Non-retina MBP
    dtravis7's Avatar
    Member Since
    Jan 04, 2005
    Location
    Modesto, Ca.
    Posts
    28,477
    Specs:
    iMac late 2007 10.11.b4, iMac 2008 10.10.5, Macbook2007 10.7.5, Mac Mini 10.7.5, iPhone 3GS Note 8!!
    V6Pony, I 100% agree with you on OSX. There is nothing out there that can truly replace it for me. That is what makes this all so hard.

  12. #27
    Say goodbye to 15in Non-retina MBP
    iggibar's Avatar
    Member Since
    Apr 20, 2009
    Location
    C-Town
    Posts
    4,071
    Specs:
    Mac Pro 4.1 15" MBP. 13" MBP. 17" PB. Power Mac G5. Galaxy Note 4 160gb*
    As long as my 15" is alive and kicking, I won't have to say goodbye to anything.
    “If you are distressed by anything external, the pain is not due to the thing itself but to your own estimate of it; and this you have the power to revoke at any moment.” Marcus Aurelius

  13. #28
    Say goodbye to 15in Non-retina MBP
    V6Pony's Avatar
    Member Since
    Oct 30, 2010
    Location
    Southern Illinois
    Posts
    273
    Specs:
    MBP 15" I7 first one and loving it.
    Quote Originally Posted by dtravis7 View Post
    V6Pony, I 100% agree with you on OSX. There is nothing out there that can truly replace it for me. That is what makes this all so hard.
    I have heard there is a version of linux that is trying to be like OS X. But that is all I know at this point. I think OS X is based on Darwin BSD. I would like to find a close version.

  14. #29
    Say goodbye to 15in Non-retina MBP
    osxx's Avatar
    Member Since
    Jan 19, 2008
    Location
    houston texas
    Posts
    4,695
    Specs:
    09 MBP 8GB ram 500GB HD OS 10.9 32B iPad 4 32GB iPhone 5 iOs7 2TB TC Apple TV3
    My major complaint is you can only get Apple Care for 3yrs and it is technically no-user upgradeable or repairable thats a lot of money for a 3 yr guarantee they either need to drop the price a lot more ,include Apple Care or extend it to 4yr.

  15. #30
    Say goodbye to 15in Non-retina MBP
    MYmacROX's Avatar
    Member Since
    Mar 17, 2009
    Posts
    3,626
    Specs:
    2008 15" MBP Yosemite, 2012 21.5" iMac Yosemite
    I agree with most of what's been said about phasing out 15" non-retina MBP. It was the first thing I thought of last night when watching the video and initially I was sorely disappointed.

    HOWEVER... the people I see having a true dilemma are the pros who need the power machines. Good points have been brought up about repair and upgrading RAM and internal storage. Maybe many of those individuals will move away from Apple notebooks. Time will tell.

    Most average users will be able to get by with a MBA once prices and specs and tech adjust in the next couple of yrs. **Moore's law** Also, someone like myself won't even need a notebook 5 yrs from now The iPad will keep getting better and iCloud functionality will improve. My iMac will be my main storage hub and my iPad will be my point of access. Everything is saved to the cloud and synced to my iMac. More affordable than a new MBP.

    Well, that's just my take and I could be missing a few things. I'm no expert. It's just how I see things progressing in the next half decade. *shrug*
    64GB iPhone 6, 64GB iPad Air 2.

    Reminder: Please include your Mac's specs. This will make it much easier for the other members to assist you.

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